How to errect a telecoms mast

[Keajre]

Dear Friends,

 

I am starting to stray away from my moorings more and more as time passes. I work from home, home being my 55ft NB. I am looking to install a high gain telecoms antenna to boost signal strength for mobile data reception.

 

I have an idea which antenna to buy, but I wanted some advice about how to install the roof pole. From what I can see, the roof already has a suitable fitting for a small mast pole.

 

So I can logically see the fitting could allow me to house a pole in between the two flanges of the roof fitting. I could drill a hole in the pole and put a bolt through it. That would secure any lateral movement. It would also allow me to raise and lower the pole.

 

How do I keep it raise and supported in both directions though (stop it falling forward or backward)? The boat has railings all around the perimeter of the roof. I was thinking of using a cable from the front (bow) railing. That would stop the pole failing back when raised. In order to stop the raised pole from failing forwarded though, I'd need a cable to run from the stern. There is a cleat half way down a roof. But would look a bit odd and use a lot of cable, plus obstruct walking space on the roof.

 

Hope that makes some vague sense! Any advice would be kindly accepted.

 

Stuart

[MtB]

I'd say that roof fitting is not particularly appropriate.

 

But to comment constructively we'd need some clues about how high your mast needs to be, and what sort of weight and shape of antenna needs to be on it.

 

Once you get higher than about five feet, or and/or the shape of the antenna generates any significant wind resistance, you're likely to need guy ropes once there is any wind with just a roof bracket.

 

A better way might be to have a length of scaffold tube welded vertically to the front face of the cabin, then quite a long and rigid pole could be dropped into it securely.

 

So what height pole do you need? And what does the antenna look like?

[Mendip-Locks]

Hi Stuart I see what you are saying and the picture helps alot.

There is a product called unistrut channel we use in our trade (electrician) the 41mm x 41mm may fit in that gap a peice 300mm long would suffice http://www.thesitebox.com/unistrut-products/3mtr-deep-slotted-unistrut-pre-galv.aspx. You would then need to drill another hole lower than the current one and both bolted through could hold it secure. A product called a spring channel nut http://www.thesitebox.com/long-spring-channel-nuts.aspx fits the unistrut to hold maybe a pipe clamp https://www.erico.com/category.asp?category=R890 to hold your mast. Telescopic window wash pole see here http://www.narrowboat-waiouru.co.uk/search?q=mast . That way I dont think youll need cables to brace it, they will just be a pain to set up every time.

Ade

[Dave Payne]

Think MTB's idea is the simplest, maybe drill a hole through the tube and mast in the same place so you can lock a pin through it, this can be locked and also ensures the mast does not spin in the wind, which of course could create issues with the cable...

[Paul C]

We mounted a telescopic mast at the front of the boat, by drilling and tapping a pair of M6 holes for each bracket, one at the top and one near the bottom. The telescopic mast was in 3 sections so offered a reasonable height with 2 extended, thus allowing its lowest section to remain clamped onto the boat. If you wanted more height still, you could compromise the location of the lowest clamp so the lowest section could also be raised, say half its length. But obviously you have a significant erection well into the sky which can catch the wind etc (we lowered ours or never put it too high in strong winds). Its worth sorting out the clamps so they hold the TV aerial in the right direction, otherwise it gets annoying when the wind catches it and it weathervanes, thus losing your signal you spent ages aligning!!!

[rustydiver]

I've just fitted/ made somthing for my boat.

Used a decorators extension pole 3 sections, cut it down a bit shorter, bolted to my tv bracket so it can fold down. Solwise omni directional antenna LGE 4g.

There are another 2 sections inside to make it higher.

I get a good solid 3G where my phone gets nought inside and beside the boat.

I put the tv aerial on the second pole so I can loosen the mast pole make it higher and spin the aerial to get reception when we are moved.

Edited May 24, 2016 by rustydiver

[Sea Dog]

For a minute there I thought you'd gone and put all that stuff on the roof of a Narrowboat!

[rustydiver]

No more mast envey for me if I see one bigger I can make my erection bigger.

[Arthur Brown]

Lots depends on what unit you intend to fit up there and how high you think you want/need to go. Look in military and or fire service surplus for pneumatic extending masts (used for comms and lighting support.) get it fitted to a vertical wall in the bow or stern. Remember that anything that sticks out will get knocked off if you hit it with a tunnel roof, so something that hides below roof level is good.

 

What are you going to use to get the signal down the mast? USB is limited to 5m, fancy cable with RF connectors can lose more signal than they transmit due to cable losses.

 

I use a 65mm square device from EE that seems to catch mobile broadband in most places (east coast of the Wash was very slow) it tethers to a USB port that also powers and charges it . SO FAR it's faultless but get a big enough package of data! Due to the USB link it must be within 5m of it's host computer.

 

HOWEVER it was my opinion that part of the advantage of the cut was being away from the rat race!

