The Practicalities of Life Aboard a Broads Cruiser

[Naughty Cal]

We have always planned that at some point we will liveaboard a boat. However plans have not gone quite as we had hoped and the boat we want to make our home, a Greenline 33 ( going to end up being just a stretch too far finances wise in the next couple of years.

 

So we have come up with a Plan B which would hopefully set us on the right footing to being able to liveaboard but alos to trade up in say 5 or so years to the boat we want.

 

Plan B revolves around selling the house and with the proceeds buying outright a Broads boat along the lines of these:

 

http://hireboatsforsale.co.uk/norfolk-broads/amber-light-5.html

 

http://www.nya.co.uk/aquafibre38-3.html

 

http://hireboatsforsale.co.uk/norfolk-broads/reflecting-light-1.html

 

Now obviously there will be work to do to any of these boats to make them suitable for liveaboard use. The plan would be, depending on the boat we bought of course, to completely refit the galley, turn an area into a utility room with washer, dryer, freezer etc., retrim through the boat as necessary, upgrade the battery bank to suit power needs, install larger alternator to suit larger battery bank, install 200-300w solar to the front cabin roof, etc, etc.

 

The plan would be to keep a marina mooring where we are currently based in Lincoln whilst getting used to the idea of living afloat and getting the boat set up as we want it, but with maybe the option of CCing for the summer months at least after that and then returning to the marina for the winter.

 

I know that some of you have lived on board these boats and similar craft so your thoughts would be much appreciated on the practicalities of living aboard and cruising these boats. We have hired them in the past on the Broads but clearly that is very different to living with one and cruising one away from their home grounds.

 

Obviously this will be a big change for us not just moving on board but also will mean we are cruising very different waters to those we cruise now, coastal cruising will very much be put on hold. But just how practical will a Broads boat be on the wide UK canals for example. We are sure it will be very much at home on the Trent, the Witham and the Ouse but what if we head further inland still?

 

Any thoughts you have will be much appreciated.

 

 

[Alan de Enfield]

You will miss the lumpy-stuff.

 

We had 20+ years on sea boats, SWMBO frightened by waves breaking over the fly bridge on a trip back from Scotland.

To keep boating we have had 10+ years on the canals - but enough is enough.

 

Now back onto 'proper boats'.

[Naughty Cal]

You will miss the lumpy-stuff.

 

We had 20+ years on sea boats, SWMBO frightened by waves breaking over the fly bridge on a trip back from Scotland.

To keep boating we have had 10+ years on the canals - but enough is enough.

 

Now back onto 'proper boats'.

We know that is a very real possibility. We have a couple of big cruises we want to get out of the way with Naughty-Cal first to hopefully get the salt out of our system first, one to the Caledonian and then the Thames.

 

We hope that the Broads boat will only be a stop gap before we can get the salty water boat we want.

[billS]

I have hired lots of broads cruisers over the years - usually in winter because I prefer them then. My first thought is that the two examples show both have large single piece sliding roofs which are both heavy and would be a pig to insulate.

 

For winter/spring cruising, I prefer the single level style with half sliding roofs . These have less glazing and are better insulated, but offer all the benefits of a sliding roof

[Naughty Cal]

I have hired lots of broads cruisers over the years - usually in winter because I prefer them then. My first thought is that the two examples show both have large single piece sliding roofs which are both heavy and would be a pig to insulate.

 

For winter/spring cruising, I prefer the single level style with half sliding roofs . These have less glazing and are better insulated, but offer all the benefits of a sliding roof

We also used to hire out of season, much quieter then the middle of the summer when we have been with our own boat.

 

We hired several types of boat and actually preferred the full sliding roof as in the examples we have picked out with the more elevated driving position yet still with a low air draft. The roofs are winch operated (some manual some electric) so not reliant on brute force alone!

 

We are aware that insulation isn't a strong point which is part of the reason we would keep a marina berth to enable us to run a dehumidifier as necessary.

[Phil Ambrose]

Hi Rachael, I would go for the C45, you will appreciate the extra space, a well proven boat. As you are already aware you and Liam will have to do some re-modelling but with your skill set it should not present any problem. I shall look forward to seeing how you get on. Feel free to PM me if you think my brains are worth picking.

Phil

[Naughty Cal]

Hi Rachael, I would go for the C45, you will appreciate the extra space, a well proven boat. As you are already aware you and Liam will have to do some re-modelling but with your skill set it should not present any problem. I shall look forward to seeing how you get on. Feel free to PM me if you think my brains are worth picking.

Phil

The C45 is my favourite of the bunch. I think it could easily be made to suit our needs.

 

The move is a couple of years off yet as we have plans booked in for the next couple of summers with NC that we really want to do while we have the chance. But we will keep our eyes and ears open for suitable boats in the meantime.

