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Off The Cut - CRT and evictions


Felshampo

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Which rules are being changed by the ref then?

 

And what sanctions are being handed out beyond their powers? Given a court rubber stamps all evictions?

no answer to my question then?

Clarence dock, Leeds

...and there's a problem with 'dumpers' in Leeds?

Which rules are being changed by the ref then?

 

And what sanctions are being handed out beyond their powers? Given a court rubber stamps all evictions?

CRT aren't doing all that well in court at the moment, or haven't you noticed?

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you're moving your goalposts ( do you work for CRT? oh, no I see you've got a boat ) although the new ground is no less firm.

1. this topic is about the film Off the Cut. Would you like to list all the non-boaters in it?

2. this group sorts itself out, one winter, cheap housing people leave, those who grow to love the canals stay.

3. interesting that I would have you as one of those who would argue boating is not cheaper than a house, am I wrong?

I have two boats.

I'm talking about the topic in discussion which is the enforcement.

Most boats these days have good heating, etc. For me people leave because of power generation.

Boats come in all sizes, but on the whole boating is cheaper than a house and especially in certain areas.

 

Me personally like to travel and could do so whilst still "making a journey". However I wouldn't want to do it every year or all the time, so I have a home mooring. If I was to CC I could find myself just wanting to stay in one area and my traveling would become less and less.

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...and there's a problem with 'dumpers' in Leeds?

?

It's getting more noticeable. Clarence Dock has an issue with over stayers, it has electric and water at every visitor mooring point, but is quite a short length of visitor mooring (3-4 boats).

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It's getting more noticeable. Clarence Dock has an issue with over stayers, it has electric and water at every visitor mooring point, but is quite a short length of visitor mooring (3-4 boats).

 

I was there last week and along that pontoon there was 1 narrowboat, moored with 8ft in front of him and then 3 plastic cruisers spaced out at regular intervals with about 10ft between each. The end space is for the water taxi, so there was nowhere to moor there. Speaking to one of the trip boats later they said those boats had been there almost 2 weeks now. Very annoying!

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Anyway, now I'm logged in, here's my take on the film. I actually felt sorry for the kid to be honest. His mother/parents had put him into a position where he wasn't home schooled for some time as they were just so stressed, and then he was then crying himself to sleep for a week or so as he was going to lose his home. He also took the selling / losing of his toys very well and bravely. I'd probably have had a tantrum at that age!.

 

And to stop this happening... all his mother / parents had to do was to move their boat around a bit. It's not really too much to ask to be honest. I wouldn't do that to my children for a principle / or whatever reason they decided to fight the system. I'd be ashamed what I'd put them through.

 

Also, please don't attack me with things like "she's a great mother", "you don't know the circumstances" etc, all I know is the actions of the mother / parents caused this to happen to him.

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Confused. So an ironic ad-hominem attack on yourself is enough for someone ( so insignificant I've forgotten his name ) concludes you 'win' the debate.

 

I'm a dork.

 

There you go. I win.

Hurrah! We have a winner!!

Not sure how much that adds to the debate, any more than calling me a bigot did, but I'm glad you're happy.

Thank gods for the engine bits of this forum, where people don't throw insults around just because you don't know why the big metal thing isn't going bang any more.

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The difference lies in the longer game. Agreed, one single boater CMing causes no harm.

 

But sooner or later, others see the advantage and pitch up too. Eventually a handy area is filled with static boaters each individually causing no harm, but collectively they have stuffed the canal. And all the time, the boaters nearby who play the game and pay for a home mooring feel faintly like idiots for paying for a mooring instead of claiming their own bit of free towpath too.

!00% agree !! CRT Have be be in a strong position to enforce ALL rules Or 5 /10 years down the line they won't be able to enforce anything. one boat or 100 boats makes no matter, rules have to be enforced or or we all won't like what will happen .

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Well don't do it again Arthur.

I really wish you'd learn to read. I realise you are illiterate, but once again I am forced to point out that it was bassplayer who called me a bigot, which I resent. But as there is no future in trying to bring the truth to fools, I think I shall retire from this thread before we get moderated. Edited by Arthur Marshall
  • Greenie 2
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I really wish you'd learn to read. I realise you are illiterate, but once again I am forced to point out that it was bassplayer who called me a bigot, which I resent. But as there is no future in trying to bring the truth to fools, I think I shall retire from this thread before we get moderated.

 

 

Someone on another forum I frequent has a signature on this subject I quite like:

 

You can lead a fool to wisdom, but you can't make him think.

 

Very true and amply illustrated in this thread,.

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But what difference does it make? As long as no-one is causing harm to others or to their environment, what's the difference? And what if the lower cost of living on a boat, compared to a house or flat, makes it attractive enough to overcome its disadvantages enough to make it a tipping point- but the person also enjoys cruising and being on the boat for its own sake?

It doesn't make much difference to the world if one person empties their Porta Potty in the cut, just think if everyone does it. Who would pay for a mooring if they could just park their boat for free

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Anyway, now I'm logged in, here's my take on the film. I actually felt sorry for the kid to be honest. His mother/parents had put him into a position where he wasn't home schooled for some time as they were just so stressed, and then he was then crying himself to sleep for a week or so as he was going to lose his home. He also took the selling / losing of his toys very well and bravely. I'd probably have had a tantrum at that age!.

 

And to stop this happening... all his mother / parents had to do was to move their boat around a bit. It's not really too much to ask to be honest. I wouldn't do that to my children for a principle / or whatever reason they decided to fight the system. I'd be ashamed what I'd put them through.

 

Also, please don't attack me with things like "she's a great mother", "you don't know the circumstances" etc, all I know is the actions of the mother / parents caused this to happen to him.

