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Cleaning down for a Survey


tonyt40
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Hi

 

It's me again, thanks in advance for your answers. I am arranging a survey on the boat that I intend to buy. I have contacted the surveyor. They requested be boat be jet washed prior to survey. The yard have informed me that if that's done I will be liable for re-blacking the hull for the seller as a lot of the blacking will come off. they suggested that I ask the surveyor if he can do thickness by spot cleaning. The surveyor has said he can do this as long as the hull is not too fouled. It was last out in 2011 for blacking.

 

Does this sound normal to those that have had surveys done?

 

thanks

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Our boat had sat in the water, on brokerage, unloved for 3 1/2 years, looked like this when it came out of the water.

 

The surveyor, Eddie Freeman made no comment. It didn't impede his survey. As she was out of the water, as part of the haggling process we got her blacked.

 

15727823802_9e86c93482_c.jpgDSCF1911

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They are trying it on. Most buyers will want a survey, and anyone who buys without would still probably want to reblack anyway. I would go back to them and say that your offer is conditional on them allowing the hull to be pressure washed and that you will not pay for reblacking (if you don't buy). If they won't budge you know they really want to sell this boat to someone who doesn't have a survey done, and you can draw your own conclusions about the reason why.

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I think its helpfull to jet while still wet and just out of the cut.if i were going to buy i would black it anyway as its sounds due .

 

 

Spectacularly missing the point of the question.

 

Of course it NEEDS blacking, the question is about who pays!!!

 

The OP is not committed to buying, and if the survey result is bad why should they pay for it to be blacked?

 

 

MtB

  • Greenie 1
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Hi

 

It's me again, thanks in advance for your answers. I am arranging a survey on the boat that I intend to buy. I have contacted the surveyor. They requested be boat be jet washed prior to survey. The yard have informed me that if that's done I will be liable for re-blacking the hull for the seller as a lot of the blacking will come off. they suggested that I ask the surveyor if he can do thickness by spot cleaning. The surveyor has said he can do this as long as the hull is not too fouled. It was last out in 2011 for blacking.

 

Does this sound normal to those that have had surveys done?

 

thanks

I think I needed to word the question differently. Regardless of the blacking, the questions should have been:-

  • Does the whole hull need pressure washing for a survey?
  • Is spot cleaning for an ultrasound thickness test acceptable?
  • Do all surveyors ask for full cleaning as a matter of course?
  • What are your personal experiences of this?
  • I assume the surveyor will clean any small areas that are of particular interest to him for a detailed examination anyway?

The boat is due for blacking but will have to wait a bit as budget currently reached and the boatyard don't charge slipway fee if they do it so whether I do in now or in a few months it won't cost any more.

 

Thanks

  • Greenie 1
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Most surveyors will prefer to work on a boat which has been washed off, apart from it being simpler/pleasanter there is more chance of their spotting minor defects.

Yes if it's a pre-purchase survey the question of who pays for blacking can be an awkward one. A decent pressure washer will inevitably bring off a fair amount of paint if it's ordinary bitumen, even if it's only 12 months old or even less. The owner might be glad of an opportunity to give the hull a quick coat or two, but sometimes a boat might only be booked on for the day for a survey.

 

Tim

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Spectacularly missing the point of the question.

 

Of course it NEEDS blacking, the question is about who pays!!!

 

The OP is not committed to buying, and if the survey result is bad why should they pay for it to be blacked?

 

 

MtB

 

Vice-Versa, the 'buyer' may decide to not proceed and the seller is left with an 'unblacked' boat - why should he pay when it was solely down to the survey that resulted in the necessity, of reblacking. What happens when the next buyer' wants a survey and the blacking is removed again ?

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Vice-Versa, the 'buyer' may decide to not proceed and the seller is left with an 'unblacked' boat - why should he pay when it was solely down to the survey that resulted in the necessity, of reblacking. What happens when the next buyer' wants a survey and the blacking is removed again ?

Well surely he leaves it unblacked for the next survey. Since it obviously needs reblacking the sale price presumably already reflects that.

