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mark99

14 Day Rule

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I was reading of the historic manorial "justice" cases/records in the village I grew up in yesterday.

 

In 1503 it was "illegal" or forbidden to arrive and stay in the parish for no longer than 14 days if you were a single man or single woman. After 14 days you had to move on.

Edited by mark99

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How far did you have to move?

 

If you couldn't stay in the parish for more than 14 days, you must of had to move (at least) to the 'next Parish', the more important question is can you do :

 

Parish A to Parish B, to Parish A to Parish B to ...................

Edited by Alan de Enfield

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How far did you have to move?

Just to the other side of any bridge, as bridges were the boundaries between different places in the old days (and apparently still are now).

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I was reading of the historic manorial "justice" cases/records in the village I grew up in yesterday.

 

In 1503 it was "illegal" or forbidden to arrive and stay in the parish for no longer than 14 days if you were a single man or single woman. After 14 days you had to move on.

 

Unless of course it was your parish of settlement, in which case you could stay.

 

This was to do with relief of the poor. Parishes had enough to do dealing with the relief of their own poor, and didn't want to be saddled with outsiders looking for handouts.

 

The Vagabonds and Beggars Act of 1494;

 

Vagabonds, idle and suspected persons shall be set in the stocks for three days and three nights and have none other sustenance but bread and water and then shall be put out of Town. Every beggar suitable to work shall resort to the Hundred where he last dwelled, is best known, or was born and there remain upon the pain aforesaid.

 

It was actually over a hundred years before formal poor relief was established (1597-1602) and another 60 before the system of settlements and removals came to be fully formalised.

 

Settlement could be acquired by birth, by marriage in the case of a woman, who would acquire her husbands parish of settlement, or by having lived in the parish for 40 days.

 

Parishes took a keen interest in new arrivals, particularly those parishes with more generous poor relief. Even a newly arrived labourer who was gainfully employed might not always be employed, and the parish wasn't willing to risk them staying 40 days and gaining settlement. Some unscrupulous parishes tried to offload their poor by giving them a lump sum to move away to another parish, and remain hidden for 40 days so as to claim settlement.

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That Vagabonds and Beggars Act sounds like a plan. Expect it to appear in a manifesto near you real soon.

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Really soon!

 

(But I think should it be 'really soonly' biggrin.png )

 

It was an intentional Americanism (a possible clue as to whose manifesto might include it). Immédiatement might be another such clue.

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So let me get this straight; in 1494 the people who drew up an Act of Parliament knew how to clearly define a geographical area for its purposes. Everyone knew where their parish boundaries were. Fast forward to Section 17.3.c.ii of the 1995 British Waterways Act and they just refer to a "place", the exact meaning of which has been argued about ever since. Progress eh?

 

Knowing how precise Athy normally is with his grammar I thought it most unlike him to replace an adverb with the corresponding adjective, but was puzzled by his Americanism because they've famously just had their election. However their 2020 campaign's already been started by people suggesting Michelle Obama as a runner. I can't see her as a fan of the Vagabonds and Beggars Act of 1494.

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I was reading of the historic manorial "justice" cases/records in the village I grew up in yesterday.

 

In 1503 it was "illegal" or forbidden to arrive and stay in the parish for no longer than 14 days if you were a single man or single woman. After 14 days you had to move on.

 

 

I find myself wondering how long a single man or woman was allowed to leave his or her boat in the parish...

 

Presumably no limit as there were no canals!

 

 

 

(Edit to insert some missing worms.)

Edited by Mike the Boilerman

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Knowing how precise Athy normally is with his grammar I thought it most unlike him to replace an adverb with the corresponding adjective, but was puzzled by his Americanism because they've famously just had their election.

I was unaware that manifestoes, or policy statements, or call them what you will, were relevant only prior to an election. I must admit that I wasn't particularly aware of the precision of my grammar - I just try n write proper, innit.

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I was unaware that manifestoes, or policy statements, or call them what you will, were relevant only prior to an election. I must admit that I wasn't particularly aware of the precision of my grammar - I just try n write proper, innit.

 

 

Now there's a first class example of your poor grammar Mr Athy. The phrase correctly written would be "I just try to write properly, innit?"

 

Hope that helps.

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Now there's a first class example of your poor grammar Mr Athy. The phrase correctly written would be "I just try to write properly, innit?"

 

Hope that helps.

Yes it do.

 

The word which I sought, and have now found, was "agendas" rather than Manifestoes.

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Settlement iirc could be allowed if you were a servant etc (livaboard lol) although U wonder if you were sacked where you had to go?

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I find myself wondering how long a single man or woman was allowed to leave his or her boat in the parish...

 

Presumably no limit as there were no canals!

 

They could have been moored up on the Fossdyke, around Lincoln, or on the Ancholme, Lea or Yorkshire Ouse as they all had legislation concerning navigation prior to 1485.

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Settlement iirc could be allowed if you were a servant etc (livaboard lol) although U wonder if you were sacked where you had to go?

As I understand it, that was indeed a problem and used by unscrupulous wealthy to keep their servants in order - threatened with not only losing a job but also a place to live. Most would have been live-in, or at least in a tied cottage on an estate.

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Yes it do.

 

The word which I sought, and have now found, was "agendas" rather than Manifestoes.

 

My toes are manifest at the moment, as I've taken my socks off.

  • Greenie 1

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My toes are manifest at the moment, as I've taken my socks off.

That was quite a feat.

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A big part of this topic could possibly be moved to a dedicated topic (still to be created) about the right use of the English language and the proper grammar that go's with it.

 

Peter.

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