To Boston And Back

[nicknorman]

Can't wait to start our first 2 week hols of the year on Friday. The weather in Aberdeen is ridiculous at the moment, maximum temperature today is NINE degrees. And it is 3 days past the solstice! I see the boat is currently basking in 21 degrees in Tamworth, and it's set to get hotter next week. I'll probably be moaning that it's too hot by then!

 

Off down the T&M, scary tidal Trent - but will be saved by my new handheld VHF - mustn't forget to turn right at Torksey 'else next stop Denmark! And then straight on til Lincoln. Very straight by the looks of things!

[Naughty Cal]

No, there is a corner at Drinsey Nook. Don't miss it or you will end up on the A57

 

ETA: We will keep an eye out for you.

Edited June 24, 2015 by Naughty Cal

[john6767]

Enjoy the nice weather in the Midlands, it's hot a sticky right now. In a couple of hours we are setting off driving, ultimately by Saturday to Benbecula, weather looks decidedly poor next week although a little warmer than it is now.

 

Will be interested to see how you get on with that trip, it is a possible one for us when we get the boat back from being painted.

[Naughty Cal]

Enjoy the nice weather in the Midlands, it's hot a sticky right now. In a couple of hours we are setting off driving, ultimately by Saturday to Benbecula, weather looks decidedly poor next week although a little warmer than it is now.

 

Will be interested to see how you get on with that trip, it is a possible one for us when we get the boat back from being painted.

I have put in an order for good weather from 3rd to the 20th July, so fear not the high pressure and settled weather is waiting in the wings.

[haggis]

Enjoy your trip! We are setting out, hopefully on the 13th of July to visit the Chesterfield again but I expect you will be back at your moorings by then.

 

haggis

[peterboat]

We loved it when we went to Boston 2 years ago. Not so sure about Boston at night the owner of the indian we went to ran us back to the moorings in his car Woodhall spa gets the thumbs up love the kinema in the woods and enjoyed the sunny days spent there enjoy it all

 

Peter

[pearley]

And there is the free air show.

[nicknorman]

Getting taxi to airport at 19:00, can't wait! Should be on the boat by 22:30 Flybe permitting. Shopping tomorrow am then probably 1st night at Fradley or Alrewas.

 

Just looking at the tides etc for Wednesday 1st departure from Cromwell. Transit through Torksey is 3 hrs either side of high water there, (09:55) so if we want avoid lurking on the pontoons for hrs, when should we leave Cromwell? If we leave at high water Cromwell (11:55) we go down with the tide + flow but get to Torksey too late, if we leave earlier we are battling the flood for at least part of the way.

 

Or is it generally the thing to go down with the ebb and inevitably lurk on the pontoons 'til 3 hrs before the next HW?

[peterboat]

And there is the free air show.

2 planes doing a dog fight over the boat looked at the pictures the other day amazing plus the lancaster coming back

 

Peter

Getting taxi to airport at 19:00, can't wait! Should be on the boat by 22:30 Flybe permitting. Shopping tomorrow am then probably 1st night at Fradley or Alrewas.

 

Just looking at the tides etc for Wednesday 1st departure from Cromwell. Transit through Torksey is 3 hrs either side of high water there, (09:55) so if we want avoid lurking on the pontoons for hrs, when should we leave Cromwell? If we leave at high water Cromwell (11:55) we go down with the tide + flow but get to Torksey too late, if we leave earlier we are battling the flood for at least part of the way.

 

Or is it generally the thing to go down with the ebb and inevitably lurk on the pontoons 'til 3 hrs before the next HW?

Never done much lurking in the past they always seem to have let me in as soon as I arrive maybe it more luck than judgement.

I can recommend the cafe great cake and coffee

 

Peter

[Scholar Gypsy]

John Lower's very neat little booklet, which I am reading at this very moment, advises leaving Cromwell on the ebb tide, making sure to get to Torksey before the incoming flood gets there, which is 2 hours before HW Torksey I think. Then wait for a bit to get into the lock.

 

Hope to bump into you next weekend, I will be pootling about 3-5 July between Lincoln and Tattersall Castle.

[Scholar Gypsy]

PS have just found this very neat diagram - from a 1975 article by John Liley - mentioned in an earlier post ... It takes a little while to work it out, but I think I've got it.

 

I have annotated it show how your journey might work, setting off from Cromwell 2hrs after HW, and taking 3 hours to do the 15 miles to Torksey which is very generous, and then waiting four hours for the evening flood to start and give you enough water to get in. The ebb takes much longer than the flood! (I have not checked if you are on a neap or a spring tide...)

