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reversing


mizpah2

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Was this bucket with a 2" hole in the bottom already in the hire boat Bill? If it was, presumably this boat was known by the hire company to respond well to a drogue!

 

Nope, the bucket was intact (we'd used it to carry a few odds and ends when loading for the holiday), I'd heard that it was a trick worth trying so sacrificed it in order to see if it worked. I tried without the hole and that did not work very well, the bucket veered from side to side, the boat went where ever it felt like. Cut a hole and it stayed centred and worked well keeping the bows in line. I've not tried on my own boat as it goes quite well in reverse at slow speed using the rudder as a sort of plough, I can feel the water pushing against the blade and adjust accordingly to get a bit of steering. Works for me.

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Yes reversing long distances is one of the few situations were a bow thruster is really useful.

It really is, especially when its a mile down a twisty narrow river.

 

Nope, the bucket was intact (we'd used it to carry a few odds and ends when loading for the holiday), I'd heard that it was a trick worth trying so sacrificed it in order to see if it worked. I tried without the hole and that did not work very well, the bucket veered from side to side, the boat went where ever it felt like. Cut a hole and it stayed centred and worked well keeping the bows in line. I've not tried on my own boat as it goes quite well in reverse at slow speed using the rudder as a sort of plough, I can feel the water pushing against the blade and adjust accordingly to get a bit of steering. Works for me.

A drogue

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I was given two very good pieces of advice by an experienced steerer - firstly, as many have already said, watch the front of the boat; second, always go back further than you think you need to. I would add, don't be afraid of putting on the revs, because barring sudden gear linkage failure* or a very odd prop set up you will be able to stop more effectively than using reverse to stop going forwards.

 

*As happened to me when approaching a small wooden boat at a lock on the Avon. Conclusion - some small wooden boats are tougher than they look, thankfully, and this is one occasion when it is ok to use your (or preferably someone else's) arms to fend off.

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Practice is the answer i can happly stear backwords the trick i found is to watch the bow as it starts to swing then move your rudder. Found once moving slow the engine and the flow then helps keep it strait. The rudder will force water round it. It moves the bow not the back end. This turns the boat round bends. Use forward to move the back end over. Remember to start the prop will swing the back end to one of the sides but once moving its easyer to keep going.

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  • 5 months later...

I'm glad it's not just me (or my boat) that struggle in reverse. Having been continually adding weight as I fit out (and trying to move the ballast around accordingly) I put my successes/failures down largely to when the boat is or isn't level (Port to Starboard) - certainly one time when it was well out all it would do was go round in circles (in reverse). A while back I had to reverse some way and back up through a lock and I really thought I'd nailed it - last couple of times recently it's been the wind that's got me, but I luckily had a man with a stick at the pointy end.

I didn't know about the danger of the tiller knocking you in! But I have learned the hard way that it is better to correct any bow deviation as early on as possible!

Now I've gleened a little more knowledge from this thread, I'm almost looking forward to the next time.

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I think this reversing lark depends entirely upon the boat. As someone has said earlier it is the easiest thing in the world to steer in reverse on a deep, wide river or in deep docks (Bristol) and I have occasionally impressed myself reversing mine for some distance on a canal but, if I am honest, it is entirely down to luck and not much skill. I have tried all the little dodges people have suggested, a drogue at the front, lots of throttle, very little throttle, somewhere in between, none of it makes any difference. Once the boat starts to go off-line there is nothing that the rudder will do to correct it. You can try turning it a small amount to correct it, try putting the rudder hard over to correct it or, if you feel like it, pull the rudder out and throw it over the sidehuh.png , the only solution is to stop altogether, get re-aligned and start again. On the other hand, several years ago whilst using a Canaltime boat, that one would actually respond and steer in reverse, correcting it when it went off-line seemed to work but with Rune, no chance!

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I'm a fly fisherman and when fishing from a rowing boat often use a drogue to slow the drift (not a bucket-with-a-hole drogue, but a parachute type made for the job). I think I have a spare and am now thinking it wouldn't be a bad idea to leave it on the boat, in case I need to reverse a long way. It folds up very small and would be easy to stow in the gas locker.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 02/09/2016 at 15:53, billybobbooth said:

Practice is the answer i can happly stear backwords the trick i found is to watch the bow as it starts to swing then move your rudder. Found once moving slow the engine and the flow then helps keep it strait. The rudder will force water round it. It moves the bow not the back end. This turns the boat round bends. Use forward to move the back end over. Remember to start the prop will swing the back end to one of the sides but once moving its easyer to keep going.

My boat certainly does not respond like that - wish it did. Once the nose starts to go (off line) the only solution is to use forward - and that will straighten things up ready for another stab in reverse.

