Travelpower can someone explain?

[Matt&Jo]

Okay so ive looked online at betamarines travel power thingy and hear people swear by it or dispise it.....

Can someone tell me the pros and cons from first hand use not the gumf i read in a glossy brochure style website.

If possible

Costs of unit aprox to buy install and run

Benefits

Negatives

Worrys/reasons not to buy?

 

Thanks all just getting my head around all the battery charging options.

[Chewbacka]

I decided not to have a travel power when getting our boat, we went for 2 big alternators feeding a 2.5kW inverter (as well as the little kubota alternator for engine start battery charging), that way we can have full power with the engine running or not, with a travel power you still need an inverter, so seems expensive for what it is. 

[cereal tiller]

2 minutes ago, Chewbacka said:

I decided not to have a travel power when getting our boat, we went for 2 big alternators feeding a 2.5kW inverter (as well as the little kubota alternator for engine start battery charging), that way we can have full power with the engine running or not, with a travel power you still need an inverter, so seems expensive for what it is. 

+1,2 75 AMP. alternators and a 3.KW Inverter does everything necessary,and if one or both should fail they are usually easy to source and cheap to replace.

The Travelpower is expensive to repair and usually means considerable Down time.

[Stormbringer]

I love mine 

I can run washing machine whilst cruising. Run engine for less time when charging batteries, same for getting hot water..use big power tools when out on the cut without hammering the batteries...

It came fitted to the boat...but I'm not sure I would cough up for a new one , I don't think they are cheap!

1 minute ago, cereal tiller said:

+1,2 75 AMP. alternators and a 3.KW Inverter does everything necessary,and if one or both should fail they are usually easy to source and cheap to replace.

The Travelpower is expensive to repair and usually means considerable Down time.

This is probably what I would do, for the exact reasons CT has stated here 

[dmr]

We have a TP and love it. Abundant 230volt available whenever the engine is running and totally separate to the 12volt charging system. Appears very reliable though we have the older model which is probably the better one.

With modern inverters and big alternators its now a closer run thing between the TP and a big inverter. I think for a 24volt boat the big inverter would be the way to go. For a 12volt boat its less clear, I suggest for an off grid liveaboard the TP and a fairly big inverter would offer some usefull redundancy (a good thing) whilst for a leisure boat a very big inverter would probably be the way to go.

The TP alternator itself works at a high voltage so is very efficient. Taking equivalent power out of a 12volt alternator will result in it getting quite hot, and also require some very thick cables, will also hammer the batteries if you run the big inverter without the engine running.

.............Dave

[Matt&Jo]

So let me get this straight.... as per normal you get your standard alternator plus on most engines these days you get a seperate alternator for leisure battery charging correct?

This however as i understand it would not be enough to cover a washing machine for eg or even a hairdryer for any length of time? and it would desimate your battery's....

So travel power is an aditional alternator/generator? Over and top of your standard twin alternators?.......sorry if im confuzling this up ive never heard of it before yest.........

I was looking at a honda etc type generator to run on the towpath to boost power and to provide the juice for washing machine and and power tools i may need to use. Fuel storage is a concern for me however but travel power can only be used when underway or just when the engine is running?

[Alan de Enfield]

11 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

but travel power can only be used when underway or just when the engine is running?

Either

1) Underway (the engine will be running)

2) Engine running but boat not moving.

[Robbo]

Think of a travelpower as just a alternator that delivers AC power.   You’ll need a battery charger to charge the batteries (a high amp one makes better sense).

Large DC alternators have a disadvantage as they get big at 12v, but 150amp should be large enough for most situations.  You’ll also need a inverter to run AC stuff of course.

If it was me it would depend on what Equipment I already had and if I needed to run high wattage AC stuff, etc.

 

edit, to remove incorrect info about inverter 

Edited July 15, 2017 by Robbo

[dmr]

3 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

So let me get this straight.... as per normal you get your standard alternator plus on most engines these days you get a seperate alternator for leisure battery charging correct?

