Barney Boats

[John Brightley]

35ft Barney 'Maria' for sale: http://narrowboats.apolloduck.co.uk/feature.phtml?id=500446

[Xanthus]

Has anyone tried contacting Chris Barney? As far as I'm aware, he's still living in Birdingbury, near Rugby, where he works as a very accomplished carpenter, making bespoke hand-made furniture. I haven't seen him for a good ten years or so, but I'd have thought he'd be happy to share his recollections of building the Barney Boats back in the Seventies.

[BEngo]

If he hand-makes bespoke furniture it would be fairer to call him a cabinet maker.!

It seems to be about finish when describing wood working trades:

Carpenters do roofs and other heavy timber work, joiners are the people for doors and internal fittings and cabinet makers ( and minor royalty) make fine furniture. The skills for each are different, but they are all very skilled trades.

 

N

[Athy]

It's a question of fashion too. 20 years ago you never heard of a carpenter, they all called themselves joiners. Since then, the "c" word has come back into vogue.

[David Schweizer]

If he hand-makes bespoke furniture it would be fairer to call him a cabinet maker.!

It seems to be about finish when describing wood working trades:

Carpenters do roofs and other heavy timber work, joiners are the people for doors and internal fittings and cabinet makers ( and minor royalty) make fine furniture. The skills for each are different, but they are all very skilled trades.

 

It's a question of fashion too. 20 years ago you never heard of a carpenter, they all called themselves joiners. Since then, the "c" word has come back into vogue.

 

Sorry that is not correct Mike, A Cabinet Maker, Joiner and Carpenter are three different trades, and always have been. The brief differentation is outlined in the second sentence in BEngo's post (above) My only arguement would be with the word "bespoke" which merey indicates that the furniture is being made for a customer's particuoar requirements, it may or may not be idetifiable as Cabinet work.

Edited January 11, 2017 by David Schweizer

[Derek R.]

I think the difference has been lost through lack of information and education in general.

Carpenters construct and piece together items from raw materials, such as studding, sheet material, and pre-made items, and will be found on all building sites wherein there may be first fixers (building shuttering and such for concrete pouring), and second fixers (who are more likely to be fitting stairs, door frames and windows etc). Whereas joiners will be working in a workshop making and assembling some of the aforementioned items.

 

http://www.internationaltimber.com/news/joinery/what-s-the-difference-between-a-carpenter-and-a-joiner-

http://www.olivergibbs.com/the-difference-between-carpenters-joiners/

 

I was none of the above, but did work with same as a crane driver (for a while).

[David Schweizer]

Then there is Chairmaking which is quite different from any of the afore mentioned trades, and even more complicated to explain. Depending upon th the type of chair it can involve just one tradesman, or several.

Edited January 11, 2017 by David Schweizer

[David Mack]

 

Sorry that is not correct Mike, A Cabinet Maker, Joiner and Carpenter are three different trades, and always have been. The brief differentation is outlined in the second sentence in BEngo's post (above) My only arguement would be with the word "bespoke" which merey indicates that the furniture is being made for a customer's particuoar requirements, it may or may not be idetifiable as Cabinet work.

And which can be described as a "chippie"?

[Pluto]

And which can be described as a "chippie"?

The Germans think its the one bombed during the war - they bombed our chippie, y'know.

[alan_fincher]

 

Sorry that is not correct Mike, A Cabinet Maker, Joiner and Carpenter are three different trades, and always have been.

 

I agree, but equally have seen plenty of historical documents for people like my paternal grandfather using the description of "carpenter and joiner".

 

That supports the idea that they are separate occupations, but also to me also indicates that the same person could be trained to be either, as required.

 

EDIT:

 

I do however prefer the way his grandfather appears in one census, with the occupation given as "Bricklayer and publican".

Edited January 11, 2017 by alan_fincher

[Derek R.]

Carpenter & Joiner - could easily have been both. Chippie, as in 'Jock', 'Taff', or 'sparks'. Slang that trips off the tongue with or without respect. Somewhat like certain surnames that have 'other' prefixes, like 'Snowy' White, 'Dusty' Miller, or 'Tug' Wilson.