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Vice-Versa, the 'buyer' may decide to not proceed and the seller is left with an 'unblacked' boat - why should he pay when it was solely down to the survey that resulted in the necessity, of reblacking. What happens when the next buyer' wants a survey and the blacking is removed again ?

 

Indeed. NOBODY should pay for the blacking, obviously.

 

And the answer is, buy a caravan instead. Equally obviously :D

 

 

 

MtB

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I think nearly everybody is missing the pointunsure.png

I think I needed to word the question differently. Regardless of the blacking, the questions should have been:-

  • Does the whole hull need pressure washing for a survey?
  • Is spot cleaning for an ultrasound thickness test acceptable?
  • Do all surveyors ask for full cleaning as a matter of course?
  • What are your personal experiences of this?
  • I assume the surveyor will clean any small areas that are of particular interest to him for a detailed examination anyway?

The boat is due for blacking but will have to wait a bit as budget currently reached and the boatyard don't charge slipway fee if they do it so whether I do in now or in a few months it won't cost any more.

 

Thanks

 

The bit I need answering is regard the quality of the survey if it's not jet washed!

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If the seller wants to sell the boat, they allow a pressure wash so the surveyor can see as much of the hull as possible. If you don't buy, the seller could have it blacked and it would look much better.

 

If there is something to hide, perhaps they want to discourage the pressure wash... Or the broker is causing an issue that the vendor doesn't know about.

 

If I was selling, and a buyer wanted to pressure wash, they would be welcome, and I would be delighted! I would be furious if my broker was putting something in the way of a likely sale - unless we were colluding, and didn't want a pressure wash because there was something to hide.

 

I wonder when it was last blacked?

My surveyor took a thickness reading every foot, both lengthwise and width wise. I dont think he would have been happy to scrape off detritus in 350 places?

 

If my surveyor had asked for pressure washing, I would want it pressure washing. Any resistance and I'd walk away.

Edited by Richard10002
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I have to say I'm quite surprised by the general trend in the responses here.

 

I have seen quite a number of surveyors operate purely on the basis of just cleaning off small specific areas of the hull wherever they want to put their tester.

 

Typically this results in as many bare patches as they have actually taken measurements, (but each no more than a couple of inches square).

 

Often they carry some kind of small angle grinder fitted with a wire brush to clean off these points themselves.

 

Our only ever survey was certainly done this way.

 

Because I have seen this quite a few times, (different surveyors), I assumed such practice was fairly normal.

 

OK, they can clearly do less visual checking if the rest of the hull is not washed off, so I can see problems not picked up by the tester might be spotted more easily.

 

So are surveyors I have seen operating this way offering a less than ideal service?

 

In the cases I have seen this done the boat just goes back in with those small patches not painted over, but that is probably because most surveys I have seen done involve only having the boat on (or in) the dock for part of a working day, so significant reblacking is not an option.

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I think nearly everybody is missing the pointunsure.png

 

The bit I need answering is regard the quality of the survey if it's not jet washed!

 

 

I think nearly everybody is missing the pointunsure.png

 

The bit I need answering is regard the quality of the survey if it's not jet washed!

 

 

I think nearly everybody is missing the pointunsure.png

 

The bit I need answering is regard the quality of the survey if it's not jet washed!

Tony, you have quite a few answers from a number of different folks, but none appear to be the one you want. Might I suggest you try asking someone best equipped to tell you what you need to hear - other surveyors. There are lots of them, but you only have the thoughts of one and you aren't convinced. It shouldn't be hard to ring round and gain a consensus or a view you trust. If you don't find a surveyor who gives you an answer you trust, you haven't found someone you should be paying to do a survey for you.

 

One thing appears to be a given: whether it gets power-washed, just bared for small 'tickets' or is unmarked by the surveyor, and whether you choose to buy it, someone else does or the owner keeps it, it needs blacking. That's got to be a key feature in your negotiation from the get-go.

 

Hope that helps.

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Tony,

 

In addition to my other question, (when was it last blacked?), who is the surveyor? Some here might know him and have some comment.

