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Buying a boat share - what to consider?


Sally Grim

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Hello!

My husband and I have been hiring for a few years, but are thinking about taking the "next step" and buying a boat share. The ultimate goal is to have our own boat, but since we are Scandinavian that is too much responsibility too far away at present.

 

I would greatly appreciate any tips on what to look out for, and what to ask about. All the obvious and not so obvious things, as I might not know the obvious ones either.

 

For instance I wonder about the prices in the adverts: are those fixed prices, or is the normal/expected thing to do to offer slightly less?

How does one price a share? Can I compare 12 times the boat share (1/12-share) to prices for a boat, or is that the wrong way to see it?

 

We are looking at managed boats, since we live abroad. Is it wise to look for a newer boat, as it will have less problems (will it?), or an older boat, since that will be cheaper and a lower risk, if something should go wrong?

 

Thankful for all advice!

Sally.

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Make sure the layout of the boat is going to work for you.

Make sure you know what the management fees are, and how much the running costs are likely to be.

Make sure you understand how weeks are allocated -- some a fixed weeks, some have a rota for chosing your weeks.

Look at lots of boats to get an idea of prices. BCBM usually has plenty of shares for sale, also try the Boatshare website. Prices are negotiable.

Try to find out if major work has been done -- some older boats have new engines for example.

 

Boat sharing is a great way of getting several weeks a year, at a much lower cost than hiring. For someone in your position it's ideal.

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If you'll be cruising in winter, look for ine with a stove as I've noticed a lot of share boats don't have them.

 

Other than that i know nothing about boat shares I'm afraid.

 

Something that does seem obvious to me though is that if you're using it as a stepping stone to your own boat and plan to sell on in a few years, then at the front of your mind when viewing possible boats should be how easy it will be to sell your share on when you need to.

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Thank you, Adam and Junior.

Yes, in addition to the benefits of getting several weeks at different times of the year at lower cost, I also hope that sharing is a soft way to get knowledge about what it requires to have a boat of our own. But it will probably be 5-10 years in the future, unless we win in the lottery. happy.png

 

So - if an old boat has a new engine and generally the maintenance schemes followed - it might be as good as a new boat?

I understand that some boats also sometimes needs replating. Is that also something I should worry about? Is there any other major works I should think of?

I guess that there is no survey when one buying a share, so se will have to rely on what the sellers tell us.


That´s a good idea, Steve; I didn´t realise that boat shares companies were at the boat shows too.

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Some share boats are professionally managed, so you pay a chunk of money to the management company every month, who will organise everything including moorings, licence, insurance, maintenance, servicing and cleaning between users etc. You can then just turn up and go in much the same way as with a hire boat.

 

Other schemes are owner-managed, with some jobs done by the owners and others contracted out.

 

And a few are fully owner-run, with more flexible arrangements about using the boat, such as sometimes boating with your co-owners rather than having allotted individual weeks, doing handovers on the move, away from your normal mooring, with no boatyard turnround service, and with owners doing most of their own maintenance. These are cheaper overall, but you will be expected to do your share of the work, which may be less practical if you are overseas.

 

A greater degree of owner management can work well, but it does require you to get on with your co-owners, and to have reasonably similar views about what you want from your boat.

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There is an annual share boat show at Braunston, I believe in May now, where several of the companies are present. It is a good way to start but we had problems with the antics of some of the co owners who according to the rules weren't supposed to touch anything maintaince wise but messed things up for the following users. In no particular order I would suggest the following,

Layout of the boat that suits you, not too personal as you want to sell it easily when you buy your own

How weeks are chosen, some have school holiday shares if you need that at an increased cost, if you don't need it save money and enjoy the canals when they are less busy

Is it based somewhere with plenty of holiday length cruising route choices

Does it move around the country. Linked with the above if you like where it is are the other owners wanting to move it as soon as you buy your share.

Do the other owners link in to cruise further afield. We would take the boat out for a fortnight and arrange with the next owners for them to bring it back. Just takes some logistics for car movements but worth it to cruise further afield.

Is it comfortable in the colder weather? You will get out of season weeks which are great as long as you're toasty.

As the boat will probably get more use per year than a hire boat, how good is the maintainance

Most of your management fees are known in advance so you should budget on getting around half the cost of the share purchase back when you sell but it might take a while to sell.

Choose your company with care, a lot of people lost money with Challenger and Ownerships!