This however as i understand it would not be enough to cover a washing machine for eg or even a hairdryer for any length of time? and it would desimate your battery's....

So travel power is an aditional alternator/generator? Over and top of your standard twin alternators?.......sorry if im confuzling this up ive never heard of it before yest.........

I was looking at a honda etc type generator to run on the towpath to boost power and to provide the juice for washing machine and and power tools i may need to use. Fuel storage is a concern for me however but travel power can only be used when underway or just when the engine is running?

Yes, the TP is a totally separate third alternator, rewound to produce a higher voltage, maybe 150 to 200, which is fed into its own dedicated "inverter". Its not a standard inverter because it does not need to increase the voltage, only convert it to 230volts 50Hz. The high voltage makes it much more efficient than a 12volt system.

A 175 amp second (domestic) alternator could maybe produce 150 amps continuously, this would be about 2kWatt so could just about drive a washing machine heater or hairdrier but that would leave nothing to charge the batteries whilst working that hard. The "starter" alternator can maybe produce 40amps continously and with a bit of technology this can be added to the domestic alternator output.

TP works whenever the engine is running but it will need to be well above tickover to produce full power such as to drive a hairdrier. Petrol on boats is not good but lots of people do it.

............Dave

[Alan de Enfield]

I wanted a TP fitted but dealers refused to install claiming that our 29hp engine was too small, to power the TP and propel the boat.

[Robbo]

Of course a washing machine doesn’t have the heater on for great periods, so whilst your running the engine to run the machine for the majority of time it will be charging the batteries.

IMHO if you already have a decent inverter to cope with your high wattage items, the high amp DC alternator is better value for money.

Edited July 15, 2017 by Robbo

[dmr]

Just for general interest, If I was designing a new liveaboard boat I would probably go for something like a 70 amp starter alternator and two big (175amp) domestic alternators plus a big inverter. Trouble is this is non standard and might even need a custom alternator controller producing , but thats the sort of stuff that I like doing.

................Dave

 

[Robbo]

1 minute ago, dmr said:

Just for general interest, If I was designing a new liveaboard boat I would probably go for something like a 70 amp starter alternator and two big (175amp) domestic alternators plus a big inverter. Trouble is this is non standard and might even need a custom alternator controller producing , but thats the sort of stuff that I like doing.

................Dave

 

Would you really need two large 175amp alternators?  It’s a hell of a lot of amps and if your using that much amps for long periods of time then a separate genny is a better solution.  One should be good enough for running washing machines and the like, even if every now and again the amps used will dip into the batteries.

[cereal tiller]

11 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I wanted a TP fitted but dealers refused to install claiming that our 29hp engine was too small, to power the TP and propel the boat.

Have spoken to Boaters on more than one occasion  who say that a TP will stall their engine at Tickover when heating Washing Machine Water

[Alan de Enfield]

14 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

I wanted a TP fitted but dealers refused to install claiming that our 29hp engine was too small, to power the TP and propel the boat.

 

1 minute ago, cereal tiller said:

Have spoken to Boaters on more than one occasion  who say that a TP will stall their engine at Tickover when heating Washing Machine Water

I just think that folks should be aware it is not 'the answer' for all boats/all applications.

[Matt&Jo]

Great info guys as always. It sounds like a nice option........

[OldGoat]

 

9 minutes ago, Matt&Jo said:

Great info guys as always. It sounds like a nice option........

I assume you are looking at a new build. Taking 3Kw from batteries is a huge ask with no losses that's at least 250 amps at 12v - which is a huge. It needs large cables and LOTS of batteries. Anyone still going down that route would be best advised to have a 24v battery bank. You get a better quality of alternator as they are designed for truck and bus use which implies continuous running at full or near full power.

You mention a washing machine, but what about anything else:-

• Microwave
• Toaster
• hair dryer ?????