[magpie patrick]

Stop it, now, you have made me look up options for a broads holiday, and also look at lustfully at boats that are bigger and better than Lutine Bell. I need to get on with some work!

 

More relevant, you are very used to being afloat so my guess is you need a feel for whether these boats would work rather than whether being afloat in December is a good idea. As for cruising range, you'd know better than me but my guess is those boats would be okay for MCA category C waters at least

[Naughty Cal]

One of them is advertised as Cat B but I wouldn't want to check that out!

[magpie patrick]

One of them is advertised as Cat B but I wouldn't want to check that out!

 

 

beware: MCA standards are A-D with A as canals and D as major estuaries, whereas the RCD starts at A - Ocean and goes to D - sheltered waters.

 

I'd have thought they could do semi-sheltered waters, MCA category C, RCD Category C (as it happens at C the categories loosely coincide!)

[Naughty Cal]

 

 

beware: MCA standards are A-D with A as canals and D as major estuaries, whereas the RCD starts at A - Ocean and goes to D - sheltered waters.

 

I'd have thought they could do semi-sheltered waters, MCA category C, RCD Category C (as it happens at C the categories loosely coincide!)

It is RCD Cat B.

 

A modern hull at 2010.

[cuthound]

I'd be very wary of leaving the housing market completely, in case you need to return to the land when you are older or if poor health strikes.

 

Could you downsize to a flat,rent it out and buy a cheaper, older boat? With the skill sets you and Liam possess, you could do up older boat up and sell it for more than you paid, repeating as necessary until you can afford your ideal liveaboard boat.

[Naughty Cal]

I'd be very wary of leaving the housing market completely, in case you need to return to the land when you are older or if poor health strikes.

 

Could you downsize to a flat,rent it out and buy a cheaper, older boat? With the skill sets you and Liam possess, you could do up older boat up and sell it for more than you paid, repeating as necessary until you can afford your ideal liveaboard boat.

We really don't want the hassle of renting a property out. We have seen two close friends have lots of trouble and the associated stress renting out their properties to tenants who have turned sour.

 

If we decide we don't want to live afloat anymore we will just sell the boat and use the proceeds plus hopefully some money which will still be in the bank (proceeds from the sale of NC and the Sierra) to buy a property onshore again.

[cuthound]

We really don't want the hassle of renting a property out. We have seen two close friends have lots of trouble and the associated stress renting out their properties to tenants who have turned sour.

 

If we decide we don't want to live afloat anymore we will just sell the boat and use the proceeds plus hopefully some money which will still be in the bank (proceeds from the sale of NC and the Sierra) to buy a property onshore again.

As long as you have anot "escape" plan if it all goes wrong, then that's ok.

[MoominPapa]

We really don't want the hassle of renting a property out. We have seen two close friends have lots of trouble and the associated stress renting out their properties to tenants who have turned sour.

 

If we decide we don't want to live afloat anymore we will just sell the boat and use the proceeds plus hopefully some money which will still be in the bank (proceeds from the sale of NC and the Sierra) to buy a property onshore again.

 

Think hard about this. Nobody knows what the housing market will do, but if the options are being in the market, or exiting it, then the risky call is to leave the market. House prices may crash, in which case you win, or they may continue to climb, in which case history tells us that your house money could be worth half or a third of a house by the time you come to buy another. Yes, renting is a risk, but it's difficult to see how selling the house and putting the money in the bank is less of a risk. Plus, the returns on money in banks are really, really, bad compared to the returns on the same money in the form of a rented-out house.

 

Money-where-your-mouth-is-time: as full-time liveaboards, with a house left over from our previous life, we will definitely be renting out and not selling.

 

MP.

 

ETA. As far as the boats are concerned, I have little expertise to add, but having boated the NE canals, mostly for the first time this summer it occurs to me; would they be OK on the Leeds and Liverpool, Calder and Hebble, Rochdale etc? Thats a big chunk of good CC livaboard territory that you shouldn't eliminate by accident.

Edited August 31, 2016 by MoominPapa

[Naughty Cal]

 

Think hard about this. Nobody knows what the housing market will do, but if the options are being in the market, or exiting it, then the risky call is to leave the market. House prices may crash, in which case you win, or they may continue to climb, in which case history tells us that your house money could be worth half or a third of a house by the time you come to buy another. Yes, renting is a risk, but it's difficult to see how selling the house and putting the money in the bank is less of a risk. Plus, the returns on money in banks are really, really, bad compared to the returns on the same money in the form of a rented-out house.

 

Money-where-your-mouth-is-time: as full-time liveaboards, with a house left over from our previous life, we will definitely be renting out and not selling.

 

MP.

 

ETA. As far as the boats are concerned, I have little expertise to add, but having boated the NE canals, mostly for the first time this summer it occurs to me; would they be OK on the Leeds and Liverpool, Calder and Hebble, Rochdale etc? Thats a big chunk of good CC livaboard territory that you shouldn't eliminate by accident.

