Sail away location fit out

[jddevel]

Some of you may have been watching/contributing to my topic on mooring location south of Birmingham and seen my latest post but this is my question.

Where on the canal network is there a location to complete on the hard a sailaway 57 ft hull with "co-operative yard owners who do not mind DIYers.

My reason for asking is that having seemingly found are boat of desire we visited yesterday for a second viewing deposit cash in hand having agreed a price nearly £20000 over our original budget. Well this time unlike last week alone spent 4 days looking at some 15 plus online researched boats we spent a good deal of time looking at the boat in detail. Needless to say having spent nearly 5 hrs travelling there we spent 5 hrs travelling back still with our cash deposit.

So we come to the real topic subject. Having spent some 40 odd years in the new build/renovation property market which included all major work such as electrical work, plumbing including under floor heating, bespoke timber windows and doors, hard wood flooring plus obviously the less details the only way we are going to get something to our satisfaction using my own fitters is to buy a sailaway.

Therefore two questions.

1) Recommended manufacturers

2) A sensible location for us to complete the internal fit out if not readily available at the hull manufacturers location. I envisage 18 to 20 weeks on the hard.

Look forward to your advice- especially who to avoid. PM me if worried about putting in the public domain

[Seti-Yeti]

Cornwall... a bit dry of canals round them thar parts.

 

I can only offer one location based on personal experience: Wincham Wharf (in Lostock Gralam - yes, I know)

 

Twenty odd years ago I put my wooded broads cruiser there to restore. Good access and level standing. Wooden boats weren't quite their thing so advice was thin on the ground but I was left to my own devices which was fine. The same owner is still there and I have no doubt the same attitude prevails. Trouble is, it's up in't north west like...

[KenK]

If you are based in Cornwall and your workforce is there why not forget the canal network. You simply need a somewhere close to home / workforce, hull there on a truck, fit out and return to the canal once it is complete. The general consensus is fitting out can take a lot longer than your current schedule. You need to factor in the cost of moving the boat but could offset that against the cost and time of moving a workforce and / or yourself to a boat located on a canal hard standing somewhere.

 

Ken

[dor]

A number of marinas have hard standing for boats which allow DIY work, usually with power available. E.g. Aqueduct Marina on the Middlewich branch.

 

Don't forget that fitting out a boat takes three times as long as you estimate and costs twice as much.

[Tony Brooks]

A while ago I read about a farmer who dug a "canal" on his land upstream of Plymouth to allow a friend to fit out his narrowboat. I have no idea where I read it, could be WWW, canal Boat or Towpath Telegraph. The article was about taking the boat down to Plymouth Dockyard for lifting out to transport to the canals.

 

Self fit-outs take far longer than people think they will so if you can do it near home it saves time. Maybe worth nosing about a bit in case you can locate the farmer and he wants a bit of income. However you will have to factor in transport and craning costs.

[Chalky]

I fitted out my own boat whilst it was in the water. I put a detailed plan together and estimated it would take about a year of spare time. I have lots of DIY experience in house repairs and modernisation. Fitting a boat is different to a house. The electrics are similar, but different enough. The plumbing is similar, but different etc. Skills will carry across, designs and methods used don't always. The regulations for boats are not the same as the building regs. Also the logic of the build order is very different - you need to nail down the design very early and keep to it. In our case we took the boat out for its forst day drip 4 years after starting and our first holiday was taken 5 years from deliver.

[ralphclaydon]

My first fitout 54 foot trad. took me 5 years, the second fit out a 57 foot trad took 3 years,

I know one person who said it would take 6 months, Coming on 6 years and still not in the water!!!

[bottle]

Before you even start to think of fitting out yourself, you may wish to 'gen up' on the RCD (Recreational Craft Directive)

 

It states the requirements that the boat should be built to, although you can build to BSS (Boat Safety Scheme) but if you do build to the latter you cannot sell. legally, for five years after completion.

 

Your skills will be useful but remember working in a house etc is not like working in a boat that is only 7' wide (actually less inside).

 

Your timetable may well be feasible but everyone I have spoken to, that fitted out their own boat, has said it takes a lot longer and costs a lot more as well.

 

Ps. Have a look at build times from the 'professionals' and they have been doing it for a long time (well most of them have)

[Chalky]

 

Your skills will be useful but remember working in a house etc is not like working in a boat that is only 7' wide (actually less inside).

