Crew number plate

[jddevel]

I am aware that the BSS requires a plate fixed to the hull indicating the maximum number of "crew" a craft is allowed to have aboard. How is this either established or who authorizes it. It`s a sailaway. Thanks in anticipation.

[ditchcrawler]

1 minute ago, jddevel said:

I am aware that the BSS requires a plate fixed to the hull indicating the maximum number of "crew" a craft is allowed to have aboard. How is this either established or who authorizes it. It`s a sailaway. Thanks in anticipation.

No it dosent

[Giant]

That isn't a BSS requirement. I think you're thinking of some standard related to the EU Recreational Craft Directive (RCD).

[Paladine]

There was a  BSS consultation relating to hire boats, in which this was mentioned. On the Broads, it is a licensing requirement for hire craft to display the maximum number of persons allowed on board. It may be the same on the canals, but, as it seems that canal boats do not capsize, it may only relate to other sorts of hire boats. 

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, jddevel said:

I am aware that the BSS requires a plate fixed to the hull indicating the maximum number of "crew" a craft is allowed to have aboard. How is this either established or who authorizes it. It`s a sailaway. Thanks in anticipation.

It is an RCD requirement, not a BSS requirement.

All part of the 'fun' of doing your own 'build'.

You need to have stability tests undertaken by an approved 'test house' (for RCD compliance the boat will need to be assessed against the ISO 12217 Standard on Stability and Buoyancy) who will then issue you with "Stability Booklet" and you can then work out what crew / load you can carry, using the 'average crew member weight' as specified in the RCD documentation.

Edited March 18, 2017 by Alan de Enfield

[Paladine]

But there is an exemption from compliance with the RCD for "watercraft built for own use, provided it is not subsequently placed on the Community market during a period of five years;"  (source)

[nicknorman]

2 minutes ago, Paladine said:

But there is an exemption from compliance with the RCD for "watercraft built for own use, provided it is not subsequently placed on the Community market during a period of five years;"  (source)

True, but it means you are building a craft that has zero resale value. Fine if your life goes according to plan, less fine if things take an unexpected turn and you need to sell the boat and get some money back. Even after the 5 years is up, as a purchaser would you rather buy a boat that was certified to the RCD, or one that was built to no particular standard?

[mrsmelly]

19 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

True, but it means you are building a craft that has zero resale value. Fine if your life goes according to plan, less fine if things take an unexpected turn and you need to sell the boat and get some money back. Even after the 5 years is up, as a purchaser would you rather buy a boat that was certified to the RCD, or one that was built to no particular standard?

In reality though Nick it doesnt matter. I bought my last boat knowing it had no RCD its irrelevant in the real world and I sold the boat very very quickly to a bloke who also didnt give a hoot and for full market value as if it had the said RCD paperwork. People realy only ever ask for BSS. This boat Has all the relevant bits of paper with it but I didnt even ask about RCD it just happened to turn up with the paperwork after the sale had gone through.

[nicknorman]

38 minutes ago, mrsmelly said:

In reality though Nick it doesnt matter. I bought my last boat knowing it had no RCD its irrelevant in the real world and I sold the boat very very quickly to a bloke who also didnt give a hoot and for full market value as if it had the said RCD paperwork. People realy only ever ask for BSS. This boat Has all the relevant bits of paper with it but I didnt even ask about RCD it just happened to turn up with the paperwork after the sale had gone through.

Maybe it doesn't matter after 5 years, it will depend on the buyer - although by that definition you are perhaps reducing the pool of possible buyers. Before 5 years you are committing a criminal offence if you sell and whilst you might well not get prosecuted, it surely leaves you vulnerable if the new owner became dissatisfied in any way.

[jddevel]

Thank you for your helpful responses. Regarding the RCD my optimistic view is as follows.

1) I own and live long enough to enjoy my boat leaving its sale to my children

2)Once finally out of the EU we view our own countries democratic legislation as important and their "interference" goes into history as an experiment by a few that became adopted by the many. -I consider the Scottish aspirations in the same way- the average person hadn`t thought about it until the few thought they`d like it to happen. If you throw enough mud at the wall some of its going to stick and then can grow.

3) Having suffered the financial ups and downs of the last 50 years recessions and booms I`m resigned and have built into my future requirements a potential capital/monetary loss. Some might say I`m lucky. I say it`s the result of 40 plus years of self-employment working virtually six and a half days a week perhaps 50 plus weeks a year ( I`ve certainly frequently worked such days as Boxing Day) 

Rant over and thank you for your patience

[mrsmelly]

18 minutes ago, jddevel said:

Thank you for your helpful responses. Regarding the RCD my optimistic view is as follows.