 

Chippie has always meant a fish & chip shop to me.

[David Schweizer]

 

I agree, but equally have seen plenty of historical documents for people like my paternal grandfather using the description of "carpenter and joiner".

 

That supports the idea that they are separate occupations, but also to me also indicates that the same person could be trained to be either, as required.

 

EDIT:

 

I do however prefer the way his grandfather appears in one census, with the occupation given as "Bricklayer and publican".

 

Carpenter & Joiner - could easily have been both. Chippie, as in 'Jock', 'Taff', or 'sparks'. Slang that trips off the tongue with or without respect. Somewhat like certain surnames that have 'other' prefixes, like 'Snowy' White, 'Dusty' Miller, or 'Tug' Wilson.

 

Chippie has always meant a fish & chip shop to me.

 

Many Joiners in the past, both made and fitted doors, staircases etc hence the twin description "Carpenter and Joiner". With most joInery being factory produced these days very few people persue both trades. However, in historic building restoration, the joinery has to be made to fit the building, and the Joiner will often either fit the items themselvers or be present to make any necessary adjustments.

 

With regard to Alan's GG Grandfather, my researches suggest that it was not unusual in the 18th/19th centuries for pubs to be run by tradesmen, with many of them coming from the Building trades. Not only did it provide an extra income, and work for family members, it also provided an income when work was scarce, or when the tradesman decided to retire from manually demanding work. In Bath there are records of several former tadesmen continuing to run a pub until their death.

[Athy]

Carpenter & Joiner - could easily have been both. Chippie, as in 'Jock', 'Taff', or 'sparks'. Slang that trips off the tongue with or without respect. Somewhat like certain surnames that have 'other' prefixes, like 'Snowy' White, 'Dusty' Miller, or 'Tug' Wilson.

 

Chippie has always meant a fish & chip shop to me.

"Chalky" White is another frequently -encountered one, but I have never heard of "Tug" Wilson. Whilst the derivation of the others is obvious, that one isn't.

[David Schweizer]

"Chalky" White is another frequently -encountered one, but I have never heard of "Tug" Wilson. Whilst the derivation of the others is obvious, that one isn't.

 

You have lived a sheltered life Mike I have known several Tug Wilsons over the years. Like many other men's nick names it has Military origins, Royal Navy I believe.

 

The one I like best was the Army nickname of "Jock" afforded to my old Woodwork teacher he was not Scottish, but his surname was Stapp. I'll leave you to work that one out.

Edited January 12, 2017 by David Schweizer

[Athy]

 

You have lived a sheltered life Mike I have known several Tug Wilsons over the years. Like many other men's nick names it has Military origins, Royal Navy I believe.

 

The one I like best was the Army nickname of "Jock" afforded to my old Woodwork teacher he was not Scottish, but his surname was Stapp. I'll leave you to work that one out.

In the same vein as the maths master at Ashby Grammar School, "Duke" Ellison and (showing how hip those Leicestershire schoolboys were) the headmaster, "Mose" Allison. At my previous school the headmaster was Mr. Clapton, but it was too long ago for him to have acquired the epithet "Eric".

Whether not associating with many sailors makes my life "sheltered" I'm not sure. I shall have to look in Partridge's Dictionary and see if "Tug" is mentioned in that sense.

[David Schweizer]

In the same vein as the maths master at Ashby Grammar School, "Duke" Ellison and (showing how hip those Leicestershire schoolboys were) the headmaster, "Mose" Allison. At my previous school the headmaster was Mr. Clapton, but it was too long ago for him to have acquired the epithet "Eric".

Whether not associating with many sailors makes my life "sheltered" I'm not sure. I shall have to look in Partridge's Dictionary and see if "Tug" is mentioned in that sense.

 

No need, just Google "Tug Wilson nickname" and you will get this Wikipedia page :- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Wilson_(Royal_Navy_officer)

 

The following explanation is taken from it:- Wilson's nickname of 'Tug' reputedly comes from an incident when he repeatedly ordered a battleship to try to come alongside, and in exasperation offered her captain a tug to assist. He was also known as 'Old 'Ard 'Art' for his refusal to consider the cares and comforts of officers and men

Edited January 12, 2017 by David Schweizer

[Nightwatch]

Rattler Morgan. Dusty Roades. Slinger Woods. Swampy Marsh. Frapper Kirkham. (You won't know that one. He was beaten up by the police).

