Was I silly to expect my PC to run on shore power?

[WotEver]

I still think it's the PC. Coincidence that it worked at the office. Old desktop PCs don't like to be moved and it would be good to reseat all the cards (including the RAM modules).

 

Tony

[Justme]

I still think it's the PC. Coincidence that it worked at the office. Old desktop PCs don't like to be moved and it would be good to reseat all the cards (including the RAM modules).

 

Tony

 

 

Me too.

[bassplayer]

Did you see anything on the VDU when you plugged it in on the boat? If not, maybe the VDU cable wasn't plugged in securely.

[David Mack]

Did you see anything on the VDU when you plugged it in on the boat? If not, maybe the VDU cable wasn't plugged in securely.

 

Or maybe its just the display that doesn't like the power supply, and the PC has booted up just fine (but unseen).

[Paul C]

One thing to try is to disconnect all the hard disk power leads then retry booting it up. It won't boot to the OS, but it will show something on the screen to show its gotten so far. I am wondering if the PC's power supply is marginal and combined with a variation of AC supply at the marina, won't boot as-is.

And definitely try it too, on inverter only (shoreline disconnected). I wonder if its an earth fault?

[colinwilks]

The fact that the pc travels between three locations but only fails at the middle one seems to indicate it's not loose boards. I believe that pcs are intolerant of reversed polarity supplies, but that simpler devices are not. A three pin plug polarity tester would confirm the socket is wired correctly.

[Chewbacka]

The fact that the pc travels between three locations but only fails at the middle one seems to indicate it's not loose boards. I believe that pcs are intolerant of reversed polarity supplies, but that simpler devices are not. A three pin plug polarity tester would confirm the socket is wired correctly.

Desk top pc units usually have a beep code if memory or video cards are not right.

So did it make any beeps when you powered it up on the boat?

If so a quick google for the BIOS beep codes would tell you what is wrong.

As I asked earlier, does the monitor display anything?

[Phil Ambrose]

Voltage of marina supply could be the cause, we often find that our voltage has dropped to below 200v while this doesn't effect anything we have I have noticed that if we use the microwave, it takes longer to nuke stuff.

Phil

Edited February 23, 2016 by Phil Ambrose

[WotEver]

Voltage of marina supply could be the cause...

I doubt it.

 

As has been already mentioned in this thread most PC PSUs will be happy from 120V to 240V. It's cheaper to make them that way than to have different supplies for US and Europe.

 

Until OP has assured us that he has reseated all the boards when it was on the boat (and confirmed the monitor was plugged in and switched on) I don't believe it has anything whatsoever to do with the mains.

 

Tony

[cuthound]

I have twice experienced a serious problem with 3 phase supplies;

The first instance was at my work place, a neutral cable became disconnected in a distribution cupboard, this caused damage to around 150 computers and printers, the phase voltage had risen to over 300v at times.

More recently I was puzzled by random tripping of RCDs at our moorings- checking phase voltages showed variation between 180 and 320v at various times. The problem was similar to above mentioned, it turned out to be a neutral break in the supply in the street. The supply company was there in double quick time when I reported it, to repair what can be a very dangerous condition. Although no equipment actually failed, it must have put electrical stress on many appliances.

 

 

What you have described are neutral faults. Nothing to do with three phase, except that the neutral is common to both.

 

As I said, any mains 240 volt supply is derived from a three phase supply. In a street of houses for example, the first house is on L1 and the common neutral, the second on L2 & neutral and the third on L3 & neutral, repeated until all houses are supplied. The same principle will apply tovmarina pontoons.

 

Only equipment requiring a three phase supply is provided with one, for example industrial motors etc, to limit the number of people exposed to 415 volts.

 

Edited for phat phingers.

Edited February 23, 2016 by cuthound

[billh]

What you have described are neutral faults. Nothing to do with three phase, except that the neutral is common to both.

 

As I said, any mains 240 volt supply is derived from a three phase supply. In a street of houses for example, the first house is on L1 and the common neutral, the second on L2 & neutral and the third on L3 & neutral, repeated until all houses are supplied. The same principle will apply tovmarina pontoons.

 

Only equipment requiring a three phase supply is provided with one, for example industrial motors etc, to limit the number of people exposed to 415 volts.

 

Edited for phat phingers.

Yes, neutral faults, very serious as each phase, if the neutral is broken (in this case 200 yards up the street), tries to return via the other phases(downstream of the break) and because the loads on each phase are constantly changing , i.e. in marinas or street of houses , the phase voltage is all over the place, depending on the separate loads on each phase, not necessarily balanced. If I have got that wrong, why was the supply company very very keen to disconnect the supply until they fixed the fault ? It usually takes them ages to respond to e.g. a loss of supply. They were on site checking within 10 minutes of my reporting it.

[Paul C]

Apologies to the 'old lags' who no doubt have seen similar queries before but I couldn't immediately find any such previous threads.

 

Our boat is currently in a marina and plugged in to shore power. We have a 2.5KW Victron Phoenix charger/invertor currently set to 'charge only' My understanding is that this means the 240V shore power is being passed straight through (the 240V washing machine certainly works OK!).

 

Have just fetched a desktop PC onto the boat and it won't boot up. The power lights come on and the fan runs a bit but it won't actually boot. I've tried said PC at my work office and it boots fine, so it seems that the 240V being provided to the boat isn't up to snuff.

 

Can anyone explain what is likely to be going on and if there is any work around?

 

Much appreciated.

