tow vehicle

[bizzard]

Nothing should go wrong as long as the combo is driven dead slow on only up grades or on the level. Any down grades it might need extra braking power to be on the safe side, like another vehicle chained to the trailers rear. Or someone standing by with satchel full of bricks to chuck under the trailer wheels.

[Athy]

A vehicle with a transfer reduction box like a Land Rover, Subaru Forester ect should do it comfortably.

Yes, I was going to suggest a Forester as it does have a low-gear box (or whatever they're called). A traction engine would also do the job, but they are not as common!

 

This troubles me.

Why? I assume that it's because reverse gears are in general lower than forward gears. Have you never seen an old car going up a hill backwards because it couldn't make it in forward gear?

[Paul C]

 

Why? I assume that it's because reverse gears are in general lower than forward gears. Have you never seen an old car going up a hill backwards because it couldn't make it in forward gear?

 

We're talking about tractors, they're designed to tow heavy loads forwards and have a hitch designed to do this. Gearing is meaningless, most tractors have the same ratios forwards and backwards. There's an argument for a tow from the front (ie backwards coming out, forwards launching the boat) for visibility reasons but it would need to be done from a suitable hitch - most tractors don't have a suitable front hitch for that weight, its normally too high but there's options etc.

[Athy]

 

We're talking about tractors, they're designed to tow heavy loads forwards and have a hitch designed to do this. Gearing is meaningless, most tractors have the same ratios forwards and backwards. There's an argument for a tow from the front (ie backwards coming out, forwards launching the boat) for visibility reasons but it would need to be done from a suitable hitch - most tractors don't have a suitable front hitch for that weight, its normally too high but there's options etc.

O.K., thanks for explaining that.

[bizzard]

It could be done the ancient Egyptian way. For that weight I'd say it'd need 203 nubian slaves pulling on a rope to have it up and out.

[nebulae]

If you look on utube you will see many cases of tractors rearing under load. This is usualy because the operator has attached the tow to the top link mount,in order to increase traction.This is ideal for those with good life insurance .If the front trolley imposes a downward load,then for a Land Rover,I would not have a greater nose weight than 750kg.We sometimes excede this by a bit with a 3,500kg trailer,but not recomended. All our Land Rovers are fitted with a front winch,some more powerfull than others. I would probably go for winching out. Make sure somebody is in the vehicle holding the brakes,the engine running and nobody where they can be hurt with a snapping winch wire. A disco with a winch is probably your best bet,but dont underestimate the cost of running a secondhand Disco.We have had some bad experiences.

[Murflynn]

A disco with a winch is probably your best bet,but dont underestimate the cost of running a secondhand Disco.We have had some bad experiences.

we ran a fleet of 60 discos on a big project in Turkey, 2002 models, diesel automatic.

 

 

.............. what a load of crap. a goodly proportion had major faults even before they had 4 figures (km) on the clock.

 

a toyota hilux is miles better.

[Neil Smith]

The best tow vehicle I ever had was a 4.2 litre turbo diesel landcruiser, in low range 1st gear it pulled an artic out of a gravel trap, and so reliable even with 250,000 miles on the clock.

 

Neil

[Jak]

Nah! Best ever was my 90s 4.6v8. Disco auto. Hell of a tow car. But never tried something like this. I'd agree a tractor is best!

[Paul C]

Best ever tow vehicle I've driven is a John Deere 6800 series. Of course, there's different kinds of towing. Pulling a 15ton unbraked trailer up a slope is vastly different to cruising along the motorway at 60mph with a 2 ton car trailer, for example.

[Jak]

Yes Paul. Agreed. Disco works very well in your second example!

[roland elsdon]

Yep know what you mean about discos. Terrible . Bought mine at 200000 Kms, sold at 260000, serviced it myself, ( simple) had to buy a special tool for the oil plug ( $15.00) and a turbo hose ( posted from uk) and pop rivets to replace the gearbox selector cover. Shockingly unreliable considering it did most of its life on gravel roads.

[Murflynn]

look, if you're going to get technical, the best tow vehicle I have ever driven is a CAT594 pipelayer. D9 chassis and mechanics with an extra few tonnes of ballast counterweight. gross running weight :123,600lbs.

[sandgrown]

we ran a fleet of 60 discos on a big project in Turkey, 2002 models, diesel automatic.

 

 

.............. what a load of crap. a goodly proportion had major faults even before they had 4 figures (km) on the clock.

a toyota hilux is miles better.

Yes i have noticed the Taliban don't seem to use Landrovers to mount their rocket launchers Hilux every time.

Edited December 18, 2016 by sandgrown

[Paul C]

look, if you're going to get technical, the best tow vehicle I have ever driven is a CAT594 pipelayer. D9 chassis and mechanics with an extra few tonnes of ballast counterweight. gross running weight :123,600lbs.

 

Indeed it would be formidable at towing. BUT there's a balance to be struck somewhere. I imagine that 60t or so has a marked effect on soil compaction it passes over, where a lighter tractor would not be such an issue. And of course its fuel consumption, and other running costs too - which could be countered by an increased workrate depending on the task in hand. Basically there's a whole science towards "what's the best tractor" for a given job, of course accepting that to be able to safely do the job is a minimum requirement.

[Arthur Brown]

I suspect that your club's "1 machine man and one crew" ruling is in deference to the skill actually needed to pull heavy loads up hill and place them accurately and safely on land. They will not want boats left on the trailer, so shifting the boat onto blocks is a skill also needed. Do you intend to leave the boat on your trailer? Sadly youtube is a tribute to several boat and pickup truck vs slipway failures

 

[jonathanA]

Borrow a tractor, but remember to pull it out with the tractor going backwards up the ramp.