I wonder if having the bow lower in the water would help? Mine is at a fair old angle to the horizontal, though I've seen others like it.

My most recent woes have been down to the wind though...

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56 minutes ago, Johny London said:

My boat certainly does not respond like that - wish it did. Once the nose starts to go (off line) the only solution is to use forward - and that will straighten things up ready for another stab in reverse.

I wonder if having the bow lower in the water would help? Mine is at a fair old angle to the horizontal, though I've seen others like it.

My most recent woes have been down to the wind though...

Do you not have a 'fat-boat' ?

A big wide square stern is not going to respond well - it is just a big flat 'plane' that will go where it likes, the shape of the 'swim' will make a difference but maybe just accept that a non-boat shaped boat needs more 'love'.

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On ‎28‎/‎08‎/‎2016 at 21:21, Nightwatch said:

Some people have bow thrusters!

and if no bow thrusters then a couple a tugs works a treat........

 

like a lot of boat handling it is a case of finding out what is best for you and your boat and to practice when ever you get a chance.     Waiting for a lock can be a good example when 'hovering' waiting for the gates to open.

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I find reversing particularly difficult due to the loss of my right arm my new boat has a separate accelerator and gear levers plus the tiller of course! i did find my first reverse manoeuvre quite daunting to say the least :blink: i think was trying to do the manoeuvre too quickly but doing it very very slowly does help a bit ;)   

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Last year coming into napton folly from braunston, i winded just up from the folly to moor up before heading back when i remembered i needed water. The water point is round the bend close to the folly inn. Nothing for it but to reverse down the long row of moored boats with a bit of a side breeze too. I tend to face rearwards with tiller in my stomache and firm in both hands and look over my shoulder at the bow drift. Above idle engine speed and get a good headway on before going into fwd to straighten the bow. Doing the 75 yards straight wasnt too bad but the bend in the wind was darned ugly even with no spectators, but an oncoming boat from braunston didnt seem to understand what i was about until i firmly raised my hand to stop him and shouted loudly what i was up too. By then we were almost bow to bow. I managed it finally. Lessons learned that i will probably forget next time ! What fun.

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6 hours ago, Irob said:

Last year coming into napton folly from braunston, i winded just up from the folly to moor up before heading back when i remembered i needed water. The water point is round the bend close to the folly inn. Nothing for it but to reverse down the long row of moored boats with a bit of a side breeze too. I tend to face rearwards with tiller in my stomache and firm in both hands and look over my shoulder at the bow drift. Above idle engine speed and get a good headway on before going into fwd to straighten the bow. Doing the 75 yards straight wasnt too bad but the bend in the wind was darned ugly even with no spectators, but an oncoming boat from braunston didnt seem to understand what i was about until i firmly raised my hand to stop him and shouted loudly what i was up too. By then we were almost bow to bow. I managed it finally. Lessons learned that i will probably forget next time ! What fun.

I think you mean't "get a good sternway on", surely?

Howard

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Anybody regulary walking a boat astern using stern rope and centre rope ?

It seems practical if the towpath is clear and there is some distance to travel. 

I did it successfully at norton junction, boat facing toward buckby, pulled her back some distance on the clear hard to the leicester arm , let the inertia take her into the middle of the junction, checked on a long centre line, before pulling the stern back in up the arm. Jumped aboard and motored back to braunston.  3 point turn style.  Up the junction style.

Mostly i,m single hander so i try to give some thought and planning to what might be a troublsome manouvre.

Anybody had similar handlings?

 

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8 hours ago, Irob said:

Is it termed sternway ?  I never heard it. 

Headway is going ahead l.e. Forward. Sternway is going astern i.e. Sternfirst, and is a term which has been in use for many, many years.

 

Howard

 

 

Edited by howardang
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3 hours ago, howardang said:

Headway is going ahead l.e. Forward. Sternway is going astern i.e. Sternfirst, and is a term which has been in use for many, many years.

 

Howard

 

 

And 'reversing' is known as making a stern board, at least to the RN.

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2 hours ago, BEngo said:

And 'reversing' is known as making a stern board, at least to the RN.

The term "Making a Sternboard", which as you mention, is more commonly used in the Royal Navy, has its roots in the days of sailing vessels but has now become more widely used in the gray funnel line generally, to mean making or gathering sternway. 

Howard

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9 hours ago, howardang said:

Headway is going ahead l.e. Forward. Sternway is going astern i.e. Sternfirst, and is a term which has been in use for many, many years.

 

Howard

 

 

I know the term going astern, and stern first. I live and learn. Thankyou.

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