Can I reduce the beam of my boat?

[The Boat Studio]

I have a 55ft boat with a 6ft 10inch beam. Recently I tried to go through Hurlston bottom lock on the Llangollen Arm and got stuck. We tried for about an hour with CRT Lock keeper and co to no avail. This was really devastating to us as for many reasons. We have wanted/needed to be able to access the Welsh part of the canal specifically. We bought this boat pretty much specifically for that journey.

 

The sign at Hurlston says 6ft 10 is the max beam that can go through and many indeed do with no problem. It seems are boat might have part that are slightly over 6ft 10 and they correspond exactly where the lock it at its tightest. The seemed to be one point specifically where the boat pinched (we tried to go in forwards and backwards!)

 

My question is can anything be done do our boat to reduce its beam by a couple of inches? Be that shaving or squeezing? We have talked about welding metal plates on the inside and winching the sides inwards?

 

I realise this is probably very unlikely and we will have to instead go down the route of selling our current boat and buying a new one. (after a careful survey on the exact beam length along the entire boat!)

 

But any thoughts suggestions on boat squeezing would be greatly appreciated. Even to just rule out the possibility!

 

Amber

[WotEver]

Welding metal plates and winching is, I'm sure, eminently possible but it'd require a huge strip-out of the internal fittings.

 

I'll now shut up because someone will be along shortly who actually knows what they're talking about

[Paul C]

I have a 55ft boat with a 6ft 10inch beam.

 

No you don't - the boat is wider than 6'10". Or more precisely, if you placed a rectangle around the exremities of the boat, that rectangle would be greater than 6'10" wide, even if you measured the width at different places and its never more than 6'10" at those places. Its either banana shaped, or the baseplate has not been trimmed off properly and is greater than 6'10" under the waterline where you can't see it.

 

When did you buy the boat and what did the specifications say for its width? Its possible you could go down the route of advert being misdescribed.

[Flyboy]

Have you actually measured it? You may have oversized anodes on the sides.

[magnetman]

Who built the boat ? I have seen Liverpool boats narrow boats with slight bulges in the sides. There are other less reputable builders who managed to get some really bad narrow boats into the water but its probably not one of those.

Is the Llangollen really that important that you'd sell the boat and buy another one ?

 

(Would suggest that if you do buy a different boat you get a surveyor to carry out the rather difficult task of measuring the beam and put his name to it or actually do a in water test through hurleston locks)

Edited August 15, 2016 by magnetman

[Murflynn]

I have seen Liverpool boats narrow boats with slight bulges in the sides.

my Scouseboat widebeam had bulging side decks either side of the cabin, although the roof was parallel.

 

it would not have been impossible to pull it in with a pull-along or two but I can't think how you would hold the reduced beam without a full steel frame, or at least a part bulkhead of third-width on both sides, built of steel and properly tied-in to the base-plate and roof.

[Rob-M]

Could you see the pinch points...? It may be possible to grind the rubbing strakes down at the tight spots but it would depend how straight the boat is as the tight spot may be somewhere else next time especially if you stuck forwards and backwards.

[Guest]

Sorry to hear this. Hurlston will certainly catch out anything that is above 6-10, although as has already been stated, it could be a banana boat. Even boats from the same manufacturer can differ; our Sterling Nb goes through Hurlston, yet I know of one Sterling that doesn't. I remember helping a butty through there that was really stuck, and they winched the sides in, and then we flushed it through with the paddles. A bit scarey but it went.

[Just Heaven]

Before we bought our boat we had it surveyed, the surveyor measured the max beam at 6ft 10.5in, but we managed Hurleston earlier this year. It was a tight squeeze though !

 

Steve

[Arthur Brown]

Is your boat truly straight? Locks are unforgiving of boats that don't curve the way the stonework does. If your boat is a banana and the lock is true then you have a problem, but one lock is banana shaped and boats of the same curve go through. Did you try going through backwards?

[Tiggs]

I remember watching a Sea Otter boat trying to get through that lock and failing due to its rubber protective fittings all the way round. I could only get half way in. There was a Hotel boat pair that always had to pull the butty in with a levering device.

 

The lock is not straight, nor is it wide enough, and it should be fixed. It has been like this for years and I think it is getting worse.

 

(by the way, did you try going in backwards - it might work - but you would have to turn it round before the top lock - and operate the lock very slowly! - i.e 1/2 a paddle max.)

Edited August 15, 2016 by Tiggs

[Guest]

It appears that the OP tried reversing into the lock. Probably just a fat boat, but I agree that this lock needs attention; there are a lot of boats that get stuck.

[zenataomm]

 

 

The sign at Hurlston says 6ft 10 is the max beam that can go through and many indeed do with no problem. It seems are boat might have part that are slightly over 6ft 10 and they correspond exactly where the lock it at its tightest. The seemed to be one point specifically where the boat pinched (we tried to go in forwards and backwards!)

 

Amber

 

Is your boat truly straight? Locks are unforgiving of boats that don't curve the way the stonework does. If your boat is a banana and the lock is true then you have a problem, but one lock is banana shaped and boats of the same curve go through. Did you try going through backwards?

 

I remember watching a Sea Otter boat trying to get through that lock and failing due to its rubber protective fittings all the way round. I could only get half way in. There was a Hotel boat pair that always had to pull the butty in with a levering device.

