Bridgewater Canal

[tillergirl]

 

Given what I hear of the enforcement officer, he will interpret the above in whichever way suits his agenda on a particular day, or with a particular boat, or both. I heard that he told our then Club Chairman that, because I have 2 TV aerials, a 4G aerial, and a radio aerial, on my boat, I must be living on board. I suggested that if he knocked on my door late evening, at the address they have on record, it would be me telling him to sling his hook more often than not.

 

So quite a lot of money for not very much benefit???? and the actual benefit is not particularly clear.

I guess this fellow is going to be in for a few more wettings then.................had quite a few I'm given to understand.

[Richard10002]

2015 figures from Companies House give a gross profit of £691,007 and an operating profit of £381,155, I'm not sure where the myth that the Bridgewater isn't profitable comes from. I'd call a gross profit of nearly £700k on a turnover of £1,147,027 amazingly profitable, that's about 2/3 of the turnover Is profit and about 25% operating profit, I wish I owned a piece of that.

K

 

It wont all be licence and mooring fees but, at £1k per boat, eleven hundred boats would generate that income - I dont know how many boats are on the canal. Presumably some of the income is rent or similar from canalside property and land, and I would guess that every time some canalside land is sold for development, they receive a tidy sum, along with ground rents forever.

[Horace42]

2015 figures from Companies House give a gross profit of £691,007 and an operating profit of £381,155, I'm not sure where the myth that the Bridgewater isn't profitable comes from. I'd call a gross profit of nearly £700k on a turnover of £1,147,027 amazingly profitable, that's about 2/3 of the turnover Is profit and about 25% operating profit, I wish I owned a piece of that.

K

 

What do they spend £700k on?

[Victor Vectis]

 

That was quick! They've taken note of my ideas for fees - see post above - #85.

And you feel proud of yourself.......................?

 

[Señor Chris]

 

What do they spend £700k on?

 

Don't know for sure but it's one of the better maintained canals I've been on.

[kevinl]

 

What do they spend £700k on?

Me, I have a Bridgewater licence, I have prossies on tap, cocaine at ever water point and if I break down a team of unicorns tows me home, tow paths are gold plated and ever Local Authority and lottery fund money pays for it, what's not to like. And I can buy a day, week or monthly licence from CaRT or whole year for £169 (last I did a couple of years back) for a 30 foot narrowboat and it still make a profit and as Chis says is well maintained. Peel have working the system down to a fine art, perhaps CaRT could take some lessons. No axe to grind with CaRT I still have the old licence plates under the bed but if you can't make profits like Peel then you're doing something wrong.

K

[magictime]

I dont really care what they do as it is unlikely to affect me, but gates or chains, or whatever, would have to be manned, pretty much 24 hours a day, 365 days a year, to allow Bridgewater licensed boats through, as well as the CRT boats which would be being recorded and charged on their return if appropriate. Thats 5 full time jobs, a lot of which would require unsociable hours pay of some kind. It would require about 1800 x £40 charges to fund just the wages at £15k per year.

 

Or they could just give Bridgewater licence holders a key, and require CRT boaters to book passage at certain times, with the EO spending a few hours a week letting people in and out upon payment of any applicable fee.

 

2015 figures from Companies House give a gross profit of £691,007 and an operating profit of £381,155, I'm not sure where the myth that the Bridgewater isn't profitable comes from. I'd call a gross profit of nearly £700k on a turnover of £1,147,027 amazingly profitable, that's about 2/3 of the turnover Is profit and about 25% operating profit, I wish I owned a piece of that.

K

 

So what's with the subsidies from Local Authorities etc. via the Bridgewater Canal Trust? Is this a classic case of 'privatise the profits and socialise the losses'?

[Paul C]

Or CCTV, an intercom and an remotely-operated electric gate - which is common at thousands of businesses and estates. The gate would need to be a one-off but isn't a massively technical barrier.

[b0atman]

For interest, if Peel aren't very interested in the Bridgewater and don't make money out of it, why don't they just hand it to CRT?

Why don't the boating groups IWA NABO etc all lobby for this to happen after all it is a canal and a strategic link

[StarUKKiwi]

How do they manage that with 3 entrances and one EO?

The houses at each egress and access logged you

[jonathanA]

 

It is comments like this that make me despair.

 

The whole "well I'm not going to play by the rules, and they can't do a damn thing about it" attitude.

 

That is the attitude that got us to this position. People didn't play fair, so Peel introduced new rules. Those new rules also hit a fair chunk of people who weren't pushing the envelope. So, thanks to the "I'll do what I want" crowd, we have collateral damage. And you think the answer is to engage in a bit more rule breaking?

 

You may be right that they would find it tricky to PHYSICALLY enforce payment for all entering their waters in terms of staffing toll booths at the 3 points of entry, but do they actually need to do that?

 

I can easily envisage a situation where they scrap the reciprocal arrangement, and introduce self-service short term licencing, with heavy penalties for those found not to have paid.

So just to be clear I agree selfish behaviour and irresponsible actions may be what is driving Peel and I don't condone that. What I do condone is action against corporate bullying and my point is that I'm not sure what they could do if we simply ignore the new rules ?

 

Clearly a better option is peel and Crt reach a reasonable agreement.

 

I'm waiting in anticipation for your suggestions ?

[magictime]

I'm not sure what they could do if we simply ignore the new rules ?

 

I'm waiting in anticipation for your suggestions ?

 

Re-read Dave's post and the last couple of pages of this thread. They're full of suggestions about what Peel could do if people ignore the new rules, ranging from scrapping the reciprocal agreement to physically restricting entrance to the Bridgewater for CRT licence holders. That's without getting into legal questions about financial penalties (which I believe are enforceable through the courts so long as they're not unfair) and maybe even the applicability of trespass laws.