You will learn a lot as to whether buying a boat on your own is the way to go, we did after only a few years of sharing.

 

Good luck it is a good way to go

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Agree with everything said above. The maintenance costs are variable, and depend upon work required during the year and work that the co-owners agree to have done during the winter maintenance. Management fees (for boats managed by a company) are fixed.

 

I shared for over 20 years and thoroughly enjoyed it. Only bought a whole boat when I retired and had free time to spend on it.

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Not sure anymore. We were with Ownerships until they went bust, and apart from that they were excellent :), later self managed and then went with ABC.

 

Ownashare is run by some ex-ownerships people, BCBM by ex-Challenger people and I beleive that ABC have recently transferred their management responsibilities to BCBM, to concentrate on maintenance and providing moorings forvshare boats.

 

Main thing to look for is that each boat's "sinking fund" is held separately from other boats and the management companies account.

 

Finally, I found boatyards that operated hire fleets were better places to moor a share boat than private marinas, because they are used to doing work quickly to avoid spoiling someone's holiday.

 

There are others on this forum who have shares. Perhaps they can comment on their management companies?

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I looked a getting a share in a boat a few years back and concluded that I would only buy one that was privately managed, usually one member does the management and gets a discount for doing it. The charges levied by some of the professional boat management companies just a rip off.

If you buy (for example) a 1/12 share in a boat for £4k that values the boat at £48k, so you have to work out if the boat is worth that price, professionally managed boats share often value the boats at far more than they’re worth in my opinion.

Well run privately often have their own website or facebook page when all the owners can discuss issues with the boat, improvements, sort out swap overs or whatever.

I put a link below to a site that sells shares there’s some interesting boats on there.

K

http://www.bargeshare.co.uk/forsale/

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We were in a self managed boat syndicate for 10 years and it worked brilliantly for us. We were very fortunate in that the way the syndicate ran suited us well. So before joining a syndicate try and get a feel for the way it's run and the internal politics, that can make a huge difference to ones enjoyment. The way that weeks are allocated can lead to difficulties, ours worked on fixed summer weeks and winter weeks by ballot whichworked well, I'm sure other systems work too but join one you are happy with.

 

The syndicate we were in started as a managed group but we left and took on the management ourselves which cut our costs to 1/3rd of what they were and we had more control and flexibility. Not all members were involved in running the boat organising things just 4 out of the twelve did most things. We had overseas members who just turned up and went boating and that was just fine by the rest of us.

 

Top Cat

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We are now in our second season of having a share in Honeystreet. We got a share after hiring for a number of times and loving it! We got a share through ABC ( that is also who hired with) but since then BCBM have taken over the management of our share.

 

For us a Managed Share works well for us as we get 3-4 weeks a year ( two weeks together guaranteed) with the monthly maintence included. Paying for a management company is more expensive than if we went for a self managed boat, however with our personal circumstances at present it works best for us, one advantage that all costs are split between the 12 owners. Long term we would like our own boat, am sure not alone there!!

 

Whilst ABC don't manage shares now they still have a good website ( "ABC Boat Shares " into Google) which helps to answer some questions.

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Make sure the layout of the boat is going to work for you.

Make sure you know what the management fees are, and how much the running costs are likely to be.

Make sure you understand how weeks are allocated -- some a fixed weeks, some have a rota for chosing your weeks.

Look at lots of boats to get an idea of prices. BCBM usually has plenty of shares for sale, also try the Boatshare website. Prices are negotiable.

Try to find out if major work has been done -- some older boats have new engines for example.

 

Boat sharing is a great way of getting several weeks a year, at a much lower cost than hiring. For someone in your position it's ideal.

I totally agree with the above. Another consideration is the other folk you will be sharing with you will need to be prepared to compromise when it comes to collective decisions with the other owners particularly if the boat is self managed by the group of owners.

 

We had a share in a boat for a few years before buying our own and like you following years of hiring. Our experience was a good one we had 4-5 weeks holiday on the boat each year and at about a 3rd of the cost of hiring for the same periods when taking into account management and maintenance fees. I am not sure what the costs will be these days but I think it is likely to be around £1000-1500 for the year give or take.

 

We found it easy to sell our share when we wanted to buy our own boat and for not that much less than we bought it for.

