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Best Direct Heat for Narrowboats?


Nb Smudger

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Hi All,

 

Hope everyone is well!! Our 40ft nb (self build in 08 & JD Hull) we have had almost 18 months now. Had a little more use this Winter than last but still very cold! (Cold North winds on the Lancaster Canal!) We have the Eberspacher (diesel) system which operates two low floor radiators & a towel rail in the bathroom but doesn't provide much direct heat at all. Unfortunately the self build didn't include a stove such as the Morso Squirrel or Boatman due to the L shaped seating in the lounge.

 

If we were to modify this slightly does anyone have a rough idea of cost of this please? Presumably there is the heat protection around the stove to take into account and of course the chimney? A fellow boater who moors close by suggested a portable calor gas heater - then of course the windows are running with condensation.

 

Does anyone know of any other options? Are there any other smaller heaters with a bit more direct heat but producing less condensation?

 

Thanks for reading everyone! Look forward to hearing from you.

 

Nb Smudger.

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Hi All,

 

Hope everyone is well!! Our 40ft nb (self build in 08 & JD Hull) we have had almost 18 months now. Had a little more use this Winter than last but still very cold! (Cold North winds on the Lancaster Canal!) We have the Eberspacher (diesel) system which operates two low floor radiators & a towel rail in the bathroom but doesn't provide much direct heat at all. Unfortunately the self build didn't include a stove such as the Morso Squirrel or Boatman due to the L shaped seating in the lounge.

 

If we were to modify this slightly does anyone have a rough idea of cost of this please? Presumably there is the heat protection around the stove to take into account and of course the chimney? A fellow boater who moors close by suggested a portable calor gas heater - then of course the windows are running with condensation.

 

Does anyone know of any other options? Are there any other smaller heaters with a bit more direct heat but producing less condensation?

 

Thanks for reading everyone! Look forward to hearing from you.

 

Nb Smudger.

 

Hi

 

There realy is no substitute for a solid fuel stove on a liveaboard boat. I would sacrifice a little time and money and modify and fit one. Squirrell is the best but the boatman is a good buy and ample for that space. Yes you need to buy fireproof board but its not expensive and of course the total cost will depend greatly on wether or not you do it all yourself ( Its easy ) or pay someone to do it. I fitted mine last week. A very very rough guesstimate is maximum a grand to d.i.y it including all bits, tiles etc etc .

 

Tim

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Hi

 

There realy is no substitute for a solid fuel stove on a liveaboard boat.

Agree with this. And it's not only about the heat supplied, a solid fuel stove is a beautiful focal point when alight, and something which can be gazed at for hours, which is not something which can be said for a modified truck night heater.

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Note on the OP, a solid fuel stove shouln't produce any condensation within the cabin, because its flue is external to the boat. So there's no combustion products going into the boat from the stove, just fresh air coming in thru the vents etc. (Compare this to eg a hob or an oven, where the burning occurs within the airspace of the cabin, so the combustion products (water and CO2 predominantly) will go into the cabin airspace too).

 

In fact, because its heating the air, eventually over time as the air temperature increases its RELATIVE humidity will fall, because even with the same (approximately) water vapour within the airspace, because its hotter there is more 'capacity' for vapour (if that makes sense...) which is how relative humidity is defined.

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Hi All,

 

Hope everyone is well!! Our 40ft nb (self build in 08 & JD Hull) we have had almost 18 months now. Had a little more use this Winter than last but still very cold! (Cold North winds on the Lancaster Canal!) We have the Eberspacher (diesel) system which operates two low floor radiators & a towel rail in the bathroom but doesn't provide much direct heat at all. Unfortunately the self build didn't include a stove such as the Morso Squirrel or Boatman due to the L shaped seating in the lounge.

 

If we were to modify this slightly does anyone have a rough idea of cost of this please? Presumably there is the heat protection around the stove to take into account and of course the chimney? A fellow boater who moors close by suggested a portable calor gas heater - then of course the windows are running with condensation.

 

Does anyone know of any other options? Are there any other smaller heaters with a bit more direct heat but producing less condensation?

 

Thanks for reading everyone! Look forward to hearing from you.

 

Nb Smudger.

 

 

Can I be blunt?

 

Stop messing about and get a solid fuel stove.

 

I have both - diesel fired central heating which is good for taking the edge off chilly spring/summer/autumn mornings only and solid fuel stove which is the absolute daddy.

Edited by mark99
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Other replies have assumed you're a liveaboard - but in the first post, you said:-

""Had a little more use this Winter than last but still very cold!"

That says to me you're not a liveaboard??? so I'll go on that basis.

 

'Low level radiators imply Finrad types - and they don't chuck out much heat at all - I have some at home and you need a long length to get much out of them. So when building the boat I went for traditional panel radiators. Four in all plus a large calorifier. The boat is toasty hot in 1 1/2 hours from cold and gets very hot if not monitored in another hour. I have a 4.5Kw Mikuni (ebersplutter type) and it's more than adequate

 

The cheapest solution for occasional use is to replace the finrads with radiators. Mine fit under the gunnels - so are not that intrusive.

  • Greenie 1
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Other replies have assumed you're a liveaboard - but in the first post, you said:-

""Had a little more use this Winter than last but still very cold!"

That says to me you're not a liveaboard??? so I'll go on that basis.

 

'Low level radiators imply Finrad types - and they don't chuck out much heat at all - I have some at home and you need a long length to get much out of them. So when building the boat I went for traditional panel radiators. Four in all plus a large calorifier. The boat is toasty hot in 1 1/2 hours from cold and gets very hot if not monitored in another hour. I have a 4.5Kw Mikuni (ebersplutter type) and it's more than adequate

 

The cheapest solution for occasional use is to replace the finrads with radiators. Mine fit under the gunnels - so are not that intrusive.