 

It was last blacked in 2011. I have spoken to three surveyors who have all come back with similar comment - jet wash in an ideal world but no problem with spot cleaning. I have appointed a surveyor who has had plenty of good press on the forum.

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If it was last blacked in 2011, it needs blacking, whether it's pressure washed or not, so the broker is pulling a fast one, for some reason. The broker is either trying to do his client a favour, (why, I don't know, as it might cost him a sale), or he might be trying to get himself some guaranteed work - or he is trying to make sure its not pressure washed???

 

It's up to you but,faced with such unwarranted resistance, I'd be wary and either insist on a pressure wash, walk away, or make the surveyor aware of the concerns.

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If it was last blacked in 2011, it needs blacking, whether it's pressure washed or not, so the broker is pulling a fast one, for some reason. The broker is either trying to do his client a favour, (why, I don't know, as it might cost him a sale), or he might be trying to get himself some guaranteed work - or he is trying to make sure its not pressure washed???

 

It's up to you but,faced with such unwarranted resistance, I'd be wary and either insist on a pressure wash, walk away, or make the surveyor aware of the concerns.

I know the boat needs blacking and this will be done by the yard where the boat is currently is a bit later on if the sale goes through. I had taken this into account in my offer. This post was not about "broker bashing", it was about what is normal practice. I have no issues with the broker. They have been very helpful with everything I have asked.

 

The broker is obviously acting on his client's instruction and best interest. As I had said earlier in the post I have spoken to three surveyors and all ideally would have all it pressure washed but all can work with spot cleaning ans still do a thorough job. There has been no "un-warranted resistance" to the washing, just that I will be expected to re-black whether I buy it or not.

 

Have you ever had a survey done? How did they do it?

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I know the boat needs blacking and this will be done by the yard where the boat is currently is a bit later on if the sale goes through. I had taken this into account in my offer. This post was not about "broker bashing", it was about what is normal practice. I have no issues with the broker. They have been very helpful with everything I have asked.

 

The broker is obviously acting on his client's instruction and best interest. As I had said earlier in the post I have spoken to three surveyors and all ideally would have all it pressure washed but all can work with spot cleaning ans still do a thorough job. There has been no "un-warranted resistance" to the washing, just that I will be expected to re-black whether I buy it or not.

 

Have you ever had a survey done? How did they do it?

It's easier and more pleasant for the surveyor to do his job on a cleaned hull, but it's not essential, so maybe find out why your chosen surveyor insists on a jet washed hull? When I had my survey done, the surveyor didn't mention having it cleaned, but the boat had been pressure washed when it had been taken out of the water prior to sale, so even I could see the pitting and the state of the anodes

 

If the vendor or the broker insist that you pay for blacking the boat whether you buy it or not, and don't want the steel exposed for easy examination, then walk away, as they may be trying to hide faults that they know about. If the boat was last blacked in 2011, it's due anyway, so if you don't buy it, the vendor should be blacking it soon anyway, and they're trying it on.

 

Just my opinion, like...

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The broker is obviously acting on his client's instruction and best interest.

 

......

 

There has been no "un-warranted resistance" to the washing, just that I will be expected to re-black whether I buy it or not.

 

Have you ever had a survey done? How did they do it?

Here in lies the nub of the issue... No resistance to washing, but you black it if you do, even if you don't buy.. even though it needs blacking, whether you buy it or not.

 

Are you certain that the broker has discussed this with the seller? They may think they are acting in best interest but, as I have said before, if this were my boat you would be free to wash it, without the penalty of blacking if you don't buy it. In addition, I would be furious with the broker if I knew this was going on.

 

I have had one survey done on the boat I'm on now... the selling broker arranged the lift out, and included pressure washing without being asked.

 

I have also had a survey on a previous boat that I sold. It was pressure washed as a matter of course, without discussion.

 

I cannot believe the broker is making an issue of it.. It seems that the deal is, you pay for the lift out, you pay for the survey and, if you decide not to buy, you pay around £400 or so to improve the boat for the seller.

 

Other may not agree but, to me, it beggars belief.

 

Putting it into perspective, if your surveyor is sure they can do a thorough survey without a pressure wash, it matters not a jot, and is up to you.

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