 

 

Good point. Using the cabin as a work shop and store room whilst fitting it out really slowed things down. I was always moving things or sweeping up before I could move on to the next job. It was also common to have to carry what I was working on out onto the tow path so I could turn it round to fit it / work on the other side.

[jddevel]

Thank you for your comments and observations. One thing appears clear and that there are those who having done it have done it again and so obviously not deterred. Regard the logistics of the work I would state the following:

1) I have completed a 3 bed with ensuite etc. detached house with only two other members of staff from excavation of footings with my own plant to handing the keys to the new owner in 26 weeks 51/2 days a week. That included bespoke kitchen hand made in my own workshop.

2) It is anticipated that I will stay away for say 3 weeks at a time so working 7 days a week 12 hours a day (not unusual for us ) in fact the guy probably coming with me has only had a weekend off since last November (excluding three days at Xmas) That`s real work ethic and some could learn from !!! That way hopefully no home disruptions. I have weighed that against transporting nearer to home. Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

3) The logistics of it all are down to planning and planning again- nothing ever runs smoothly. Fortunately we have an extensive array of professional tooling from generator to a multitude of electric and battery tooling which if not with us then such things as sliding carriage saw bench and spindle moulder will be available in the workshop when "at home"

4) Having installed black water tank and new loo in my previously owned cruiser I am familiar with tight spaces which can be compared to some situations that occur in bathrooms, loft spaces or in sewer trenches.

5) Thankfully I have the asset of a carpenter son-in-law whose brother is a qualified marine electrician whose help I hope to engage.

Well after all that outpouring and always up for a challenge- my philosophy is no such word as can`t just physically unable to or don`t know how- none of what has been written so far deters me. Just got to find some where to keep it on the hard whilst working.

Incidentally to that end I have a son who lives in Northampton so frequent visits to the grand children would be in order if I can find something near him.

P.S. None of the above I hope is insulting on your comments just a better insight into my situation.

[Genn]

Thank you for your comments and observations. One thing appears clear and that there are those who having done it have done it again and so obviously not deterred. Regard the logistics of the work I would state the following:

1) I have completed a 3 bed with ensuite etc. detached house with only two other members of staff from excavation of footings with my own plant to handing the keys to the new owner in 26 weeks 51/2 days a week. That included bespoke kitchen hand made in my own workshop.

2) It is anticipated that I will stay away for say 3 weeks at a time so working 7 days a week 12 hours a day (not unusual for us ) in fact the guy probably coming with me has only had a weekend off since last November (excluding three days at Xmas) That`s real work ethic and some could learn from !!! That way hopefully no home disruptions. I have weighed that against transporting nearer to home. Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

3) The logistics of it all are down to planning and planning again- nothing ever runs smoothly. Fortunately we have an extensive array of professional tooling from generator to a multitude of electric and battery tooling which if not with us then such things as sliding carriage saw bench and spindle moulder will be available in the workshop when "at home"

4) Having installed black water tank and new loo in my previously owned cruiser I am familiar with tight spaces which can be compared to some situations that occur in bathrooms, loft spaces or in sewer trenches.

5) Thankfully I have the asset of a carpenter son-in-law whose brother is a qualified marine electrician whose help I hope to engage.

Well after all that outpouring and always up for a challenge- my philosophy is no such word as can`t just physically unable to or don`t know how- none of what has been written so far deters me. Just got to find some where to keep it on the hard whilst working.

Incidentally to that end I have a son who lives in Northampton so frequent visits to the grand children would be in order if I can find something near him.

P.S. None of the above I hope is insulting on your comments just a better insight into my situation.

 

Willowbridge marina on the GU has hardstanding for DIY'rs and are happy for people to work on their own craft. I am there and have had no issues with anyone. And it is quite close to Northampton.

 

Genn

[KenK]

Thank you for your comments and observations. One thing appears clear and that there are those who having done it have done it again and so obviously not deterred. Regard the logistics of the work I would state the following:

1) I have completed a 3 bed with ensuite etc. detached house with only two other members of staff from excavation of footings with my own plant to handing the keys to the new owner in 26 weeks 51/2 days a week. That included bespoke kitchen hand made in my own workshop.