I'm not convinced I've yet to see a farmer doing this...and round here there are some big tractors and big trailers

 

In terms of possible cars I've run a lwb shogun and land rover defender 110 for many years (over 10) guess which one I've let go ... the shogun is vastly more reliable more manoeuvrable more comfortable more economical but I always worried less about basing the body work on the 110

 

Reckon either would pull your trailer but I'd be worried about the tow hitch parting company and I wouldn't be using a 50 mm ball hitch

Edited December 18, 2016 by jonathanA

[Arthur Brown]

LONG gone are the days when reverse gear was lower than first, With modern tractors, the tow hitch is behind the driver, so tow forwards. What is the surface of and above the ramp? Road tyres will stick to road surface but grass and soft surface will do better with wide soft knobbly tyres.

[Canal Cuttings]

All this talk of tractors seems irrelevant as:

 

 

the club will not let me have any other vehicle than my road car

Maybe he should change his club, not his car?

[RD1]

The problem you have with a direct tow is inertia, you have over 17 tonne to start rolling from a standstill, with nothing to take out the shock, you could try an inertia tow rope that will have some stretch so you can get it into very low gear without slipping the clutch all the time.

But... these ropes do snap, so you would need a substantial rope. Also when doing 4x4 recovery, they don't use the standard 3.5 ton tow ball, that can shear too.

 

I think a winch from a stationary vehicle is the way to go, Engage 4 wheel drive low, handbrake on, then all 4 wheels should be braked, foot hovering on brake pedal to be sure lol.

Chock all wheels, maybe have a couple of back up vehicles tethered to the rear.

 

The local 4x4 group could do this quite easily.

 

Caution.

Things can go wrong, people can get hurt or even killed by snapping winch cables and straps, and sitting in an open tractor say, and the driver is a target for flying debris, I would want a sudstantial cage behind me if I was driving that tractor.

 

If you want your own vehicle, then in my opinion, a powerful winch is essential, but not all chassis can take this force.

 

So what is next stage, vehicle is still on ramp, no brakes on trailer, you now need to chock the wheels on the trailer... before moving the vehicle back and then continue with the winch.

Now thinking ahead, how are you going to return this lot into the water? It might need direct connection trailer to vehcle, on my Ford Maverick, Nissan Terrano in disguise, I have a front mounted tow bar, it makes launching our 2 tonne boat and trailer a doddle.

 

These are only my experiences or ideas, you need to do your own risk assessment based on equipment, training and experience of personnel, risk to property and risk to other bystanders etc.

It does not surprise me that the club wouldn't take responsibility, and insuring such an operation... no chance.

 

I am fairly sure it will all go to plan, first time, but whilst there is always this risk, however small, you must really plan it well.

Edited December 19, 2016 by RD1

[Murflynn]

 

 

Indeed it would be formidable at towing. BUT there's a balance to be struck somewhere. I imagine that 60t or so has a marked effect on soil compaction it passes over, where a lighter tractor would not be such an issue. And of course its fuel consumption, and other running costs too - which could be countered by an increased workrate depending on the task in hand. Basically there's a whole science towards "what's the best tractor" for a given job, of course accepting that to be able to safely do the job is a minimum requirement.

you might not want to buy one either - used ones go for about $250K.

Edited December 19, 2016 by Murflynn

[FadeToScarlet]

And if tractors don't have enough heft...

 

[Jess--]

Tractor would be best.

 

But if you wanted a vehicle that could do it on the odd occasion; Providing the weight of the boat/trailer is not directly transferred to the vehicle, you could do it with a large 4x4 as mentioned with low-range gearbox (a must) A Land Rover Defender 110 may be suitable (heavier than a Defender 90) If you need something a little more road-going then I'd suggest a Land Rover Discovery 2 or newer. These are heavier than Defenders so have an advantage in that respect. None are the most reliable of vehicles. A Toyota Land Cruiser may also do it but I don't know so much about them.

 

Also depends on the amount of traction and whether or not there's any complications, but I've seen these things tow 44t articulated trucks, in the snow!

an older Landcruiser would certainly do it

80 series (1990 - 1997) or 100 series (1998 - 2007)

 

the 100 series (amazons) are plated for a train weight of 6500 kg in the uk, the same model in some other countries is plated for well over 10,000 kg (no differences to the vehicle)

 

personal experience with a 100 series was being on an icy road dragging a fully loaded (and full of water) BT van up a 45 degree bank out of a dyke using a bracket fitted to the front of the landcruiser while also having a fully loaded 3.5 ton trailer on the back.

Low ratio + centre and rear diffs locked and it pulled straight out (didn't feel like it was struggling at all)

[Paul C]

A 4x4 would certainly be able to pull the load but it would struggle to do it if it needed to stop-start etc, you'd probably be committed to having to do it in one. I don't know what further maneovring is required after the boat&trailer are pulled up the slipway. Also the launching process might need to be stopped/started and the braking of a 4x4 is certainly marginal. Its simple physics and comes down to the weight of the vehicle, the tyres and the slipway surface. Compared to a decent sized tractor, a 4x4 will never compete on weight. Also there is a question mark on whether a standard tow hitch would be strong enough for the task, or whether an adaption would be needed. A tractor has "by design" a hitch which is ~10x the strength of a 4x4 chassis.

[rasputin]

Is this the Christmas joke thread?