1) I own and live long enough to enjoy my boat leaving its sale to my children

2)Once finally out of the EU we view our own countries democratic legislation as important and their "interference" goes into history as an experiment by a few that became adopted by the many. -I consider the Scottish aspirations in the same way- the average person hadn`t thought about it until the few thought they`d like it to happen. If you throw enough mud at the wall some of its going to stick and then can grow.

3) Having suffered the financial ups and downs of the last 50 years recessions and booms I`m resigned and have built into my future requirements a potential capital/monetary loss. Some might say I`m lucky. I say it`s the result of 40 plus years of self-employment working virtually six and a half days a week perhaps 50 plus weeks a year ( I`ve certainly frequently worked such days as Boxing Day) 

Rant over and thank you for your patience

I like this post 

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, jddevel said:

I own and live long enough to enjoy my boat leaving its sale to my children

In which case, save yourself £1000s, time, trouble and heartache and just build it how you want.

Ensure you meet the minimalistic requirements of the BSS and Roberts is your mothers brother.

[mrsmelly]

2 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

In which case, save yourself £1000s, time, trouble and heartache and just build it how you want.

Ensure you meet the minimalistic requirements of the BSS and Roberts is your mothers brother.

Completely agree and to add that when you build it you will likely be using a standard shell as is the norm with the usual engines supplied today and equipment etc etc that is identical to the equipment on boats that have RCD compliance.

[dmr]

Some first time buyers do require all the paperwork to be in order, there have even been new members on this forum asking for advice about solicitors to handle the transaction. Many people who are already familiar with boats, and quite a few first time buyers, will be much more interested in the quality of the boat than the quality of the paperwork.

Time for a joke, originally applied to a big state owned car manufacturer in Birmingham but could maybe apply to boat building within the European union.

In 1000 years time archaeologists excavate the site of an old factory and try to work out what it was all about, after much study they conclude it was some sort of paper mill with a sideline in making cars.

...............Dave

 

[cuthound]

Indeed when I was working for BT at the time it was obtaining BS5750/ISO9000, I remember passing a BS5750 registered car radio fitting business which operated from a railway arch.

I commented to a colleague that the arch wouldn't be big enough to hold the quality processes for our part of the business let alone for the whole of BT 

[Tony Brooks]

BS 5750 - A bull shine attempt to hoodwink the public that your products were quality items when in fact it only proved your quality control systems ensured that you produced the level of crap that you set out to.

Once the BS mark meant something. 5750 ended that for me.

[dor]

Mine was done by the surveyor overseeing my build and who prepared the RCD documentation.  It involved have a number of people (average 75kg I think) standing on the gunwale and checking that there was no more than 7 degrees list.  I'm covered for six people.

What I wonder is how the hire day boats manage to be licensed for twelve people on a 25ft boat.

[WotEver]

9 minutes ago, dor said:

What I wonder is how the hire day boats manage to be licensed for twelve people on a 25ft boat.

All on the same side wearing pirate hats and with a can of lager in their hands. 

[Phil Ambrose]

47 minutes ago, WotEver said:

All on the same side wearing pirate hats and with a can of lager in their hands. 

so you've been on the Broads too.

Phil

[jddevel]

Reference paper work. I recall a item years ago on the radio about some one as a new employee in an office whose initial work involved checking - I seem to recall invoices or some sort of production sheets. On completion of the check amongst other things they were told to add a small circle to the top of the page. After a while the employee queried the reason for the circle. No one seemed to know other than to say they`d always done it. This led to some detective work. Apparently the result was years earlier it was  to indicate how many air raids had taken place that day!!!!!!!

[ditchcrawler]

8 hours ago, dor said:

Mine was done by the surveyor overseeing my build and who prepared the RCD documentation.  It involved have a number of people (average 75kg I think) standing on the gunwale and checking that there was no more than 7 degrees list.  I'm covered for six people.

What I wonder is how the hire day boats manage to be licensed for twelve people on a 25ft boat.

I can answer that. I was at Fox boats one day and they were recruiting people to load the boat, each one was weighed before getting on the boat and all seated down one side while the angle of heal was measured using an Ipad, it was quite an alarming experience sitting in one side of such a small boat as more people boarded and then sat on the same side.