Plus one for me

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Another Bizzard type suggestion (apologies to B....) is to get some cheap computer fans and attach them directly to the pipes in several places.

I've done that in my study where the finrad run is only about 8' and it certainly makes a difference. Like these:-

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/pc-sata-ide-hard-disk-drive-hdd-cooler-2-fan-desktop-radiator-for-computer-4-pin-/391085572188?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item5b0e84405c.

 

Bend the aluminium to hang over the fins

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  • 2 weeks later...

I beleive a portable calor gas heater (cabinet type) is a no-no on a boat due to the danger of carbon monoxide issues. Even on land they need LOTS of ventilation to prevent build up of poisinous gas.

 

Plonk

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Solid fuel stove for me, but we find it much better with a 12V desk fan hung above the stove.

I will add that we have a fan assisted radiator which uses waste engine heat, and this is truly brilliant when underway; one of the best mods. I ever did on our boat. But under normal circumstances, I don't think there is anything quite so good as the solid fuel stove. Gets my vote anyway, especially with the fan above..

Edited by Guest
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I would say under NO circumstances should you even consider a portable gas heater. The boater that even suggested their use was at best irresponsible and at worst downright dangerous. There have been fatalities on boats in recent years associated with portable gas heaters

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Solid fuel stove for me, but we find it much better with a 12V desk fan hung above the stove.

I will add that we have a fan assisted radiator which uses waste engine heat, and this is truly brilliant when underway; one of the best mods. I ever did on our boat. But under normal circumstances, I don't think there is anything quite so good as the solid fuel stove. Gets my vote anyway, especially with the fan above..

 

Can I ask, presumably you brought water pipes through the bulkhead between engine room an cabin (if there is a bulkhead), but where is the rad and fan actually located? Is it just a car radiator? Do you have any pictures?

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Our back up heating for when we are not using the stove is an Ellis gas boiler which supplies a small rad in the bathroom and a large double in the saloon, but we do have 6 metres of fin rads which are rated at 500 wstts per metre. This is sufficient even in winter to keep our 60 foot boat cosy. We don't use gas as a matter of course because it is expensive compared to the stove but is ideal for spring through to autumn for the odd hour or so just to take the chill off, bonus is it also provides hot water.

Phil

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It really has to be a small solid fuel stove, they take up little space, are safe when sat on a slab and not close to the surroundings, cheap and in the summer you can plonk a vase of flowers on the top. just be sure to leave a good space around the chimney and also where it goes through the ceiling. Cost? just add about 30 % onto the price for chimney, collar, etc.

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Solid fuel has three advantages. Cheap, nice to look at, and reduces condensation by sucking cold dry air into the cabin from outside to replace air lost in combustion (which goes up the chimney).

 

Against that it's dirty, and you have to lug heavy bags of coal about. Or spend time collecting, chopping, and drying firewood. And it takes up space.

 

For occasional use (if you are not a live-aboard), there is much to be said for a "modified truck night heater" - provided it is properly installed. I therefore second Old Goat's suggestions. Currently your finrads are sending very hot water back to the heater, and encouraging it to switch off, or at least lower the output. Installing some proper radiators will make much better use of it.

 

If you ARE a liveaboard, then solid fuel is a good choice.

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Can I ask, presumably you brought water pipes through the bulkhead between engine room an cabin (if there is a bulkhead), but where is the rad and fan actually located? Is it just a car radiator? Do you have any pictures?

Hi Mike,

I took some tee fittings off the calorifier feeds, and piped them in 22mm copper, for the short distance thru the bulkhead and just past the rear step to where the fan assisted rad is on the wall (sideways). The rad came out of a skip, but was like new, save for the wooden ends which I made new ones to match the cabin lining. Bangs out about 4kW I believe. Will try and find a pic of one like it; it is a Smiths unit, but we have a Myson one at home It heats the cabin very quickly when moving and is great for drying wet clothing. The only downside is it is 240V, but no big deal to us as we always have inverter on for fridge when moving.

Link to picture of similar rad:https://www.google.co.uk/search?tbm=isch&q=smiths+fan+assisted+radiators&ei=-wcgVdeXIZHOaI2mgvgI#imgdii=_&imgrc=al6SdZms2nW68M%253A%3B2pSX2ClIfvAb9M%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi.ebayimg.com%252F00%252Fs%252FNzY4WDEwMjQ%253D%252Fz%252FOvUAAOSwofxUjyYz%252F%2524_86.JPG%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.gumtree.com%252Fp%252Fother-household-goods%252Ffan-assisted-radiator-smiths-signature-7%252F1093130812%3B1024%3B768

Edited by Guest
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Remember that ebers come from 2Kw upwards and they like to run loaded with plenty of radiators. You could also use a 5Kw eber air heater. they fit in tight spaces easily, send their fumes outside BUT solid fuel is cheaper to fuel, but ebers will work on a timer if you want a stove will not.

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Unless I have missed something, no-one has yet mentioned a free-standing diesel-fired stove - every bit as good to look at as a solid fuel stove and as warm, with none of the mess. More expensive yes,but at least worth considering as another option

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I used my boat this winter on electric radiators. I was hooked up to marina electrics though. It wasn't as expensive as expected though it didn't cope too well with the sub zero temperatures. I will still be fitting a stove this summer though. The electric heating is very slow to heat up the space compared to a stove. Also getting new electric cards from the marina is a pain as they have short office openings hours.

 

I would say you will go slightly over 1k for a diy job.

 

Dave

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