 

Whilst in theory the desktop PC should work, and I hope we can reach a conclusion for its fix, pragmatically 99.9% of boaters use a laptop:

 

1) More compact - including built in keyboard/screen - ideal for a boat

2) Probably cheaper these days once the cost of the screen is taken into account

3) More tolerant of dodgy power

4) Can run with no mains for periods of a time

5) Slightly more rugged - been designed for moving around, shocks, etc

 

Also, these days you can buy a laptop (or upgrade one) with large hard disk, bigger screen, powerful graphics card, etc

 

 

 

I hope you can get the desktop PC working though. There's now plenty of ideas to try out.

Edited February 23, 2016 by Paul C

[RufusR]

just to confirm it is not an inverter issue as Victrons pass the marina supply straight through to your sockets in charge only mode . Just a thought , I used to be in the PSU business back in the day hence this might be very out of date info but alot of cheaper far eastern computers power supplies used to be very fussy about getting a perfect 50hz sine wave supply and any deviance from the frequency meant the PSU's wouldnt regulate the voltages properly hence the DC-DC converters in side would drop out and computers would do funny things including not boot . As said this was very much back in the day of late last century and I would hope standards of PSU are better no days but given the terrible clone chargers etc that are currently available on the interweb I would not be surprised .

 

If the marina is not providing a perfect 50hz supply then this could be an issue , the washing machine wouldnt care but the delicate electronics in a computer would .

 

Just a thought .

[steve_timebeck]

Not all Victron inverter/chargers pass through the shoreline supply when "charger only" is selected. It depends on the model and how it is wired / configured.

 

Older units usually do NOT pass throught the shoreline when "charger only" is selected.

[Paul C]

Not all Victron inverter/chargers pass through the shoreline supply when "charger only" is selected. It depends on the model and how it is wired / configured.

 

Older units usually do NOT pass throught the shoreline when "charger only" is selected.

 

But the "washing machine test" renders this a non-issue and a red herring.

[Jim Riley]

 

Whilst in theory the desktop PC should work, and I hope we can reach a conclusion for its fix, pragmatically 99.9% of boaters use a laptop:

 

1) More compact - including built in keyboard/screen - ideal for a boat

2) Probably cheaper these days once the cost of the screen is taken into account

3) More tolerant of dodgy power

4) Can run with no mains for periods of a time

5) Slightly more rugged - been designed for moving around, shocks, etc

 

Also, these days you can buy a laptop (or upgrade one) with large hard disk, bigger screen, powerful graphics card, etc

 

 

 

I hope you can get the desktop PC working though. There's now plenty of ideas to try out.

Maplins also do a 12v dc to 19v dc converter, no inverter needed.

[WarringtonWhite]

Just an obvious question and one that you have already thought about but........ W

hen you tested your PC 1.at home 2. on the boat 3. in the office, did you use the same monitor. If not then I would hook the monitor up to another PC that you know is working and check that.

[haggis]

It couldn't be a problem with a particular socket on the boat?

Perhaps worth (if you haven't already tried it) trying the PC in another socket

 

Just a thought

Haggis

[nbfiresprite]

Is the OP pluging the base unit into a monitor? As I suspect that he pluged in to the vga socket on his TV. If this is the case, he may have to switch the TV mode from freeview to vga, as not all TV's are auto sensing.

[mango]

Need to a get volt meter on the mains. Also check polarity.

It seems to keep changing every 10 milliseconds.

[Justme]

The fact that the pc travels between three locations but only fails at the middle one seems to indicate it's not loose boards. I believe that pcs are intolerant of reversed polarity supplies, but that simpler devices are not. A three pin plug polarity tester would confirm the socket is wired correctly.

 

 

Mains has no stead polarity.

just to confirm it is not an inverter issue as Victrons pass the marina supply straight through to your sockets in charge only mode . Just a thought , I used to be in the PSU business back in the day hence this might be very out of date info but alot of cheaper far eastern computers power supplies used to be very fussy about getting a perfect 50hz sine wave supply and any deviance from the frequency meant the PSU's wouldnt regulate the voltages properly hence the DC-DC converters in side would drop out and computers would do funny things including not boot . As said this was very much back in the day of late last century and I would hope standards of PSU are better no days but given the terrible clone chargers etc that are currently available on the interweb I would not be surprised .

 

If the marina is not providing a perfect 50hz supply then this could be an issue , the washing machine wouldnt care but the delicate electronics in a computer would .

 

Just a thought .

 

 

All grid mains will have steady 50hz supplies.

[StephenA]

 

 

All grid mains will have steady 50hz supplies.

 

And Computer PSUs are not only 110 to 240/50 volts capable but also 50 - 60 Hz capable too.

[WotEver]

Geez... Are folk in this thread STILL suggesting it has something to do with the mains? It's the PC folks. Or the monitor.

 

Tony

[MtB]

Geez... Are folk in this thread STILL suggesting it has something to do with the mains? It's the PC folks. Or the monitor.

 

Tony

 

 

You mean the PC that works fine in the office is faulty?

 

I too suspect the monitor is failing to display rather than the PC not booting... But until the OP answers the post asking what fault code beeps are being emitted (if any) during the supposed failed boot up, we are all just guessing.

[colinwilks]

 

 

Mains has no stead polarity.

 

 

You're quite right of course, but there's still a niggle in the back of my mind about this (it's thirty years or so since I took a PC to bits). I seem to recall some computer components look for AC with a particular orientation of hot and neutral.

 

The OP says that something happens when switching on (lights on and fan going) but the machine will not start. The machine works at two other locations, which tends to argue against a pcb having come loose. On the boat there seems to be AC present at the PC which it appears part of the machine does not like. Worth checking the supply I'd have thought, if only to eliminate a variable?

 

I think I would recognise the boot up noises made by a pc if the monitor wasn't displaying anything, but it'll be interesting to hear what the OP says about this.

 

Why has this topic grabbed my attention? Where's my anorak?