 

The lock is not straight, nor is it wide enough, and it should be fixed. It has been like this for years and I think it is getting worse.

 

(by the way, did you try going in backwards - it might work - but you would have to turn it round before the top lock - and operate the lock very slowly! - i.e 1/2 a paddle max.)

[magnetman]

[David Mack]

By how much did you not fit through? Do you know where the boat stuck? If its localised, then an angle grinder to the rubbing strips might be sufficient. You almost certainly don't need to shave a full 2 inches off the width.

[dor]

The surveyor who oversaw the build of my shell gives the finished boat's beam as 6' 11 1/4". I get through Hurleston, but there is not a lot of room. I guess it could depend on where the tight spot is.

 

C&RT did do some work on the lock a couple of years ago to shave off some of the high spots which means many boats can now get through that formerly couldn't.

 

Do you actually know what the beam is of your boat at the widest point?

[dave moore]

I'm 6'11" and went through 10 years ago with no problem. Chains and bottle screws were used on working boats to pull hull sides in, I'm not sure whether that would work with a cabin above. Buying another boat to fit the cut is a drastic solution, the Welsh is nice but only stunning in the final few miles IMHO....but it's your call...

 

Dave

[FadeToScarlet]

Report it to CRT. The more reports there are, the more likely things are to get done.

 

The lock has got worse over time. Boats that have been through before now can't.

 

I know mine won't, it's 7' 3/8" at the widest point, with the baseplate alone 6'11".

 

Incidentally, LTC Rolt had to grease Cressy's sides and drive in flat out to get into the lock, back in the 1940s.

[magpie patrick]

Former working boats that are undoubtedly more than 6 foot ten have got through, but my guess is a Town Cllass, at well over 7 feet, wouldn't, but I digress

 

1) Could you see it jam? Was the sticking point above the waterline? If so what was it? A rubbing strake, a loop for hanging a fender off, or a bulge?

 

2) If you stuck below the waterline could you dry dock the boat and see what might be sticking out? An anode, or the baseplate protruding?

 

3) Do you need to go to the Welsh bit permanently or just to visit? If the latter it doesn't have to be in your own boat, and changing boats is a hassle, you could borrow or hire perhaps?

 

Edited to add - this lock has always been bad - in the 1960's Mum and Dad hired from Anker Valler Cruisers and it was made clear of that fleet, only Anker herself would go through Hurleston Locks. Also, I notice that Lutine Bell, built in 1972, is quite a bit narrower than my previous boat Ripple, built in 1999 (although Ripple fitted Hurleston) - I would suggest that steel boats have got wider in the last forty years

Edited August 16, 2016 by magpie patrick

[The Boat Studio]

Is your boat truly straight? Locks are unforgiving of boats that don't curve the way the stonework does. If your boat is a banana and the lock is true then you have a problem, but one lock is banana shaped and boats of the same curve go through. Did you try going through backwards?

Yes tried forwards and backwards. It did seem to be pinching at about 12ft if from the bow. We got most of the way in backwards but only a third in forwards. It corresponded to where the lock is at its narrowest. Lock keeper said the water levels being higher could of helped matters. But cant rely on high water levels all the time!

Report it to CRT. The more reports there are, the more likely things are to get done.

 

The lock has got worse over time. Boats that have been through before now can't.

 

I know mine won't, it's 7' 3/8" at the widest point, with the baseplate alone 6'11".

 

Incidentally, LTC Rolt had to grease Cressy's sides and drive in flat out to get into the lock, back in the 1940s.

Yes I have written to them to report it - no response so far

[Paul C]

I can't see CRT doing anything. They've recently surveyed the lock with laser, skimmed it a little, and its adequately signed with the width and to lift fenders. Boats which can't get through are wider than the signed width.

[Alan de Enfield]

Is the boat manufactured by 'Liverpool' ?

 

Liverpool boats were 'production line' built and do tend to suffer from 'straightness problems' to a much higher degree than other 'hand made' manufacturers.

 

Over the years here have been a surprising number of Liverpool 'banana' boats reported on this forum - there must be many, many more who are not members here.

 

It maybe only 6' 10" wide wherever you measure it but taking into account (even a 2") out of true measurement over its length, it could easily be over 7' effective beam.

 

Try and tie up against a known straight edge, with the 'front' and rear alongside can you see daylight anywhere along the length ?

Turn the boat around and repeat.

[MtB]

Is the boat manufactured by 'Liverpool' ?

 

Liverpool boats were 'production line' built and do tend to suffer from 'straightness problems' to a much higher degree than other 'hand made' manufacturers.

 

Over the years here have been a surprising number of Liverpool 'banana' boats reported on this forum - there must be many, many more who are not members here.

 

It maybe only 6' 10" wide wherever you measure it but taking into account (even a 2") out of true measurement over its length, it could easily be over 7' effective beam.

 

Try and tie up against a known straight edge, with the 'front' and rear alongside can you see daylight anywhere along the length ?

Turn the boat around and repeat.

 

 

Very amusing! Where are all these 60ft long 'known straight edges' please?

[Alan de Enfield]

 

 

Very amusing! Where are all these 60ft long 'known straight edges' please?

 

Pontoons tend to be pretty straight, and are often longer than 60 feet

[MtB]

 

Pontoons tend to be pretty straight, and are often longer than 60 feet

 

 

Ah but how do you know the one you have picked is straight?