2) It is anticipated that I will stay away for say 3 weeks at a time so working 7 days a week 12 hours a day (not unusual for us ) in fact the guy probably coming with me has only had a weekend off since last November (excluding three days at Xmas) That`s real work ethic and some could learn from !!! That way hopefully no home disruptions. I have weighed that against transporting nearer to home. Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

3) The logistics of it all are down to planning and planning again- nothing ever runs smoothly. Fortunately we have an extensive array of professional tooling from generator to a multitude of electric and battery tooling which if not with us then such things as sliding carriage saw bench and spindle moulder will be available in the workshop when "at home"

4) Having installed black water tank and new loo in my previously owned cruiser I am familiar with tight spaces which can be compared to some situations that occur in bathrooms, loft spaces or in sewer trenches.

5) Thankfully I have the asset of a carpenter son-in-law whose brother is a qualified marine electrician whose help I hope to engage.

Well after all that outpouring and always up for a challenge- my philosophy is no such word as can`t just physically unable to or don`t know how- none of what has been written so far deters me. Just got to find some where to keep it on the hard whilst working.

Incidentally to that end I have a son who lives in Northampton so frequent visits to the grand children would be in order if I can find something near him.

P.S. None of the above I hope is insulting on your comments just a better insight into my situation.

Also Aston Marina on the Trent and Mersey at Stone, not as close to Northampton but not that far with good motorway links.

Aston also has a covered heated paint shed on site with an excellent painter, unless you fancy doing the painting yourself.

 

Ken

[Phil Ambrose]

We had a 50ft widebeam rock up on our marina a couple of years back. The owner of this sailaway was in the building game and reckoned to get all his trade mates in to "blitz it" and reckoned to get it done in 3 months, 2 years on............

Phil

 

(just saying)

[Bod]

Thank you for your comments and observations. One thing appears clear and that there are those who having done it have done it again and so obviously not deterred. Regard the logistics of the work I would state the following:

1) I have completed a 3 bed with ensuite etc. detached house with only two other members of staff from excavation of footings with my own plant to handing the keys to the new owner in 26 weeks 51/2 days a week. That included bespoke kitchen hand made in my own workshop.

2) It is anticipated that I will stay away for say 3 weeks at a time so working 7 days a week 12 hours a day (not unusual for us ) in fact the guy probably coming with me has only had a weekend off since last November (excluding three days at Xmas) That`s real work ethic and some could learn from !!! That way hopefully no home disruptions. I have weighed that against transporting nearer to home. Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

3) The logistics of it all are down to planning and planning again- nothing ever runs smoothly. Fortunately we have an extensive array of professional tooling from generator to a multitude of electric and battery tooling which if not with us then such things as sliding carriage saw bench and spindle moulder will be available in the workshop when "at home"

4) Having installed black water tank and new loo in my previously owned cruiser I am familiar with tight spaces which can be compared to some situations that occur in bathrooms, loft spaces or in sewer trenches.

5) Thankfully I have the asset of a carpenter son-in-law whose brother is a qualified marine electrician whose help I hope to engage.

Well after all that outpouring and always up for a challenge- my philosophy is no such word as can`t just physically unable to or don`t know how- none of what has been written so far deters me. Just got to find some where to keep it on the hard whilst working.

Incidentally to that end I have a son who lives in Northampton so frequent visits to the grand children would be in order if I can find something near him.

P.S. None of the above I hope is insulting on your comments just a better insight into my situation.

 

Please take note of the R.C.D, and Boat Safety Scheme requirement's.

The lack of any part of either, could be very costly to put right.

Think of them as being the waterways equivalent of Building Regs/vehicle M.O.T.

 

Bod

[David Mack]

Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

 

Before you dismiss that option I would talk to a boat mover, or perhaps a local haulage company. Truck drivers can get to some remarkably inaccessible places. The benefit of having all your tools, facilities and suppliers you know etc. close to hand is enormous. And using you own land will save the cost of renting space elsewhere and offset the costs of getting the boat there and back.

[DeanS]

I reckon 2 months solid working on the inside of a boat, could get it to an advanced stage...if you start with a sprayfoamed interior, with ballast in already. You can also buy a lined sailaway which comes with walls, ceilings already done, so you just have to fit bulkheads, shower, kitchen units, lights, plugpoints. I don't know why it takes some people years.......