I would go for a

• Beta 50 Hp engine (possibly)
• 5KW Travel Power
• 24v battery bank
• 24v alternator - say 75 amps
• a smaller - say 1.5Kw - inverter or even a combi - to power the smaller appliances 

Folks in general spend loadsa money on other fittings, posh bathrooms, grand sinks et cetera - but skimp on the bits they can't see.

It's stupid!

[dmr]

47 minutes ago, cereal tiller said:

Have spoken to Boaters on more than one occasion  who say that a TP will stall their engine at Tickover when heating Washing Machine Water

This is probably true. We've got a JD3 which is a big high torque engine but a couple of weeks ago when pushing into Liverpool through all the weeds and water lilies with the washing machine heating it was just on the edge of "black smoke". Very satisfying exhaust note though.

..............Dave

1 hour ago, Robbo said:

Would you really need two large 175amp alternators?  It’s a hell of a lot of amps and if your using that much amps for long periods of time then a separate genny is a better solution.  One should be good enough for running washing machines and the like, even if every now and again the amps used will dip into the batteries.

Probably a bit over the top but I do everything off the engine, don't want a genny. For winter battery charging I always run the immersion heater to help the engine to warm up quickly so that would take most of the power from one alternator.

..............Dave

[BruceinSanity]

Our 175A alternator + 3kW inverter runs the washing machine with just a few amps to spare (Beta43), so no need for a TP, one less thing to go wrong. We preload the washing machine with hot water to save caning the alt driving the washing machine heater for more than a couple of minutes, mind.

[mrsmelly]

Ok so you have had lots of replies and as always some from people who havnt even got one which always makes me giggle. My twopenneth. I am on my second boat with travel power. First boat was run by beta 43 was old type tp with black box was awesome and never went wrong was ten years old when I sold.

This boat is now ten years old again full time liveaboard off grid, its the newer silver box version. I shall explain why they are simply fantastic. You have one standard 12 volt alt charging starter battery and another as normal charging leisure batteries. The third is to produce yer mains lets call it. Some peeps run huge 12 volts alts thro a large inverter and whilst washing machine vacuum etc is on nowt is left to charge leisure bank and its a hell of a power draw whilst in operation. With tp whilst the engine again is running you can move the boat, get tank of hot water and charge both battery banks at the same time. No it doesn't bloomin stall, mine is on bog standard Isuzu 42 and all works at or slightly above tickover. So on a typical day two hours will charge leisure bank at same time as giving 3.5 kw to run washer and say vac at same time and move if you so wish. They work independently of any inverter so if you don't want an inverter you DO NOT have to have one, my tp works when inverter is isolated or when combined can run in conjunction with the inverter it depends how the boat is wired. This one is still going strong and I aint ever going down a huge alternator type road. There you go that's the reality 8 liveaboard boats in 28 years but you can always listen to someone who has " a mate " with one..................no offence meant to anyone in particular

[WotEver]

38 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

you can always listen to someone who has " a mate " with one..................

I have a mate

He doesn't have a TP though, nor even a boat. 

He says...

[mrsmelly]

9 minutes ago, WotEver said:

I have a mate

He doesn't have a TP though, nor even a boat. 

He says...

I havnt got any mates..................not suprising realy

[dmr]

57 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

Ok so you have had lots of replies and as always some from people who havnt even got one which always makes me giggle. My twopenneth. I am on my second boat with travel power. First boat was run by beta 43 was old type tp with black box was awesome and never went wrong was ten years old when I sold.