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It´s really interesting what you say, Kevinl and Top Cat, that one or some members do the actual management on a privately managed boat. We haven´t considered private management before, because we would´t be able to do our bit, and then I would end up with a really bad conscience.

Is it really OK to leave that to the others and just turn up and have our holidays?

 

We set out to be quite flexible and willing to compromise in this venture, we will partly do this to learn. (As well as having more narrowboat holidays than we would if we were hiring, of course!)

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Try to find a boat where the other sharers are younger people who still work. That is more likely to have unused weeks than one of retired people who use up all the time


It´s really interesting what you say, Kevinl and Top Cat, that one or some members do the actual management on a privately managed boat. We haven´t considered private management before, because we would´t be able to do our bit, and then I would end up with a really bad conscience.

Is it really OK to leave that to the others and just turn up and have our holidays?

 

We set out to be quite flexible and willing to compromise in this venture, we will partly do this to learn. (As well as having more narrowboat holidays than we would if we were hiring, of course!)

Talk to the syndicate you are thinking of joining and tell them you position and see if they are happy with it. Even self managed groups don't mean lots of work. Some does the general admin, licence, insurance, etc. someone sorts the bookings, someone looks after the money and someone arranges for maintenance. It depends how they run it.

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Talk to the syndicate you are thinking of joining and tell them you position and see if they are happy with it. Even self managed groups don't mean lots of work. Some does the general admin, licence, insurance, etc. someone sorts the bookings, someone looks after the money and someone arranges for maintenance. It depends how they run it.

 

And things like bookings can be done by email and a web-based chart -- so could easily be done by someone overseas!

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Ours is an Ownashare managed boat. And we pay them £100/month for them to look after everything.

 

We have a 'special' share and pay a premium for first pick of 3 weeks, and then it is pot luck for the fourth. Last years 4th week pick was a waste of time as we were left with term-time weeks only. This year the 4th week did allow a half term week so all is well.

 

Do the sums. Is it as cost effective as you think? Add the costs of a weeks diesel, gas, pump out and valet (we cruise with our dog so are required to have a 'pet valet' at the end of the trip. Another £100 a week. Then there is the 'winter maintenance' fee to add on too. This year was £300/share.

 

You will have to compromise. You might want to move to another base, but others might want to stay put for instance. You might have different priorities for equipment than others (You wouldn't believe the e-mail trail when discussing the new TV!) You might find that older people are more reluctant to do handovers away from the comfort of the home base. On the other hand, older (retired?) people might have more time to spend on DIY issues and save the rest of the owners a bit of cash.

 

The syndicate we joined harks back to olden, Ownerships, days and is very e-mail savvy. Group e-mails get sent and replied to very quickly. The syndicate has an annual meeting at a central location, where owners can meet up and decide the next years location and maintenance priorities etc.

 

Is it worth it? You will have to do the sums, but you will get loads of experience that you can put in to your own boat, and you will be able to use the experiences of the other owners too. For us, we pay our money, book our weeks, and then get out and cruise. We are out of the marina 30 minutes after our arrival. Other owners spend days in the marina before a pootle up to the nearest pub and back. Each to their own!

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It´s really interesting what you say, Kevinl and Top Cat, that one or some members do the actual management on a privately managed boat. We haven´t considered private management before, because we would´t be able to do our bit, and then I would end up with a really bad conscience.

Is it really OK to leave that to the others and just turn up and have our holidays?

 

We set out to be quite flexible and willing to compromise in this venture, we will partly do this to learn. (As well as having more narrowboat holidays than we would if we were hiring, of course!)

Our syndicate was quite relaxed about how much people did, others may be less so, its worth checking.

We had a chairman, secretary, treasurer and maintenance manager (me) those four handled all the administration. Oil changes and other routine maintenance were done by those members who felt comfortable doing it but it wasn't compulsory. Larger jobs got done during maintenance weeks by a group of the willing and we were never short of hands.

 

The big thing about going independent was the HUGE cost saving.

 

Top Cat

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We´re doing our best to do the sums, but are a bit unsure as to what to reckon with as extras and what is part of the monthly payments. But that is depending on the syndicate, I guess.

 

Would about £300/share, as Steven quoted, be a normal level of winter maintenance extra, or will it usually be less/more?

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After years of hiring, we bought a 12th share in a boat and had a great 4 years before buying our own boat in 2013. Others on here have covered most of what you need to know but I'd like to add a few things.