[b0atman]

I was going to Wigan but this New rule is impossible for me to stay within the peel Rules and I am not prepared to pay Money to a fatcat company.

So I shall drop an email to Lymm council and Chamber of trade if I can find an email address explaining my reasons and the fact I will not be using pubs shops and eateries this year .

If they had instead charged overnight say £4 for a decent mooring then I would have probably stopped off at Lymm but no way £40 for transit.

 

Email sent to clerk@lymmparishcouncil.gov.uk outlined the problem and suggested an accumulative 7days in 28 would be better.

Edited June 12, 2016 by b0atman

[Jim Riley]

I was going to Wigan but this New rule is impossible for me to stay within the peel Rules and I am not prepared to pay Money to a fatcat company.

So I shall drop an email to Lymm council and Chamber of trade if I can find an email address explaining my reasons and the fact I will not be using pubs shops and eateries this year .

If they had instead charged overnight say £4 for a decent mooring then I would have probably stopped off at Lymm but no way £40 for transit.

 

Email sent to clerk@lymmparishcouncil.gov.uk outlined the problem and suggested an accumulative 7days in 28 would be better.

Op back again to say I've had no reply from Peel as yet, I emailed the address found on the Bridgewater canal website Bridgewatercanal@peel.co.uk . Anyone know Sonny's email address. I will also send an email Lymm.

[StephenA]

 

To clarify "trip to Liverpool":

 

2. A boater based on CRT waters, lets say for example Nantwich, might choose to do a long trip to Liverpool (via the Bridgewater). They would initially use the Bridgewater during the trip for 1-2 days, then once again be on CRT waters on the way to Liverpool (so no issues about a time limit etc). Their trip to-from Liverpool Link would typically mean they'd be coming back home, and need to use the Bridgewater to transit, around 10-14 days after their outwards transit. Thus its both outside the "7 free days" (because these can't be split across a longer time period, etc) and inside the "28 days no return"

 

10 to 14 days later? Where on earth are they going? Or is that assuming that they'll use the full 7 days allowed moorings in Salthouse Dock?

Edited June 12, 2016 by StephenA

[Paul C]

I just guessed the transit time etc, its a fair number of locks and miles and the Liverpool Link is restricted on days isn't it? Its definitely >5 and <28 which would make it an issue.

 

What's the journey time in canalplan, with the proper days available for transit of the Liverpool Link section and a decent amount of time in Liverpool itself?

[StephenA]

Liverpool Link is open all days apart from Tuesdays

 

Leigh Bridge to Salthouse Dock and back is : 87 miles, 1½ furlongs and 28 locks

 

So You need to be at Lydiate Winding hole the evening before you head into the docks which will get you in in the afternoon

 

So a couple of days in the docks...

 

Then you leave first thing in the morning and get out to somewhere down Downholland

 

We're doing a day and a bit in Liverpool later this year:

 

http://canalplan.org.uk/journey/6196_cp

Edited June 12, 2016 by StephenA

[magictime]

Liverpool Link is open all days apart from 1 day

 

Leigh Bridge to Salthouse Dock and back is : 87 miles, 1½ furlongs and 28 locks

 

So You need to be at Lydiate Winding hole the evening before you head into the docks which will get you in in the afternoon

 

So a couple of days in the docks...

 

Then you leave first thing in the morning and get out to somewhere down Downholland

 

We're doing a day and a bit in Liverpool later this year:

 

http://canalplan.org.uk/journey/6196_cp

 

That planned journey illustrates the problem nicely. You enter the Bridgewater on Day 3 of your trip and leave it on Day 4. So far, so good; you're allowed a free visit of up to 7 consecutive days. But when you return 8 days later on Day 12, you'll be required to pay £40 for a 7-day licence because it's been less than 28 days since your last visit.

[StephenA]

 

That planned journey illustrates the problem nicely. You enter the Bridgewater on Day 3 of your trip and leave it on Day 4. So far, so good; you're allowed a free visit of up to 7 consecutive days. But when you return 8 days later on Day 12, you'll be required to pay £40 for a 7-day licence because it's been less than 28 days since your last visit.

 

Yup - it illustrates the problem perfectly and its madness..

[magictime]

 

Yup - it illustrates the problem perfectly and its madness..

 

Ah, I think I read more into your question of that "10-14 days" than you intended... I thought you were saying "it wouldn't be that long so there wouldn't be a problem" or something.

 

Anyway, as a typical length of time to elapse between passing Leigh on the way out and the way back, it does sound about right (given that many people will be spending several days to a week in Salthouse Dock and/or cruising less than CanalPlan's default of 7 hours a day).

[Victor Vectis]

A bit late perhaps, but........

 

Didn't Garfunkle and Simon write a song about this....................?

 

 

 

 

 

..................Trouble over Bridgewater.

 

(OK, I'll fetch my coat)

[Jim Riley]

A bit late perhaps, but........

 

Didn't Garfunkle and Simon write a song about this....................?

 

 

 

 

 

..................Trouble over Bridgewater.

 

(OK, I'll fetch my coat)

and I'll call you a taxi....

 

Victor you are a taxi!

[Peter-Bullfinch]

Should not the song be perhaps

"First cut is the deepest"?

[Arthur Marshall]

Deleted as answer found...

Edited June 14, 2016 by Arthur Marshall

[ditchcrawler]

How much does 7 days on the Thames, Cam, Wey, Baisingstoke or Nene cost? I don't hear much shouting about that