This boat is now ten years old again full time liveaboard off grid, its the newer silver box version. I shall explain why they are simply fantastic. You have one standard 12 volt alt charging starter battery and another as normal charging leisure batteries. The third is to produce yer mains lets call it. Some peeps run huge 12 volts alts thro a large inverter and whilst washing machine vacuum etc is on nowt is left to charge leisure bank and its a hell of a power draw whilst in operation. With tp whilst the engine again is running you can move the boat, get tank of hot water and charge both battery banks at the same time. No it doesn't bloomin stall, mine is on bog standard Isuzu 42 and all works at or slightly above tickover. So on a typical day two hours will charge leisure bank at same time as giving 3.5 kw to run washer and say vac at same time and move if you so wish. They work independently of any inverter so if you don't want an inverter you DO NOT have to have one, my tp works when inverter is isolated or when combined can run in conjunction with the inverter it depends how the boat is wired. This one is still going strong and I aint ever going down a huge alternator type road. There you go that's the reality 8 liveaboard boats in 28 years but you can always listen to someone who has " a mate " with one..................no offence meant to anyone in particular

I still suspect that a big washing machine heater could give problems to a small engine fitted with a TtravelPower but I have no first hand experience of this cus Ive got a big engine. This is of course is actually a big advantage of the TP, you can get the engine running and warmed up and maybe put a few revs on before you turn the washing machine on. If you fit a huge alternator to drive the washing machine then this will produce its full output (into the batteries) as soon as the engine starts. I have heard that a few folk have a switch to turn the alternator off if they need every last bit of power to get up a river.

On the reliability issue I have lived with a TP for just over ten years, Its never switched off so just makes mains as soon as the engine starts. Its failed once but that was due to my lack of routine maintenance. Coxs have the parts in stock and fix them quickly, but you do pay a realistic price for their expertise.

We have had only one liveaboard boat in ten years....got it right first time

..............Dave

[cereal tiller]

1 hour ago, mrsmelly said:

Ok so you have had lots of replies and as always some from people who havnt even got one which always makes me giggle. My twopenneth. I am on my second boat with travel power. First boat was run by beta 43 was old type tp with black box was awesome and never went wrong was ten years old when I sold.

This boat is now ten years old again full time liveaboard off grid, its the newer silver box version. I shall explain why they are simply fantastic. You have one standard 12 volt alt charging starter battery and another as normal charging leisure batteries. The third is to produce yer mains lets call it. Some peeps run huge 12 volts alts thro a large inverter and whilst washing machine vacuum etc is on nowt is left to charge leisure bank and its a hell of a power draw whilst in operation. With tp whilst the engine again is running you can move the boat, get tank of hot water and charge both battery banks at the same time. No it doesn't bloomin stall, mine is on bog standard Isuzu 42 and all works at or slightly above tickover. So on a typical day two hours will charge leisure bank at same time as giving 3.5 kw to run washer and say vac at same time and move if you so wish. They work independently of any inverter so if you don't want an inverter you DO NOT have to have one, my tp works when inverter is isolated or when combined can run in conjunction with the inverter it depends how the boat is wired. This one is still going strong and I aint ever going down a huge alternator type road. There you go that's the reality 8 liveaboard boats in 28 years but you can always listen to someone who has " a mate " with one..................no offence meant to anyone in particular

Your new initiative of not offending anyone is Commendable Tim.most certainly a bold and brave step. I have installed a few TP'S on Winnebago's in the past so I do have experience of them.I also have 'Mates'.

[mrsmelly]

14 minutes ago, dmr said:

I still suspect that a big washing machine heater could give problems to a small engine fitted with a TtravelPower but I have no first hand experience of this cus Ive got a big engine. This is of course is actually a big advantage of the TP, you can get the engine running and warmed up and maybe put a few revs on before you turn the washing machine on. If you fit a huge alternator to drive the washing machine then this will produce its full output (into the batteries) as soon as the engine starts. I have heard that a few folk have a switch to turn the alternator off if they need every last bit of power to get up a river.

On the reliability issue I have lived with a TP for just over ten years, Its never switched off so just makes mains as soon as the engine starts. Its failed once but that was due to my lack of routine maintenance. Coxs have the parts in stock and fix them quickly, but you do pay a realistic price for their expertise.

We have had only one liveaboard boat in ten years....got it right first time

..............Dave

Hi Dave

 

Err rotine maintainance?  Ive had no problems YET!! I know of coxs for when it goes tits up but what routine stuff do you recommend? cheers