 

Ultimately Satellite broadband is great for speed but horrendous for latency, you WILL need a dish.

 

If you use an EE Osprey (or the like) you will need a small plastic box at the top of your "pole", if you use the standard USB mobile broadband dongle, maybe you could use a simple USB cable up a length of plastic conduit or overflow pipe with a stop end. Keeping it waterproof during the winter will be an issue..

 

Be aware that with an osprey unit it sends WiFi as well as USB so there is a slight possibility that others may piggyback on your data.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Arthur Brown

[Keajre]

Thank you all for so many replies, this gives me loads of ideas and enough direction and xamples to get me going. Really appreciated thanks so much

[MtB]

Thank you all for so many replies, this gives me loads of ideas and enough direction and xamples to get me going. Really appreciated thanks so much

 

 

How about answering some of the questions asked for details about what you need to put on the mast?

[Keajre]

I'd say that roof fitting is not particularly appropriate.

 

But to comment constructively we'd need some clues about how high your mast needs to be, and what sort of weight and shape of antenna needs to be on it.

 

Once you get higher than about five feet, or and/or the shape of the antenna generates any significant wind resistance, you're likely to need guy ropes once there is any wind with just a roof bracket.

 

A better way might be to have a length of scaffold tube welded vertically to the front face of the cabin, then quite a long and rigid pole could be dropped into it securely.

 

So what height pole do you need? And what does the antenna look like?

 

Hello,

 

The anntenna would be something like this:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omni-Directional-4G-3G-LTE-MIMO-External-Antenna-for-D-Link-DWR-921-DWR921-/231470591295?hash=item35e4b8ed3f:g:NkkAAOSwP8hTxorE

 

I was thinking around 5ft tall to make it as high as feasibly possible. I assumed Id have to use guy ropes, however seeing the post from Sea Dog is interesting. I am presently building a solar box for a new mono solar panel. I might try to adapt a platform on the box itself and house a pole on that, pretty much copy Sea Dog.

 

I havent done enough research on the benefits of height yet. If just a two foot pole ontop of a solar box will suffice then id be happy with that.

 

Thanks for your reply

[Keajre]

I'd say that roof fitting is not particularly appropriate.

 

But to comment constructively we'd need some clues about how high your mast needs to be, and what sort of weight and shape of antenna needs to be on it.

 

Once you get higher than about five feet, or and/or the shape of the antenna generates any significant wind resistance, you're likely to need guy ropes once there is any wind with just a roof bracket.

 

A better way might be to have a length of scaffold tube welded vertically to the front face of the cabin, then quite a long and rigid pole could be dropped into it securely.

 

So what height pole do you need? And what does the antenna look like?

Any idea what that cleat (the one in the picture I attached) is actually for? Considering cutting it off, filling, and re-painting it as Ive never had a use for it

[Sea Dog]

 

I might try to adapt a platform on the box itself and house a pole on that, pretty much copy Sea Dog.

 

It is indeed a beautiful thing, but I can't take credit for it as it's Rustydiver's creation. Anyway, I've had enough bother front stuff up masts in my time that I'm quite enjoying my highest point being the coolie hat on my chimney

 

By the way, you do realise that if you cut those brackets off, you'll immediately come up with something that could have used them, even if it's just something you need to fasten a padlock to.

[Keajre]

It is indeed a beautiful thing, but I can't take credit for it as it's Rustydiver's creation. Anyway, I've had enough bother front stuff up masts in my time that I'm quite enjoying my highest point being the coolie hat on my chimney

 

By the way, you do realise that if you cut those brackets off, you'll immediately come up with something that could have used them, even if it's just something you need to fasten a padlock to.

Do you find that kind of height gives enough gain for the antenna? Is higher better in your experience? I think if I use my solar box as the base for the pole mounting, then I dont need to drill into the steel roof.

 

Ye you're right, I'll leave it, didnt think of that, would be useful for padlocking something up in the future :-)

Edited May 25, 2016 by Keajre

[MtB]

 

Hello,

 

The anntenna would be something like this:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omni-Directional-4G-3G-LTE-MIMO-External-Antenna-for-D-Link-DWR-921-DWR921-/231470591295?hash=item35e4b8ed3f:g:NkkAAOSwP8hTxorE

 

I was thinking around 5ft tall to make it as high as feasibly possible. I assumed Id have to use guy ropes, however seeing the post from Sea Dog is interesting. I am presently building a solar box for a new mono solar panel. I might try to adapt a platform on the box itself and house a pole on that, pretty much copy Sea Dog.

 

I havent done enough research on the benefits of height yet. If just a two foot pole ontop of a solar box will suffice then id be happy with that.

