Alway Swilby Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 Well, Midland Swindlers call them fairleads. The cleat type things on the grab rails for the centre rope to go through. Anyway, how would you attach them to the grabrail? There can be quite a pull on them so I suspect a little self tapping screw wouldn't be good enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scholar Gypsy Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 Well, Midland Swindlers call them fairleads. The cleat type things on the grab rails for the centre rope to go through. Anyway, how would you attach them to the grabrail? There can be quite a pull on them so I suspect a little self tapping screw wouldn't be good enough? .. but the main force is likely to be sideways, rather than upwards? I am getting quite tempted by these http://www.cquip.com/shop_1390817511.php or the cleat equivalent, which I saw on a boat recently, for fixing onto the gunwale. http://www.force4.co.uk/force-4-stainless-steel-folding-cleat-8.html?sqr=folding%20cleat.V0dRa_krJxA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
by'eck Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 Drill and tap M6 or M8 if mounting point is into at least 5mm plate. Secure with matching countersunk head setscrews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 Well, Midland Swindlers call them fairleads. The cleat type things on the grab rails for the centre rope to go through. Anyway, how would you attach them to the grabrail? There can be quite a pull on them so I suspect a little self tapping screw wouldn't be good enough? That's one reason I wouldn't have them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lockedout Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 (edited) Curiously, I am just about to refit my fairleads. I will be drilling and tapping the hole to take a nice stainless countersunk head bolt. Edited May 26, 2016 by lockedout Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray T Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 Drill and tap M6 or M8 if mounting point is into at least 5mm plate. Secure with matching countersunk head setscrews. Ditto, had no problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderer Vagabond Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 .. but the main force is likely to be sideways, rather than upwards? I am getting quite tempted by these http://www.cquip.com/shop_1390817511.php or the cleat equivalent, which I saw on a boat recently, for fixing onto the gunwale. http://www.force4.co.uk/force-4-stainless-steel-folding-cleat-8.html?sqr=folding%20cleat.V0dRa_krJxA Since they only seem to be held on by two screws surely the force of a rope would be more than adequate to shear the screw off? I had my centre rope foul the ventilation mushroom on the roof and it quite gaily sheared all five of the brass screws before unceremoniously catapulting the mushroom itself into the cut . Are two screws really going to hold? That's one reason I wouldn't have them I think I'm with you on that. I had thought about getting recesses cut into the grab rail though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 I was considering just putting a strip of thin brass on the handrail to protect the paint, but have never got round to it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wanderer Vagabond Posted May 26, 2016 Report Share Posted May 26, 2016 I was considering just putting a strip of thin brass on the handrail to protect the paint, but have never got round to it I was looking at the recesses to stop the centre line 'beheading' my mushroom again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesWoolcock Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Drill and tap M6 or M8 if mounting point is into at least 5mm plate. Secure with matching countersunk head setscrews. Correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Smith Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 I have 3 holes in mine, I drilled and tapped the hand rail and used 5mm stainless counter sunk screws but also glued with some flex. Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Ambrose Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Since they only seem to be held on by two screws surely the force of a rope would be more than adequate to shear the screw off? I had my centre rope foul the ventilation mushroom on the roof and it quite gaily sheared all five of the brass screws before unceremoniously catapulting the mushroom itself into the cut . Are two screws really going to hold? I think I'm with you on that. I had thought about getting recesses cut into the grab rail though. I'm not 100% on this but surely fairleads are a sticks n rags thing and intended to merely guide a rope rather than constrain it? so not intended to be subject to huge stressesPhil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naughty Cal Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 I'm not 100% on this but surely fairleads are a sticks n rags thing and intended to merely guide a rope rather than constrain it? so not intended to be subject to huge stresses Phil Quite right. Naughty-Cal is fitted with quite a hefty bow fairlead but it is not intended to take any stress or strain from the ropes, it merely guides them to a more convenient angle for mooring. The rope is still taken back to a suitable cleat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Proper bollards ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan de Enfield Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Hawse Holes - thats the answer (I need to take mine out and re-bed them - its on the list) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
