My boat has sunk in Kingston (1939 ww2 wooden motor cruiser)

[Hair Bear Bunch]

Most important thing to control now is the state of charge of the pumping battery. If the battery goes flat then the pump will stop and so will the horn.

That's why I put 'separate battery' for the horn

[MtB]

Does anyone know a figure or ratio of water ingress that would be deemed normal / acceptable for a wooden boat?

 

When I owned a boat similar to yours, although of double diagonal construction but rotten as a peach all the same, it used to take on probably three or four litres of water a day.

 

Or to put it another way, we used to pump out the bilge perhaps every six weeks, or whenever the boat began to look noticeably lower than usual in the water. The bilge pump would run for about fifteen or twenty minutes. So I guess that's about 30 seconds of bilge pumping per day.

 

MtB

[RLWP]

Right, I need some help to help Marcus.

 

The main task that needs sorting is providing a means of greasing the sterngland. There are two grease points of unknown type, size, thread etc. I could go and measure them, I would then have to tag around the area looking for parts. My experience is this is frustrating and takes an enormous amount of time e.g. last time I bought a spark plug socket from Halfords three miles from a boat at Shepperton it took two hours. This time and frustration is because this isn't my usual patch - I don't know who sells what, where and the quickest way to get anywhere

 

This is the sterngland and it's grease points:

 

 

Not a good image as it was cropped from a low res mobile phone shot

 

Part 1:

 

 

Part 2:

 

 

To provide a means of pushing grease into these I need to know*:

 

What they are

What size they are

What to connect to them

 

I really need someone experienced in the area to visit Fairstar to answer these questions. Could someone do this for me and Marcus?

 

Richard

 

*yes, that's right. Fairstar has no greaser, hasn't had it's sterngland greased since she left Sheffield, and Marcus had never been shown the grease gland before the gearbox work on the Thames

[p6rob]

My inclination would be to unscrew them, find out the thread form and get appropriate grease nipples for the time being.

 

Presumably a local Screwfix or Machine Mart would have stocks of nipples.

[OldGoat]

I looked at the first (grotty picture) and wondered - pre-war boat - I wonder if they used the same type of greaser as old cars?

later pictures confirm that. Commonly known as "tat-caps" they were commonly used before nipple lubricators were invented. I may have something in my rummage box - but it would be a connector to fit an unspecified type of grease gun.

 

Rather than folks rushing around, wouldn't it be better to undo the greaser and fit either a nipple to accept any grease gun (I think the thread is 1/8" BSP or better still, source the more conventional grease canister type sold by MC or Uxbridge boat centre?

 

Does that help for starters?

[Wanted]

I can't get ove this week or next and I am probably not the best qulified but this website with hilarious name may help (Titter ye not!)

 

http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_Accessories.html

I think they are called button nipples...

 

 

 

 

 

 

behave..

[RLWP]

My inclination would be to unscrew them, find out the thread form and get appropriate grease nipples for the time being.

 

Presumably a local Screwfix or Machine Mart would have stocks of nipples.

 

Yes - except that fails the "I'll be damned if I'm going to run around London again" test

 

I looked at the first (grotty picture) and wondered - pre-war boat - I wonder if they used the same type of greaser as old cars?

later pictures confirm that. Commonly known as "tat-caps" they were commonly used before nipple lubricators were invented. I may have something in my rummage box - but it would be a connector to fit an unspecified type of grease gun.

 

Rather than folks rushing around, wouldn't it be better to undo the greaser and fit either a nipple to accept any grease gun (I think the thread is 1/8" BSP or better still, source the more conventional grease canister type sold by MC or Uxbridge boat centre?

 

Does that help for starters?

 

Yes, adapting to a standard size makes sense. I'm still stuck with having to visit, take off the caps and then trawl London for the answer. This may sound petty but, it takes two hours to get to Fairstar from here, and another two to get back. If I spend another couple of hours traipsing aimlessly around London I get bugger all done.

 

I can't get ove this week or next and I am probably not the best qulified but this website with hilarious name may help (Titter ye not!)

 

http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/copy_of_Accessories.html

I think they are called button nipples...

 

 

 

 

 

 

behave..

 

I'll check the website, I still need to know what size thread to connect to

 

Richard

 

A thought. Marcus, does the cap off the rear point (number 1) fit the front thread (number 2)?

Edited September 11, 2014 by RLWP

[p6rob]

My inclination would be to unscrew them, find out the thread form and get appropriate grease nipples for the time being.

 

Presumably a local Screwfix or Machine Mart would have stocks of nipples.

Just checked and neither Machine Mart or Screwfix sell grease nipples.

[RLWP]

Just checked and neither Machine Mart or Screwfix sell grease nipples.

 

Ahh, I forgot to say that

 

Richard

[RLWP]

Commonly known as "tat-caps" they were commonly used before nipple lubricators were invented.

 

The forum comes up trumps again! This is the clue I needed, thank you

 

They are indeed TAT type grease nipples: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UMETA-Grease-Nipples-Button-Head-Tat-Type-Pack-of-25-Size-1-8-BSP-Gas-/290634437310?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item43ab2992be

 

I now need to know what thread they are

 

Richard

[phill]

Also worth tightening the gland, there's a fair amount of packing left apparently so you should be able to slow things right down.

 

I know, you have already done this but just in case.