I didn't watch the video but if your comments are accurate then I agree that it is completely out of order.

 

I have small children. I want them to know how the world works but there is a limit. They are children.

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For me, this part of your post just about sums up the jealousy and bigotry I see time and tume again here. It's almost like some don't want to learn the truth.

 

Why should anyone be expected to pay for a mooring and facilities they wouldn't use? This whole concept of boaters living off the back of other boaters who pay for a mooring is just wrong and misguided.

 

As for those without licences. Aren't some of them contributing through benefits but CRT don't actually issue them a licence?

 

 

Can you expand on this please? I don't think this is true.

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Maybe I didn't make myself clear. I'll try again, as far as possible using words with only one syllable.

Some people live on their boats and continually cruise. They have a licence, don't need a home mooring, and so don't pay for one. This is a good thing.

Some people want to stay in the same place for one reason or another, and live on their boats. They rent a mooring. They have a licence and, if they need one, a mooring permit. This too is a good thing.

Some people want to stay in the same place, and do, and don't want to pay for a mooring, so they don't, though they could (though it might be a struggle or they might have to move somewhere slightly less convenient). But they have a licence. This is a con and therefore not a good thing.

Some people just want somewhere to live, because for one reason or another they are homeless. They can't afford either a licence or a mooring, but have got hold of a boat and live on it. This is a different problem, because people have to live somewhere. It is not the same problem as number three above, because if you put people on the street (or the towpath) ultimately they die. This then moves into a political matter, not a CRT one.

But the last case ones tend to cause less trouble than the third case, because it is entirely in their interests to stay under the radar, out of the way and out of trouble.

I'm very sorry if this makes me a bigot racked by jealousy, though I'm not sure who I'm supposed to be jealous of or who I'm bigoted against.

Maybe I didn't make myself clear. I'll try again, as far as possible using words with only one syllable.

Some people live on their boats and continually cruise. They have a licence, don't need a home mooring, and so don't pay for one. This is a good thing.

Some people want to stay in the same place for one reason or another, and live on their boats. They rent a mooring. They have a licence and, if they need one, a mooring permit. This too is a good thing.

Some people want to stay in the same place, and do, and don't want to pay for a mooring, so they don't, though they could (though it might be a struggle or they might have to move somewhere slightly less convenient). But they have a licence. This is a con and therefore not a good thing.

Some people just want somewhere to live, because for one reason or another they are homeless. They can't afford either a licence or a mooring, but have got hold of a boat and live on it. This is a different problem, because people have to live somewhere. It is not the same problem as number three above, because if you put people on the street (or the towpath) ultimately they die. This then moves into a political matter, not a CRT one.

But the last case ones tend to cause less trouble than the third case, because it is entirely in their interests to stay under the radar, out of the way and out of trouble.

I'm very sorry if this makes me a bigot racked by jealousy, though I'm not sure who I'm supposed to be jealous of or who I'm bigoted against.

I thought that benefits, including housing benefit, can be claimed by permanent liveaboards. This, if applicable in the cases cited, puts a different complexion some aspects of the debate.
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I thought that benefits, including housing benefit, can be claimed by permanent liveaboards. This, if applicable in the cases cited, puts a different complexion some aspects of the debate.

 

I know of people who claim benefits and get the following PAID for :

Mooring fees

Licence

Insurance.

BSS

 

In effect, their major boating costs are paid for, for them.

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I know of people who claim benefits and get the following PAID for :

Mooring fees

Licence

Insurance.

BSS

 

In effect, their major boating costs are paid for, for them.

 

According to my other half who knows about such things anyone who's sole residence is a boat and who is eligible for housing benefit would be able to claim mooring fees and council tax support -100% or less depending on several things but not the BSC and Insurance. In regards to license she would need to check the legislation but thinks probably not. There's so many ifs and buts each individual would need to check with their local council to be certain what their entitlement would be.

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Someone on another forum I frequent has a signature on this subject I quite like:

 

You can lead a fool to wisdom, but you can't make him think.

 

Very true and amply illustrated in this thread,.

I quite like your signature Mike, pity you don't take heed to it sometimes...

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According to my other half who knows about such things anyone who's sole residence is a boat and who is eligible for housing benefit would be able to claim mooring fees and council tax support -100% or less depending on several things but not the BSC and Insurance. In regards to license she would need to check the legislation but thinks probably not. There's so many ifs and buts each individual would need to check with their local council to be certain what their entitlement would be.

 

Indeed - there are huge variations in what can be claimed due to 'postcode lottery', but in the area in which this particular person is in 'everything is covered', and the council are currently looking at refitting the bathroom to make it 'easier to use' for this persons disability.

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Indeed - there are huge variations in what can be claimed due to 'postcode lottery', but in the area in which this particular person is in 'everything is covered', and the council are currently looking at refitting the bathroom to make it 'easier to use' for this persons disability.

Perhaps disability comes into it as well.

Bob

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If I remember correctly forum member 'smelly' was involved in helping 'boating people' get the benefits to which the were entitled.

 

He actually cited legislation and prior successful cases and could be contacted for further help.

 

He doesn't appear to post anymore, but someone 'in the know' may be able to pull up some of his old posts.

 

Edit - Smelly was posting a couple of weeks ago. maybe he will read this and 'jump in'

Here is his profile

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showuser=838

 

Having been here for a number of years I feel compelled to tell anyone who's looking something about me...

 

I am a "welfare rights adviser" who is audited to the same level as a solicitor; some solicitors ask my advice in specific areas of law. I'm rather good at immigration law and have partaken in certain precedent setting cases as EU law has come further into the administration of benefits. It's rather nice to know that Judges who earn 5 or 6 times what I do ask my opinion of stuff.

Edited by Alan de Enfield
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