by'eck Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Since they only seem to be held on by two screws surely the force of a rope would be more than adequate to shear the screw off? I had my centre rope foul the ventilation mushroom on the roof and it quite gaily sheared all five of the brass screws before unceremoniously catapulting the mushroom itself into the cut . Are two screws really going to hold? Yes maybe surprisingly, they do. Even the M8 brass ones have been fine despite considerable loads whilst single handing in wide locks. FWIW the brass folding roof steps I use are secured by only two M6 setscrews into similar tapped holes in cabin sides, although I did use stainless. Note that as supplied they only have mounting hole clearance for M5 fixings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulG Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 Well, Midland Swindlers call them fairleads. The cleat type things on the grab rails for the centre rope to go through. Anyway, how would you attach them to the grabrail? There can be quite a pull on them so I suspect a little self tapping screw wouldn't be good enough? On my boat I drilled and tapped holes and fixed the fairleads in place with stainless steel countersunk socket screws. Takes a bit of time, but you only need to do it once... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchcrawler Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 FWIW the brass folding roof steps I use are secured by only two M6 setscrews into similar tapped holes in cabin sides, although I did use stainless. Note that as supplied they only have mounting hole clearance for M5 fixings! If they are only tapped into the cabin sides 4-5mm thick I am not sure which is best, would you get more thread with a 5 mm? I am not an expert on threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 If fixing into thin plate (not ideal) probably best to use metric fine screw threads. That said I used ordinary m6 on the fairleads on our cabin and they have survived 12 years of abuse now (I agree they are not really designed for this type of load.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheshire cat Posted May 27, 2016 Report Share Posted May 27, 2016 When they fail they do not get torn out of the rail. The 5mm set screws are not strong enough and snap off. I have had this happen because the wind blew me sideways into a lifted lift bridge. I've had a second one "ping" off aftermy wife wrapped the rope around the fingers of the fairlead without the boat being stationary. In both cases I was able to drill out the remains of the bolt, tap new threads and go up to M6. As someone else said the fairleads holes also had to be opened out because they are only of M5 size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaysider Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 I was about to post a question on these but "the search function" HAS saved a repeated posting. THAT said, do you think that "rivet nuts" would be strong enough rather than tapping into the handrail? - whilst I don't intend on them being under much strain (one either side for twin centre lines) in reality, I'll probably forget when single handing and put a bit of strain on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Dog Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 - whilst I don't intend on them being under much strain (one either side for twin centre lines) in reality, I'll probably forget when single handing and put a bit of strain on them. That's exactly my arrangement and usage. There can be a bit of strain I guess, but it's a handling line so you really should be in control of that stress at all times. Even if you're using it to take the last bit of way off, you'll be allowing some slip to gradually bring the boat to a halt. Maybe 2 turns round a bollard for an instant stop from 2mph would shear the bolts, but that wouldn't be the finest display of boat handling! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 That's exactly my arrangement and usage. There can be a bit of strain I guess, but it's a handling line so you really should be in control of that stress at all times. Even if you're using it to take the last bit of way off, you'll be allowing some slip to gradually bring the boat to a halt. Maybe 2 turns round a bollard for an instant stop from 2mph would shear the bolts, but that wouldn't be the finest display of boat handling! I have found myself in that position a few times! Let the centre rope out as long as possible and it behaves like a big elastic band, taking a lot of the stress off the fairlead. Also wrings the rope out if it is wet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sea Dog Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 I have found myself in that position a few times! Let the centre rope out as long as possible and it behaves like a big elastic band, taking a lot of the stress off the fairlead. Also wrings the rope out if it is wet. Take a turn and gently check away to ease the strain as you bring the boat to a controlled stop is how I've best seen it put! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 7, 2016 Report Share Posted August 7, 2016 Take a turn and gently check away to ease the strain as you bring the boat to a controlled stop is how I've best seen it put! Yes that is how I have seen horse drawn boats brought to a halt. I usually get the rope around my leg or similar when trying this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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