[RLWP]

Actually, the gland has never been adjusted since Marcus owned Fairstar

 

Richard

[andyb116]

Those type grease nipples were used commonly on military vehicles pre 70,s, if you check some of the ex military surplus websites there should be some of what we used to call grease buckets, they take a 5KG can of grease and have an extendable handle and will pump grease into the most awkward af places, also this type of grease nipple very rarely failed and were a much more positive fitting than the more modern type, they were also usually made of brass so didn't corrode. Hope this helps.

[David Mack]

In the absence of knowing what the correct thread is, can you attach a new grease nipple or off-the-shelf greaser to a similar diameter tube, and then connect to the grease point on the boat using flexible hose and jubilee clips? A bit of a bodge, but it would enable Marcus to grease it regularly until you can find the right fitting.

[RLWP]

Things are moving fast - this modern technology is pretty natty, it might catch on.

 

Marcus has done the following.

 

Point 2:

 

 

The grease point has a nut screwed on the outside (those are Marcus's soft, accountants fingers

 

Point 1:

 

 

Using his weak, accountant-type muscles he has accidentally pulled the grease tube out! The Tat cap is front, right

 

He is going to post these parts to me

 

Richard

 

How am I going to get that tube back in???

Those type grease nipples were used commonly on military vehicles pre 70,s, if you check some of the ex military surplus websites there should be some of what we used to call grease buckets, they take a 5KG can of grease and have an extendable handle and will pump grease into the most awkward af places, also this type of grease nipple very rarely failed and were a much more positive fitting than the more modern type, they were also usually made of brass so didn't corrode. Hope this helps.

 

I'll do some research around this, thank you

In the absence of knowing what the correct thread is, can you attach a new grease nipple or off-the-shelf greaser to a similar diameter tube, and then connect to the grease point on the boat using flexible hose and jubilee clips? A bit of a bodge, but it would enable Marcus to grease it regularly until you can find the right fitting.

 

That's an ingenious bodge - hopefully I can avoid it for now

Edited September 11, 2014 by RLWP

[gazza]

Richard.

 

Wouldn't it be easier to buy two new ones and furnish Marcus with a grease gun with the correct end on it?

 

Or are you planning on fitting a stern gland greaser?

Edited September 11, 2014 by gazza

[RLWP]

Also worth tightening the gland, there's a fair amount of packing left apparently so you should be able to slow things right down.

 

I know, you have already done this but just in case.

 

I think we should do something about this.

 

 

Marcus, can you measure these two diameters please. I'll get some packing for the stern gland

 

Richard

 

Richard.

 

Wouldn't it be easier to buy two new ones and furnish Marcus with a grease gun with the correct end on it?

 

Or are you planning on fitting a stern gland greaser?

 

Not sure yet. Either new nipples and a gun or a proper greasing system. Plus training (windlass assisted if necessary)

[OldGoat]

Cor, Blimey - I just nipped out to me workshop to look for said caps and come back to find all this extra stuff....

• M'Lud RLWP the thread is 1/8 BSP as guessed earlier
• I have a couple of brass tat caps to hand if needed - but norra lot of use if you dan't have a corresponding grease gun.
• I also have some grease nipples with similar thread. They don't fit so well (I have tried them in a fitting), so I assume they are designed to be an interference fit. PM me with an address if you want me to post a couple. Have missed todays collection.
• As to the loose tube IIRC having that trouble on a hire boat once - and it was an interference fit.

 

 

[RLWP]

The loose tube. I think a wooden plug and a new hole might be the solution - I'll have to check my stock of wooden holes though

 

PM sent

 

Richard

[phill]

 

I think we should do something about this.

 

 

Marcus, can you measure these two diameters please. I'll get some packing for the stern gland

 

Richard

 

 

Not sure yet. Either new nipples and a gun or a proper greasing system. Plus training (windlass assisted if necessary)

 

Given there's an inch between the two flanges I would at least try tightening the two nuts. Chances are that will stop any dripping.

[RLWP]

 

Given there's an inch between the two flanges I would at least try tightening the two nuts. Chances are that will stop any dripping.

 

Yes, that's a good short term solution. I'm going to get Marcus to do that tomorrow

 

And while I'm sorting the greasing, I might as well change the packing. Fairstar appears to have had negligible maintenance for years

 

Richard

Edited September 11, 2014 by RLWP

[gazza]

 

I think we should do something about this.

 

 

Marcus, can you measure these two diameters please. I'll get some packing for the stern gland

 

Richard

 

 

Not sure yet. Either new nipples and a gun or a proper greasing system. Plus training (windlass assisted if necessary)

:-)

 

The gland looks pretty grotty.

Is it looking like a major contributor to Fairstar taking on water?

[RLWP]

Not easy to tell from my workshop in the Midlands, Marcus says yes

 

Richard

[Marcus Warry]

Thank you for all your amazing help!!!

 

The stern glad has been raised by a few as one of the likely causes of water intake, and you can see some seepage...

 

I'll clean it up a bit prior to Richard's arrival on site... All that dirt is river silt basically!

 

Mx

[RLWP]

So, your tasks are:

 

 

Measure those two diameters, and:

 

 

Under the grot there are a couple of threaded rods (studs) with nuts on the end. In all probability there are two nuts on each stud, locked together. You job is to hold the nut nearest the gland and undo the nut furthest away by a bit (half a turn?). Do this on both studs.

 

Then, tighten the inside nuts by half a turn, one side then the other, and see if the dripping from the sterngland slows down. It will be OK to tighten them until it stops, but DON'T RUN THE ENGINE UNTIL THEY HAVE BEEN PROPERLY ADJUSTED!!!! There is a good chance this will significantly reduce the amount of water coming into Fairstar

 

I'll do the packing next week