 

 

Edited June 26, 2015 by Scholar Gypsy

[nicknorman]

Thanks Simon, just got on the plane so I shall study that in flight whilst in a forum "Black hole"!

[Scholar Gypsy]

Thanks Simon, just got on the plane so I shall study that in flight whilst in a forum "Black hole"!

 

You are welcome. Should have said that HW Hull on July 1st is 0620 BST, and it is closer to spring than neap. So the chart would suggest HW at Cromwell is 1120 - close enough to your time!

 

The next HW at Hull is 1850 and so the flood starts at Torksey at about 2030. You might need a pre-booking, as the C&RT website shows the lock open 0700-1500 (subject to tides) on that day, ie they expect there is not enough water to get you in before 2100, the normal closing time. I guess the alternative is to stay outside all night on the pontoons...

 

I hope a local will be along soon...

[Naughty Cal]

The lockie at Cromwell will let you out at a time that will get you straight into Torksey no need to wait for the next tide.

 

Speak to the lockie before you arrive at the lock for the best time to leave.

 

We should pass you somewhere next weekend. We set off on Friday evening, are booked for our safety test Saturday morning at Geordies and then booked in the Grand Sluice at 6.30am on Sunday.

[Tony Dunkley]

If you're only going as far as Torksey then the best time to leave Cromwell is immediately after the bottom gates open, in other words, if you've no need to consider the state of the tide and depth when you get further downriver, for getting into Stockwith or Keadby, or out of the Trent to Goole or Hull, then the state of the tide at Cromwell ,Torksey or anywhere in between just doesn't matter. Nowadays there are landing stages on both sides of Torksey Cut with enough depth for a pleasure boat to float at LW, so if you can't get over the cill at Torksey when you get there it doesn't matter, you can just tie up and wait until you can.

I really can't understand why, with floating moorings in Torksey Cut, shallow draughted boats, these Trent maps or charts that I hear people talking about and the relatively smaller tidal influence that far upriver, there is so much concern about the timing of the short run from Cromwell to Torksey.

Edited June 27, 2015 by Tony Dunkley

[nicknorman]

If you're only going as far as Torksey then the best time to leave Cromwell is immediately after the bottom gates open, in other words, if you've no need to consider the state of the tide and depth when you get further downriver, for getting into Stockwith or Keadby, or out of the Trent to Goole or Hull, then the state of the tide at Cromwell ,Torksey or anywhere in between just doesn't matter. Nowadays there are landing stages on both sides of Torksey Cut with enough depth for a pleasure boat to float at LW, so if you can't get over the cill at Torksey when you get there it doesn't matter, you can just tie up and wait until you can.

I really can't understand why, with floating moorings in Torksey Cut, shallow draughted boats, these Trent maps or charts that I hear people talking about and the relatively smaller tidal influence that far upriver, there is so much concern about the timing of the short run from Cromwell to Torksey.

Thanks Tony, I rather got the impression the tides were not a big deal up there but there is a comment in the guide about avoiding the couple of hours around low water unless there is at least a couple of feet of fresh. So realistically we just need to arrive at Torksey +-3hrs of HW to get passage straight through.

 

 

Forum spotting: just passed Beaker going opposite way, sorry barely any time to say "hello" as passing at shallow bit with moored boats.

[Naughty Cal]

There are several really very shallow bits on the Trent between Cromwell and Torksey so it is best to avoid the low tide period unless you are familiar with the river.

 

The number of boats that run aground each year on that stretch is testiment to that.

 

If you are familiar with the river then there is little to worry about at most states of tide unless on exceptionally big spring tides.

[nicknorman]

Enjoy your trip! We are setting out, hopefully on the 13th of July to visit the Chesterfield again but I expect you will be back at your moorings by then.

 

haggis

Thanks, just passed Kelpie at Streethay (I'm presuming that's yours) looking lonely and awaiting its owners!

[Naughty Cal]

John Lower's very neat little booklet, which I am reading at this very moment, advises leaving Cromwell on the ebb tide, making sure to get to Torksey before the incoming flood gets there, which is 2 hours before HW Torksey I think. Then wait for a bit to get into the lock.

 

Hope to bump into you next weekend, I will be pootling about 3-5 July between Lincoln and Tattersall Castle.

Saw you moored in Lincoln but didn't have my phone with me so no pictures, sorry!

[nicknorman]

There are several really very shallow bits on the Trent between Cromwell and Torksey so it is best to avoid the low tide period unless you are familiar with the river.

The number of boats that run aground each year on that stretch is testiment to that.

If you are familiar with the river then there is little to worry about at most states of tide unless on exceptionally big spring tides.

