Huffin' and Puffin'

[Pen n Ink]

Hi all.

 

Just a quick post to mark today as the official start date for our project (so that you can all have a good laugh a few years down the line at our slow progress!). It's only taken us two years so far to get them this close to the drawing board.

 

Huffin' will be a 57' narrow motor; Puffin' a butty with workshop and extra accommodation; to be built as a liveaboard pair for work and play. Target date.... well - we've got a few things to do yet, such as identify the right builder!

[Phil Ambrose]

Hi Pen n Ink, given so much thought has gone into the project so far I'm sure you will now get it rolling along fairly soon.

Phil

[Mendip-Locks]

Subscribed! looking forward to following this.

 

A blog worth a read here http://www.narrowboat-waiouru.co.uk/2010/10/boat-specifications.html . Certainly don't skip this bit http://www.narrowboat-waiouru.co.uk/2011/07/despicable-ben-harp-narrowboat-builders.html and the posts that follow that.

 

Just a cautionary tale.

 

All the best with it.

 

Ade

[Pen n Ink]

Thanks for the good wishes - it's good to be able to share this sort of stuff with people whose eyes don't glaze over at the first mention of the word boat!

 

Yes... I was aware of that particular tale of woe but it never hurts to keep a weather eye out!

 

Our first problem (apart from deriving a sufficiently detailed specification to be useful to someone) is finding a hull builder who can actually build us a genuine butty hull - anyone actually had this done recently?

[David Mack]

Our first problem (apart from deriving a sufficiently detailed specification to be useful to someone) is finding a hull builder who can actually build us a genuine butty hull - anyone actually had this done recently?

That depends partly on how much you want to spend. Any of the 'First Division' boatbuilders can build you a close replica of a H&W/Yarwoods/Josher butty at a price, but I have also seen some truly awful 'butty' sterns from some of the lower tier builders.

 

Talk to a few boatbuilders and see if they are a) interested and b ) understand what you want. If they fail either of those tests, walk away.

Edited August 13, 2014 by David Mack

[Athy]

Speak to Mel Davis in Nottinghamshire. Other, more specialised, builders are available, but Mel may offer what the French call "le rapport qualite-prix" (balance between quality and price).

[paddy r]

We are having our butty done by PJ BARBER at sheet stores,he put a 20" bit in last winter and this year he is chopping of the back end which i made and doing a more traditional back end.

[dave moore]

If you want top quality steelwork, speak to Tony Bate at Norton Canes Boatbuilders, 01543 374888. Remember that the shell is the one thing that you can't easily change, most other factors are more easily altered.

 

Dave

[stagedamager]

Thought of a second hand butty? ?

[Pen n Ink]

Thanks for the tips which we will definitely be following up.

 

We have thought about a second hand butty, but firstly we want to ensure a matching pair, both aesthetically and for handling purposes, and secondly whilst we know that the initial capital expenditure will be greater, once we move on board and our income becomes less certain we would rather not have to worry about potential large bills for a few years - eg overplating or re-bottoming.

 

Please note though - as the project moves up through the gears - we are certainly not too proud to listen to advice which may be contrary to our own opinion! Most of you know far more than we do (or like to think we do).

 

Ed - to remove stray "b" which had landed in the middle...

Edited August 14, 2014 by Pen n Ink

[Mendip-Locks]

Whats the latest? update time?

[Pen n Ink]

Update...

 

Off to talk to a shortlist of builders for a first looky-see next weekend. All have come recommended, so I'll name and shame once we've been...

 

Been trying to master Rhino (used it for ages as a rank amateur) sufficiently to actually produce a proper 3D drawing of both boats so that we can use it for planning purposes. Not going to publish any pikkies until we have an actual hull shape - obviously this will partly depend on the final chosen builder. Also it gives me time to cover my embarrassment at being a rubbish CAD designer!

 

So - if you had one question to ask a prospective builder to narrow down the field - what would it be?

[Pen n Ink]

Well that was fun!

 

Lesson number one - even following the hard times of the last few years, the difference in attitude between boatbuilders amazes me. Been to see 3 builders now with appointments arranged 6 weeks in advance and confirmed by phone the previous week. Results?

 

1. Excellent - really interested, good attitude, wants the job. 2 year waiting list.

2. No-one there. Knew the owner wouldn't be but no-one else on site so no idea but not exactly inspiring.

3. Somewhere in the middle. Got the impression that we could have anything we wanted as long as it was what he wanted to build. 4 month waiting list.

 

Is it me?

[Kae]

Is it me?

