Diesel costs as a live aboard ?

[floatsyourboat]

I'm about to go full time continuous cruising and would be interested in how others fare in terms of cost if moving every two weeks?

[b0atman]

Interesting to see replies I suppose when moving take your time is the motto are you generating electric by other means than the engine alternators.

[GoodGurl]

it all depends how far you move, how long you run the engine and how fast you go, there is no set cost to how much fuel you use.

edited to add, if it cost's too much will you become a CM'r.

Edited September 28, 2014 by GoodGurl

[Alan de Enfield]

Unless you have a very low electrical usage, or a large Solar set up you are probably going to neeed to generate electricity every couple of days, (or so) you will either do this with a generator, being hooked up in a marina, or run your engine for 3 or 4 hours a day (or maybe every two days if a low user)

 

You need to do a full electrical audit, if you have a fridge, freezer or washing machine your usage will be "rather large".

Work out how much elerticity you will use per day, and work out how you are going to replace it - whatever system you use will cost more than getting a mains supply.

Solar will become less viable as we move into Winter - you will get some, but unless you have a very large array, it is unlikely to provide autonomy.

 

I doubt you can base your costings on running the engine for a couple of hours every two-weeks.

 

Just as a suggestion (unless you have alternative generating sources) base your costs on 3 hours per day at 1 litre per hour at £1 /litre

= £3.00 per day - every day. (£90 per month) ^NOTE

 

As a by-product you will (assuming a water cooled engine) get hot water every day, run the central heating etc.

 

Having no home mooring (ie CCing) is not only difficult but expensive - it is not a cheap-option !

 

^NOTE There will be those who can survive on running the engine for an hour a week, and those that need to run it 8 hours a day,

£90 per month is maybe 'towards' worst case scenario but only you can determine how much electricity you use.

Diesel usage is not just a function of moving, it can be a function of washing, eating and living as well.

 

Edit for clarification "Elerticity" = Electricity

Edited September 28, 2014 by Alan de Enfield

[floatsyourboat]

Surely there must be a rough figure?

I will be using a genny for charging and have an erberspacher ( can't spell it) for hot water.

[Arthur Brown]

You will use at least a litre an hour while generating, making hot water or moving somewhere. You will use 0.7 litres an hour through something like an eberspacher, which may heat air, heat water or both.

 

What it costs depends on how you buy it, duty is payable for propulsion fuel, but not for heating so there will be pump price and percentage declaration to get right if you buy red diesel. If you buy derv it always has duty on it, but you get it from every sainsbury's etc

[floatsyourboat]

Unless you have a very low electrical usage, or a large Solar set up you are probably going to neeed to generate electricity every couple of days, (or so) you will either do this with a generator, being hooked up in a marina, or run your engine for 3 or 4 hours a day (or maybe every two days if a low user)

 

You need to do a full electrical audit, if you have a fridge, freezer or washing machine your usage will be "rather large".

Work out how much elerticity you will use per day, and work out how you are going to replace it - whatever system you use will cost more than getting a mains supply.

Solar will become less viable as we move into Winter - you will get some, but unless you have a very large array, it is unlikely to provide autonomy.

 

I doubt you can base your costings on running the engine for a couple of hours every two-weeks.

 

Just as a suggestion (unless you have alternative generating sources) base your costs on 3 hours per day at 1 litre per hour at £1 /litre

= £3.00 per day - every day. (£90 per month)

 

As a by-product you will (assuming a water cooled engine) get hot water every day, run the central heating etc.

 

Having no home mooring (ie CCing) is not only difficult but expensive - it is not a cheap-option !

Ahh thank you interesting reply.

Apart from mobile phone and very little 12v TV usage I need power for two sure flow pumps and led lights.

From about now till March the fridge will be switched off.

It's not so much of it costing too much as the freedom of moving around appeals to me I am just mulling over practicalities. If I get bored of it I plan to go and sit somewhere warm not continuous moor as that defeats the object of living on a boat personally.

Thanks.