 

The management companies pay all the bills on your behalf. In addition to you paying them a fee for managing your boat, you then pay them for any maintenance on your syndicate's boat. This is usually estimated in advance based on decisions made by your syndicate at an annual meeting and a monthly contribution figure for this is then decided upon, or following email/phone discussions between all syndicate members there might be an additional contribution for some unexpected cost that occurs. Syndicates sometimes have a 'sinking fund' into which all owners will pay a small monthly amount as a contingency for this in case any unexpected costs arise.

 

Ownerships who went bust in 2009 used to have all the years the money off us at the beginning of the year so when they went under in the April we all lost about £600 each (we'd had a re-paint and our winter maintenance for which they hadn't paid). Nowadays you pay the management companies monthly so the risk is far less because in the event of them going bust the most you'd lose would be a month's contributions.

 

As for choosing a boat, a share in a new/newer boat will cost more but in theory the annual maintenance should be less. However with there being more depreciation on a newer boat you may lose more when you come to sell your share. In 2009 we bought a share in an nb Cropredy, an 8 year old 58' cruiser stern for £3,500 and sold it 4 years later for £3,250. Our annual share of the running costs and management fee was around £1,100. So not bad for 4 weeks use a year, however we had the cost of diesel, pump outs, and a valet (optional) each time we used the boat.

 

Despite the problem with Ownerships going bust (we then went with BCBM who were excellent) we had no regrets because if you like canal/river holidays every year and you're not too bothered where, it's so much cheaper than hiring. You have to be prepared to not always get your own way of course, but decisions are made democratically.

 

Although used extensively throughout the year, shared boats are usually very well maintained because owners are far more willing to have jobs done on the boat with only having to pay a twelfth of any costs, and they usually look after the boat well too.

 

If you take the excellent advice others on here have given you and take the plunge, I'm sure you won't regret it. Good luck.

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We have just moved our boat from managed (formerly ABC, but we didn't want to transfer (back) to BCBM) to self managed. The day to day running of the job is shared between three of us. I'm currently planning the winter maintenance programme, which is using up a bit of time, but through the rest of the year, I doubt it takes me more than 30 mins work a week. Our secretary is doing the bookings for 2016 at the moment, which again, is taking up a bit of time and organising, but I suspect the rest of the year is generally similar to me.

 

We are looking at having the bathroom refitted/refreshed this winter, but provisionally our annual subs look to be under £1000 even allowing for the cost of the bathroom works. Losing the management fees out of the equation is saving us a fortune, and I do wonder why we didn't do it sooner!

 

I certainly would not rule out looking at a share in a self managed boat - just ask how much work (if any) you will be asked to contribute. It will certainly work out far cheaper than a syndicate run by a management company.

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We are now in our second season of having a share in Honeystreet. We got a share after hiring for a number of times and loving it! We got a share through ABC ( that is also who hired with) but since then BCBM have taken over the management of our share.

 

For us a Managed Share works well for us as we get 3-4 weeks a year ( two weeks together guaranteed) with the monthly maintence included. Paying for a management company is more expensive than if we went for a self managed boat, however with our personal circumstances at present it works best for us, one advantage that all costs are split between the 12 owners. Long term we would like our own boat, am sure not alone there!!

 

Whilst ABC don't manage shares now they still have a good website ( "ABC Boat Shares " into Google) which helps to answer some questions.

 

I was a share owner in Honeystreet for 11 years and left 3 years ago only because I retired and bought my own boat. I felt that I had received good value for my initial investment so 'sold' my share to the other owners for a peppercorn.

 

I would add only two things to the advice which has already been given.

 

I never went to an owners meeting, I'm not interested in such things and was willing to abide by the majority decisions of the other owners - so don't worry about being abroad.

 

Strangely, Honeystreet did not prepare me for the day to day responsibility of owning my own boat - I thought it would but it didn't.

 

Frank.

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We have owned four previous shares in different managed syndicates, Carefree Cruising, Ownerships and more recently BCBM. We sold our share back in April this year which was 1/12 (Four Weeks). We now miss it so much that we have just reserved a 1/24th Share(Two Weeks) in a new build. We are both still working and feel two weeks is enough but you can usually pick up extra weeks as well. We have always gone the managed route as we live overseas and cannot help with the jobs and we would not be happy to let others do all the work. This time we are going back to BCBM who we have found to be very professional. Hope this helps.

 

Barry.

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