 

Fitting tongue/groove flooring - 2 long days

Shower - 1 day

Kitchen units - 1 day

Lights - 2 days

Plugs - 2 days

 

The measurement is days, not months and years, if you work long days, have all your supplies ready beforehand, have the right tools. It takes 10% of the time to do 90% of the work, and years to finish the remaining 10% if you have folk move on board before you're done. I stopped work the moment the family moved on board, but it also allowed me to shift the entire design around multiple times, to suit peoples needs. It would have been a bad move (for me) to have fitted everything in expensive oak, and then stood back and said..."we have to live with this design forever". Instead I used cheap ply, and keep changing the interior as needs be. One day I expect I'll say we've got the optimum design, and then do the last 10%. (when the kids have all moved off the boat ;-)

[peterboat]

I reckon 2 months solid working on the inside of a boat, could get it to an advanced stage...if you start with a sprayfoamed interior, with ballast in already. You can also buy a lined sailaway which comes with walls, ceilings already done, so you just have to fit bulkheads, shower, kitchen units, lights, plugpoints. I don't know why it takes some people years.......

 

Fitting tongue/groove flooring - 2 long days

Shower - 1 day

Kitchen units - 1 day

Lights - 2 days

Plugs - 2 days

 

The measurement is days, not months and years, if you work long days, have all your supplies ready beforehand, have the right tools. It takes 10% of the time to do 90% of the work, and years to finish the remaining 10% if you have folk move on board before you're done. I stopped work the moment the family moved on board, but it also allowed me to shift the entire design around multiple times, to suit peoples needs. It would have been a bad move (for me) to have fitted everything in expensive oak, and then stood back and said..."we have to live with this design forever". Instead I used cheap ply, and keep changing the interior as needs be. One day I expect I'll say we've got the optimum design, and then do the last 10%. (when the kids have all moved off the boat ;-)

virtual greenie dean its exactly what i find its the final finishing which is hard heres the choice go for cruise or finish that little job..............................cast off the ropes love

[ditchcrawler]

Thank you for your comments and observations. One thing appears clear and that there are those who having done it have done it again and so obviously not deterred. Regard the logistics of the work I would state the following:

1) I have completed a 3 bed with ensuite etc. detached house with only two other members of staff from excavation of footings with my own plant to handing the keys to the new owner in 26 weeks 51/2 days a week. That included bespoke kitchen hand made in my own workshop.

2) It is anticipated that I will stay away for say 3 weeks at a time so working 7 days a week 12 hours a day (not unusual for us ) in fact the guy probably coming with me has only had a weekend off since last November (excluding three days at Xmas) That`s real work ethic and some could learn from !!! That way hopefully no home disruptions. I have weighed that against transporting nearer to home. Pity I could not get it down the Cornish lanes and on to my own fields-but that is not practical.

3) The logistics of it all are down to planning and planning again- nothing ever runs smoothly. Fortunately we have an extensive array of professional tooling from generator to a multitude of electric and battery tooling which if not with us then such things as sliding carriage saw bench and spindle moulder will be available in the workshop when "at home"

4) Having installed black water tank and new loo in my previously owned cruiser I am familiar with tight spaces which can be compared to some situations that occur in bathrooms, loft spaces or in sewer trenches.

5) Thankfully I have the asset of a carpenter son-in-law whose brother is a qualified marine electrician whose help I hope to engage.

Well after all that outpouring and always up for a challenge- my philosophy is no such word as can`t just physically unable to or don`t know how- none of what has been written so far deters me. Just got to find some where to keep it on the hard whilst working.

Incidentally to that end I have a son who lives in Northampton so frequent visits to the grand children would be in order if I can find something near him.

P.S. None of the above I hope is insulting on your comments just a better insight into my situation.

I would still say get it near your home.

[Tom and Bex]

I would say if possible then get it near your home/workshop.

 

Having said that we fitted our boat out at Debdale Wharf which was a 3hr drive from where we lived in Somerset. Debdale Wharf worked quite well for us as we had friends in Northampton which is quite close to Debdale. They have a large hardstanding area with electric, and a diy heated workshop for hire for painting the boat if required, along with lots of other facilities on site. No connection other than a satisfied customer.

 

Took us about a year to get it liveable on (still not finished!) working for 3 days every other weekend. We got very used to the M5/A46 during that time! Would definitely recommend somewhere next to the boat to store materials/tools though as seemed to spend half the time moving stuff from one end to the other and back again. A lot of stuff can also be built in your workshop at home and taken up to the boat for final fitting.

 

Tom