[CockneyRebel]

Hi all, wonder if you can help clarify something. My engine is currently taking a good minute/two minutes to start - is this normal? Its not making bad noises, or running badly, just taking a while to get going.

Rachel

[cuthound]

Hi all, wonder if you can help clarify something. My engine is currently taking a good minute/two minutes to start - is this normal? Its not making bad noises, or running badly, just taking a while to get going.

Rachel

Are you selecting the preheat facility when starting?

 

Modern diesels use glow plugs to preheat the combustion chambers to make starting easier. It is ususlly engaged by holding the ignition key in the position before the start postion for 10-30 seconds before moving it to the start position.

 

If you are doing this and it is still not starting easily, then check the glow plugs for correct operation.

[Pete Tuffrey]

On 1 June 2016 at 22:40, Phredd said:

Thyme was the 35th Barney (Hawkesbury class) built in 1974, originally named Galka II. She was originally built for use on the Great Ouse, and that is the reason she was fitted with the Sabb 2HG twin engine - rather overpowered for a 32 foot canal boat, but proved just what was needed when we travelled up the Severn, from the Avon to Worcester, when in flood!

 

She was fitted with a steel top in 2002, after years of trying to stem the inevitable leaks in the wooden cabin. This was done at Willowbridge, and they did a good job of keeping the original shape, albeit with slightly reduced gunnels. Overplating of the hull bottom was done at the same time, and this made her sit deeper. We removed some of the ballast, but that made her "skittish", so we put-up with the possibility of grounding, which very rarely happened.

 

The Sabb twin has proved very reliable. Apart from the usual servicing (oil/filter changes and a couple of decarbs), it has only needed injectors overhauled (done at Diesel Injection Aylesbury), the front oil seal replaced and rocker bearings replaced, which were made-up by a firm in Chesham, after it was found impossible to source Sabb originals - them having stopped manufacturing the twin.

 

Sadly we have now put her up for sale, buying a new bigger boat.

 

I understand that Cockney Rebel (formerly one of the old Concoform Marine hire fleet) is also up for sale - it was owned by the lockkeeper at Watford locks.

 

The unique cruiser sterned one that used to "live" on the Aylesbury Arm is now residing at Whilton Marina where it appears not to have been used for several years.

 

[Athy]

Thank you for the pictures, Pete, and welcome. Do you now own this boat?

[Derek R.]

Looks a super little boat. Is that a Flavel Courier under the copper kettle? Good stoves!

Louise, cooking with gas marigolds . . .

 

[Pete Tuffrey]

On 27 February 2017 at 12:25, Athy said:

Thank you for the pictures, Pete, and welcome. Do you now own this boat?

I do indeed, it's my tiny pride and joy lol 

[Woodontop]

This thread has been moving along nicely! I haven't been on in a while. Good to see barney's changing hands and people looking them up. 

It's worth pointing out that if you're having engine trouble Johno at U.C.C knows a lot about Sabb engines and sorted the one in Sutton. 

I imagine other members of this thread would have recommendations on mechanics who know their way around Sabbs. 

If you still have a wooden roof and it's starting to deteriorate you can take the outer layer of ply off and replace it. For a long time we were told you couldn't as it was all tied in with the structure but if you work in sections we were able to take all the rotten support beams and ply out and replace with new wood and keep the same shape. Didn't bother with the aluminium strips as less screw holes the better. 

The person who did ours subsequently shut up shop but I imagine that boatyard at the start of the Aylesbury arm could easily repair a barney roof  

Hope everyone is looking forward to their barney adventures this coming year and hopefully a couple of us will run into each other. 

[Woodontop]

http://greathaywoodboatsales.co.uk/images/pdf_files/Rachel Brochure Main Page.pdf

 

Just seen that Rachel is for sale. 54ft Barney with porthole in the hull.