That's what I'm asking.

 

Whats makes you think they wouldn't be?

[billS]

I think for much of the canal system, propeller/rudder vulnerability, and subsequent access might be an issue.

[MoominPapa]

That's what I'm asking.

 

Whats makes you think they wouldn't be?

 

Nothing, but I'm a narrowboater, so I don't have much expertise in this. Experience this summer is that GRP is common as far west as Leeds, but much less so on the L&L.

 

MP.

 

ETA those examples all give dafts of 3'. The L&L was fine with a 2'10" NB, but at that depth you will find the bottom quite regularly. Does that matter with a GRP hull? I'd certainly be worried about having an outdrive as the lowest point on the hull, for instance

Edited August 31, 2016 by MoominPapa

[Naughty Cal]

I think for much of the canal system, propeller/rudder vulnerability, and subsequent access might be an issue.

The prop is well tucked up behind the keel but yes I agree access isn't ideal. Must be possible though as we have seen several hirers rescued from the old rope around the prop trick!

 

 

Nothing, but I'm a narrowboater, so I don't have much expertise in this. Experience this summer is that GRP is common as far west as Leeds, but much less so on the L&L.

 

MP.

 

ETA those examples all give dafts of 3'. The L&L was fine with a 2'10" NB, but at that depth you will find the bottom quite regularly. Does that matter with a GRP hull? I'd certainly be worried about having an outdrive as the lowest point on the hull, for instance

The boat will be shaft driven!

 

Draft varies depending on the boat from 2 to 3ft.

[sueb]

Think about letting rooms rather than the whole house. It's much safer especially if you can keep a tiny room for yourself

[Naughty Cal]

Think about letting rooms rather than the whole house. It's much safer especially if you can keep a tiny room for yourself

There are only two bedrooms in the house to start with!

 

The little you would get for a room let just wouldn't make it a viable option.

[magpie patrick]

My personal opinion, and that is all it is...

 

You only live once and you don't know how long for: IF holding onto a house is stopping you following your dreams, then assuming your dreams are legal and reasonably ethical let the house go (if they are not legal and ethical then we will need a hole different debate)

 

Check where you would like to cruise when it comes to these boats: I know you are cautious of NC when it comes to canals, you will know better than I do whether NC is more or less vulnerable than either of these boats. I would say that these boats could at least do a trip to Hull or a crossing of the Wash, and with care they could probably do a trip to and from the Broads, but your trip to Scotland wouldn't be a runner in these.

 

As for the canals, I suspect NC realistically would struggle west of Leeds, Wakefield and perhaps Tinsley. The option would be nice but the L&L has 29 locks in 22 miles from Leeds, The Sheffield Canal is three miles long and starts will 11 locks, the Calder and Hebble isn't quite in this league but it has more than a lock a mile. From memory locks aren't your favourite activity.

 

Lutine Bell is my only significant capital asset - she is also, as these pages testify, an irascible sod of a boat at times, but given a choice between having her or having no boat, then I would chose to keep her (and am doing so)

[Alan de Enfield]

Just a thought :

 

The draft of NC is virtually the same as these broads boats you are looking at (0.8 metres / 2' 11") and 4 feet narrower (8 feet in lieu of 12 feet)

Your air draft is 6 feet - pretty much the same.

Why don't you take NC for a 'run' up the canals that you propose basing yourself on ?

 

"Try before you buy"

 

You will have the advantage that the lowest point on NC is the drive so you can lift that a few inches (tilt) in the known shallow places, you also have the benefit that you can do a full tilt and get to the prop to clear off the dead bodies, mattresses, bin bags , ropes and cables that you pick up 'on the cut' - something that you cannot do on the broads boats (and no 'weed hatch' either - or is there ?)

 

If you struggle with NC then think what misery you will have when living aboard the broads boat.

 

I may have saved you £50,000 !!!

Edited August 31, 2016 by Alan de Enfield

[Nightwatch]

Due to our circumstances, we rented for quite a few years. Too many in some respects.

 

We were good tennants and without fail got our full deposits back each time at the end of the tenancy. In fact, leaving a property cleaner than when we moved in to avoid wagging tongues after our departure.

 

I would imagine we are not unique and there are more good tennants than bad. If, and I didn't, have a property I would have rented out. But I would have vetted the potential tennants and monitored the let consistently during the term. Go for long term tennants. We were.

 

Martyn

[Grebe]

The C45 will make a quieter cruising boat with the engine at the back corner (port side?). The AF 38 has the engine under the raised helm position in the centre cockpit.

 

I think the C45 had the winding handle and chains under the side deck, system to move the canopy. Make sure they have been kept in good adjustment or the chains can slip on the drive-sprocket and lead to repairs.