What is considered a decent size solar setup?

[Alan de Enfield]

Your Eber-splutter will use almost the same amount of diesel as your engine, it will heat the water but will not replace your electrickery.

 

You will need to provide a generator and petrol (?) and a battery charger and it will not have the output that your alternator does, it will not heat the water.

 

Do you have a 'log-burner' with a back-boiler to heat your water ?

 

Getting both electricity and hot water for £1 per hour (via the engine) will probably be more economic that running a genny and the Eber-splutter.

 

However points for consideration :

 

1) Always try to have two sources of supply for both heating and electrickery.

2) Consider any 'on-costs' of running your main engine (wear & tear, oil change etc)

 

EVERY boater will come to conclusions based on their own boat fit-out and circumstances, eventually you will do the same.

Edited September 28, 2014 by Alan de Enfield

[floatsyourboat]

Thanks Alan again.

Is it true that its not good to run the engine just to charge due to port glazing or something?

I'm not sure how much LPG is on the cut but an LPG converted generator has been suggested to me but the cost of £600 compared to a cheap genny running through my sterling should be as efficient.

It's going to be a challenge but I'm looking forward to it.

[Alan de Enfield]

Just some more musings to pass the time until its off to bed.

 

 

Honda 2 kw (rated as 1600 watt continuous) LPG genny £1300

 

An LPG powered generator uses approx 1/3 kg of LPG per hour per KW.

 

A 13kg gas bottle will power a 2kw genny for just under 19 hours. (a 1kw for 39 hours)

If you run your genny 3 hours per day you get just over 6 days per gas bottle

Presumably you will be cooking on gas as well.

If you are moving on every two weeks then you will need to keep a 'stock' of gas bottles (what happens when the canal freezes and you cannot move for a month, or the canal is closed for lock repairs ? (will you be near enough to somewhere to walk and buy more gas ?)

 

Our local Gas supplier is £30 per bottle, that equates to about £1.50 per hour (2kw genny)

 

Your boat diesel tank is probably 200 litres (maybe more) so 200 hours of running the engine, you dont need to worry about being frozen in or having to find and carry gas bottles miles down the towpath every 6 days.

 

Having a convenient main 'supply' and a cheaper 'back-up' is good !

[floatsyourboat]

Just some more musings to pass the time until its off to bed.

 

 

Honda 2 kw (rated as 1600 watt continuous) LPG genny £1300

 

An LPG powered generator uses approx 1/3 kg of LPG per hour per KW.

 

A 13kg gas bottle will power a 2kw genny for just under 19 hours. (a 1kw for 39 hours)

If you run your genny 3 hours per day you get just over 6 days per gas bottle

Presumably you will be cooking on gas as well.

If you are moving on every two weeks then you will need to keep a 'stock' of gas bottles (what happens when the canal freezes and you cannot move for a month, or the canal is closed for lock repairs ? (will you be near enough to somewhere to walk and buy more gas ?)

 

Our local Gas supplier is £30 per bottle, that equates to about £1.50 per hour (2kw genny)

 

Your boat diesel tank is probably 200 litres (maybe more) so 200 hours of running the engine, you dont need to worry about being frozen in or having to find and carry gas bottles miles down the towpath every 6 days.

 

Having a convenient main 'supply' and a cheaper 'back-up' is good !

Excellent info Alan thanks.

If I have an inverter is there any point buying a Kipor inverter generator costing £350 over a cheap machine mart generator costing £100 or less?

Getting on the push bike for a can of petrol is ok but I wouldn't fancy try to lug about a 6kg gas bottle!

[Graham Davis]

Why use a petrol generator when your diesel engine will provide both electricity AND hot water?

Plus you have the added problem of finding secure storage for both the gennie and the petrol.

[b0atman]

Check out on the Calor site gas bottle prices 13kg is not double the price of 6 kg .

Try and use your fire for cooking meals on .

[Alan de Enfield]

6Kg bottles - you must be mad (or made of money)

 

6kg bottles = £20.75 = £3.46 / kg

13kg bottles = £27.25 = £2.13 / kg

 

Over 50% more expensive.