 

Nope, it's the same in any tender process, it's amazing the range of replies you receive (and not always surprising when you hear of which businesses go tits up only a few years later).

 

When you have your short list, please, please ask for opinions in the open market (here, facebook etc) to get a good range of opinions and replies before you select your builder. Although few and far between, there are bad builders out there.

 

Good luck

[Naughty Cal]

 

Nope, it's the same in any tender process, it's amazing the range of replies you receive (and not always surprising when you hear of which businesses go tits up only a few years later).

 

When you have your short list, please, please ask for opinions in the open market (here, facebook etc) to get a good range of opinions and replies before you select your builder. Although few and far between, there are bad builders out there.

 

Good luck

The waiting list time can be a good indicator of the good from the bad. Although not always course.

[John V]

I have often wondered if there is a personality type that ends up running "artisan" style businesses.

Some, know best and that's what you will get. They won't even listen your instructions.

Some know what's best, listen carefully to your instructions and then do exactly what they think is right.

Some know what's best listen carefully to your instructions, try to talk you out of it but then, with a big sigh, do mostly what you ask.

Some people tell me that there are people who listen to your instructions and do exactly what you want.......I think they're a myth!

 

 

edit for a missing word that altered the whole thing!!!

Edited October 2, 2014 by John V

[Bee]

Nice project. if it was me and I had the space and time I would get as many pics. and measurements as poss and then with a big heap of scrap timber I would try to make up the frames of the stern and then 'plank' it with hardboard, if it works in hardboard it will work in steel (within reason) you will maybe see that the proportions of a short butty will not look quite right and make it a bit less deep, I started doing this with a dutch Tjalk many years ago and learnt a lot, that project was shelved but I did get my dutch boat in the end.

[Ray T]

I don't know how far on with your project but it may be worth trying to contact Ken & Mary Nelson.

 

You may be able to contact him via here:

The Secretary
International Guild of Knot Tyers
The Secretary, IGKT
Oaken Cleave
Cobbaton
Umberleigh
EX37 9SG UK

 

They had a motor and butty built and they are a beautiful pair, to my eyes any way.

DSCF2205

 

DSCF2211

Edited October 2, 2014 by Ray T

[SamKingfisher]

Definitely talk to Ken, but if he says don't get a RN, don't listen.

 

He was moored next to us for a few nights and was singing the praises of the kubota in the butty...

[Neil Smith]

Why not give paul widdowson a call, he just built us a 58 foot shell and pleased with it, great detail work and only took 8 weeks.

He is on holiday until about the 12th and I don't think he has got another booked in yet.

 

Neil

[Pen n Ink]

Wow!

 

Look at what happens if I go to work for a day!

 

Ironically all the builders on our (very) short list had come recommended, which has proved to us the old adage about you have to see for yourself...

 

I am absolutely with Ray T on how good that particular pair looks; unfortunately for us the wholly traditional type design would be difficult to work - headroom / width issues and several more - so it is likely that we will end up with something that looks a bit different, but we do have some ideas which we are currently working through.

 

Sadly from our experience when you are looking for a real craftsman to do a job you have to stop looking at some point. If you don't and you continually seek perfection, it's likely that you will look for ever. Right at the moment I'm deliberately not naming names (or posting any pictures because they might give the game away!) but I fully intend to do so on our blog as it builds.

 

Please keep the advice and options coming - I'm too old to feel that I know everything and there are some wise sages on here indeed!

[Pen n Ink]

Another update..

 

It may not be very exciting in the grand scheme of things, but we are very excited indeed. Bouncing around like a pair of demented Zebedee's in fact.

 

Yesterday we put down our deposit for the building of the motor shell by Mel Davis. Waiting time 2 years. This should just about give us time to get the detailed plans worked out, and the current schedule will have the butty following on about 9-12 months after the motor to allow us to get one fitted out to start off with.

 

The Gardner 3LW we've chosen will be restored in time for the start of the build by MPS so things are now starting to come together. We can't wait to have something to actually post pikkies of - so apologies! Perhaps I'll just go and find a nice picture of a duck or something...

[the barnacle]

are you keeping a blog of your build or is it just this thread i will have to follow?

[Pen n Ink]

I am keeping a blog - Huffin-n-puffin.com which is one of my today jobs to update!

 

ED: to create linky thing which I couldn't do earlier on the ipad.

Edited November 29, 2014 by Pen n Ink

[NickF]

Excellent, I have bookmarked the blog and look forward to reading about your progress .... I love the names!

the butty following on about 9-12 months after the motor

I know some people tow a butty on a long rope but twelve months behind the motor is a bit excessive!

Edited November 29, 2014 by NickF