 

Thanks for your reply

 

Ok thanks! That thing would catch the wind and put a fair load on the end of the pole on a windy or blustery day so I think the pole fitting needs to be substantial, but it all hinges on how high it needs to be so yes, get this decided before committing to having steelwork done! The necessary height will vary with location I'd imagine, so a telescopic arrangement seems a good idea. As others have mentioned, cable length and therefore mast height is an issue...

[MtB]

Any idea what that cleat (the one in the picture I attached) is actually for? Considering cutting it off, filling, and re-painting it as Ive never had a use for it

 

 

I can't make sense of it at all. I'd say it was designed for a bolt to pass through but no idea why. Is there another roof fitting elsewhere it is possibly paired with?

 

Is it possibly for attaching a centre line? Where on the roof is it?

[Keajre]

 

Ok thanks! That thing would catch the wind and put a fair load on the end of the pole on a windy or blustery day so I think the pole fitting needs to be substantial, but it all hinges on how high it needs to be so yes, get this decided before committing to having steelwork done! The necessary height will vary with location I'd imagine, so a telescopic arrangement seems a good idea. As others have mentioned, cable length and therefore mast height is an issue...

 

I see your point. If it was too high, and not strong enough the wind would likely bring it down. I was just looking at LCD mounts with pole fittings.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Monitor-Mount-Mounting-Bracket/dp/B00435PNQO/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1464173670&sr=8-3&keywords=lcd+pole+mount

 

Strong, takes adjustable pole size, and the mount (intended to the back of the LCD) could be mounted onto the side of my solar box. The solar box is very strong (I made it that way!) so should provide the support. Then I can easily remove the pole when travelling, and for low bridges. With a fairly substantial pole it should stand up to the wind in theory.

 

I like the telescopic pole idea, thanks. That would be a useful addition to the design.

[Keajre]

 

Ok thanks! That thing would catch the wind and put a fair load on the end of the pole on a windy or blustery day so I think the pole fitting needs to be substantial, but it all hinges on how high it needs to be so yes, get this decided before committing to having steelwork done! The necessary height will vary with location I'd imagine, so a telescopic arrangement seems a good idea. As others have mentioned, cable length and therefore mast height is an issue...

 

I can't make sense of it at all. I'd say it was designed for a bolt to pass through but no idea why. Is there another roof fitting elsewhere it is possibly paired with?

 

Is it possibly for attaching a centre line? Where on the roof is it?

 

Well, there is another one yes, I just took a pic. You can see one ajacent to the chimney and one down at the other end (the one I orignally posted the pic of) . One at the front, one in the middle. The one at the front has a gap and a bolt hole through it. The one in the middle is just a single plate with a hole and shackle. Odd! I think best use case would probably be as Sea Dog mentioned . . . for padlocking stuff to them, or maybe for bow / centre ropes.

Edited May 25, 2016 by Keajre

[Sea Dog]

From that picture, particularly just for a Comms antenna with little weight or windage, I would have thought a simple tube between the two lugs with a bolt passing through it as a securing and pivot point would work well. Folding flat to the roof when cruising, held upright by guy lines from the "railings" when moored and using comms, you'd have something workable under most conditions. That seems a bit obvious though, so I'm missing something I fear.

[NickAndAnne]

That picture looks like a S W Durham boat like ours.

 

If so, the extra mount was for a small flag pole/mast, so I was told when we bought ours.

[rustydiver]

Hello,

 

The anntenna would be something like this:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Omni-Directional-4G-3G-LTE-MIMO-External-Antenna-for-D-Link-DWR-921-DWR921-/231470591295?hash=item35e4b8ed3f:g:NkkAAOSwP8hTxorE

 

I was thinking around 5ft tall to make it as high as feasibly possible. I assumed Id have to use guy ropes, however seeing the post from Sea Dog is interesting. I am presently building a solar box for a new mono solar panel. I might try to adapt a platform on the box itself and house a pole on that, pretty much copy Sea Dog.

 

I havent done enough research on the benefits of height yet. If just a two foot pole ontop of a solar box will suffice then id be happy with that.

 

Thanks for your reply

If you're going to get one off them omni directional aerials get it direct from Solwise it's cheaper with free delivery.

http://www.solwise.co.uk/3g-antenna-outdoor.htm. That's where I got mine from.

 

Paired it up with http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/tp-link-archer-mr200-4g-lte-wi-fi-router-with-sim-card-slot-a54xu?cmpid=ppc&gclid=COHztvq_9cwCFe8W0wodIk8J4w so it uses both cables off the antenna.

Raised about 4ft above the boat I get a good solid 3G at about 35mbps when I tested it at home on the table 4g and near 70mbps. Which is not far off my landline broadband.

 

The router accepted my sim card out off my iPhone, 3 unlimited data when I tried it out. But now I got a 3 12gb 12months data card can't remember if it was £20 or £30 just to see how long it will last. We only use it weekend and holidays. Plus if our phones get network service I use that.

Edited May 25, 2016 by rustydiver