We've got the Boating Assoc guides which seem to do a good job of marking the shallows - presuming the shallows are still in the same place!

 

Question: so when there is talk of "2' of fresh" etc, what exactly does that mean? Is it 2' of solid water over the weir? Or perhaps the level at the tail of the weir is 2' above minimum? Or what?

[Naughty Cal]

Two inch of fresh would be two inch of extra water over the predicted tide height.

 

With the weather we are enjoying at the minute though you needn't worry about that!

[Tony Dunkley]

Thanks Tony, I rather got the impression the tides were not a big deal up there but there is a comment in the guide about avoiding the couple of hours around low water unless there is at least a couple of feet of fresh. So realistically we just need to arrive at Torksey +-3hrs of HW to get passage straight through.

 

 

Forum spotting: just passed Beaker going opposite way, sorry barely any time to say "hello" as passing at shallow bit with moored boats.

 

This advice to avoid being on the move around low water never fails to amuse me every time I hear it. It appears on the face of it to make sense, but in fact, it's nonsense, for several reasons.

Firstly, with low water levels exposing sand and mud laying out from gently sloping banks it's easier to estimate if the deep water is roughly midstream or if you should be favouring one side or the other, and secondly the rate of drop in water level over the last hour or two of ebb is much less than during the first 9 to 10 hours, with virtually no change at all for the last half hour. Although the chance of grounding is greater nearer to LW if you wander out of the deep channel, which in some places is nowhere near where you might expect it to be, there is a plus side to grounding at this time because you won't have to wait long for the flood to float you off again, quite the reverse of grounding at or close to HW which puts you in for a long wait, particularly if you happen to do it on the biggest Spring tide, which could see you 'neaped' for up to a couple of weeks before there's another tide big enough to float you off.

It's not possible to say with certainty that you'll get over the bottom cill at Torksey 3 hours either side of HW because it's affected by so many variables, from 'fresh' in the river to whether or not the tides make predicted height, in turn affected by atmospheric pressure in the North sea and wind strength and direction, both at sea and in the Humber and Trent. If you make Torksey on the ebb and the depth on the cill has run down to some thing close to what you draw, don't risk trying to get in, you could finish up sitting there until the next tide. BW built a new extended chamber below the original bottom gates a few years ago and I haven't been through that lock since it was built, but I believe that they made the new bottom cill about the same depth as the original, if that's so then it was an opportunity missed, a deeper cill would have made the lock useable for more of each tide. Could you please check on that when you're there and let me know.

[Scholar Gypsy]

Saw you moored in Lincoln but didn't have my phone with me so no pictures, sorry!

 

Hope the boat was moored up well - a friend has it this weekend...

[Scholar Gypsy]

If you're only going as far as Torksey then the best time to leave Cromwell is immediately after the bottom gates open, in other words, if you've no need to consider the state of the tide and depth when you get further downriver, for getting into Stockwith or Keadby, or out of the Trent to Goole or Hull, then the state of the tide at Cromwell ,Torksey or anywhere in between just doesn't matter. Nowadays there are landing stages on both sides of Torksey Cut with enough depth for a pleasure boat to float at LW, so if you can't get over the cill at Torksey when you get there it doesn't matter, you can just tie up and wait until you can.

I really can't understand why, with floating moorings in Torksey Cut, shallow draughted boats, these Trent maps or charts that I hear people talking about and the relatively smaller tidal influence that far upriver, there is so much concern about the timing of the short run from Cromwell to Torksey.

 

Thanks - interesting stuff.

 

I think I must be putting too much weight on my first experience of the tidal Trent (1982), where we left Torksey rather late and punched the ebb for some of the time up to Cromwell. For about ten minutes we didn't seem to be moving at all, but we got there in the end ...

[Naughty Cal]

 

Thanks - interesting stuff.

 

I think I must be putting too much weight on my first experience of the tidal Trent (1982), where we left Torksey rather late and punched the ebb for some of the time up to Cromwell. For about ten minutes we didn't seem to be moving at all, but we got there in the end ...

We have been out on that stretch when narrowboats have been taking 6 hours to get from Torksey to Cromwell due to the fresh overcoming the tide and them punching the flow all the way. Took us 3 hours which seemed like an age!

 

It is of course best to make use of the tide wherever possible, which makes a narrowboat being out on the river around the low water period unlikely as it will be coming down from Cromwell to Torksey on the ebb, so unless something has gone amiss during the journey they will arrive at Torksey well before low water and in plenty of time to get over the cill.

 

Don't be tempted to cut the corner coming into Torksey Lock cut, there are some big mud banks at th ed entrance.