All my previous calculation need upgrading by 50%.

 

Using a 6kg bottle every three days (2kw genny)

 

NB - if you could store/handle 47kg bottles it would be down around £1.40 / kg

 

Keep asking questions before you commit to anything - there is a lot to learn.

 

I doubt the machine mart £65 genny will have sufficient oompf to feed your Sterling

A 650w (machine mart) genny will probably be rated at 500w continuous - thats 2 amps (my lap-top power supply draws 1.5 amps) Its not going to feed much of a battery charger.

 

Edit to add Machine Mart info :

 

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/clarke-720w-petrol-generator-g720

 

The cheapest one they seem to have now is £108 and is rated at a continuous 650watts (2.5 amps) so you could run a couple of light bulbs and my lap-top. Not worth having as a liveaboard - ideally you would need well over 1,000 watts (4 amps) continuous rating.

 

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/clarke-ig2200-2-2kw-inverter-generator

 

Uses 1 litre petrol per hour (£1.30 per hour + problems of storing cans and cans of petrol on board)

Edited September 28, 2014 by Alan de Enfield

[Arthur Brown]

Solar electricity; You will need 250 - 500w (panel rating) to be self sufficient during the three months of high summer. You will need 10 times that to be self sufficient all year (and there isn't room on a NB roof).

[floatsyourboat]

Right so the consensus is "use your engine" and everything else is fluff ?

How often will I need to service the engine and change/replace what if charging for 2 hours daily ?

Many thanks.

Right so the consensus is "use your engine" and everything else is fluff ?

How often will I need to service the engine and change/replace what if charging for 2 hours daily ?

Will doing this not prematurely wear my engine out?

Many thanks.

[Grace and Favour]

You'll need to change your oil every 200 hours or so (depending upon the engine)

That will entail oil & oil filter.

 

Change your fuel filter every 750 or so hours.

 

I change my alternator belts every 750 hours too

[Alan de Enfield]

Pretty much wot G&F said.

 

You dont have to stay moored up for 14 days - if you are running the engine anyway, why not move 2hrs further up the canal at the same time - travel and enjoy, you'll be stuck enough when the 'repair season and closures start)

[floatsyourboat]

Pretty much wot G&F said.

 

You dont have to stay moored up for 14 days - if you are running the engine anyway, why not move 2hrs further up the canal at the same time - travel and enjoy, you'll be stuck enough when the 'repair season and closures start)

After reading the replies I have pretty much come to that conclusion as it seems far more fun!

[Alan de Enfield]

Will doing this not prematurely wear my engine out?

Many thanks.

 

My Lister engine (LPWS4) has 9700 hours on th clock, purrs all day and (touch wood) doesnt use / leak a drop of oil between changes.

 

Give a Diesel engine

1) Clean air

2) Clean fuel

3) Clean oil

 

and it will run for ever

[cariad]

2011 £1250.28

2012 £629.02

2013 £1082.28

2014 £1200.68 so far this year

[cariad]

we change our engine and gearbox oil every 200 hours

new fuel and oil filters every 400 hours

air filters every 6 months

2 k.w. Honda gas conversion genny for charging along with 240 amp solar panels

gas genny saves engine wear and less oil changes.

[nb Innisfree]

When we were full time liveaboard ccers we used approx 100 litres per month. No solar, just the engine alternator +suitcase genny for an 8 hr weekly absorption charge.

[floatsyourboat]

2011 £1250.28

2012 £629.02

2013 £1082.28

2014 £1200.68 so far this year

Thanks how long are you charging with the engine and with your genny so I can get an idea of your routine please?

When we were full time liveaboard ccers we used approx 100 litres per month. No solar, just the engine alternator +suitcase genny for an 8 hr weekly absorption charge.

What was your alternator output and what genny did you use please?

[nb Innisfree]

What was your alternator output and what genny did you use please?

100amps @24v and Kipor 2kva inverter.