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Video about CCers


cotswoldsman

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My word,,you really have got some sort of problem havnt you.

No I haven't got a computer, I've got a phone.

No one in the last cpl of hrs anyway has wiped my bottom as you suggest.

When you said it's quite clear in the guidelines,,I didn't have the guidelines you were talking about,at that tome,hence my post 44

No I am not happy reading the guidelines, I have read them and didn't feel any particular emotion.

So you making false statements or making wrong assumptions tells a lot about you.

 

As I stated

 

It's quite clear in the guidelines.

If you're prepared to take them as a hole. As I stated on another thread anyone with a trace element of intelligence and common sense should be able to follow them.

 

If you wish to take that personally that's you perrogative.

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Anwway happy days someone wiped your bottom for you and you have the guidelines, happy reading smile.png

 

What a strange way to look at it..

 

I vaguely recalled the name of the document in question stuck the document name and 'canal and river trust' into the google search box and found the link.

 

Took all of 15 secs, including the time to post it here.

 

I wouldn't call it 'wiping anybody's back side' just helping them (its what boaters do isn't it?), especially when I am at home at the moment and on a fast BB connection which sometimes means I can find things much faster than some boaters hanging on the end of a dongle or phone in an area of weak signal.

 

In the time you took to write all you subsequent posts you could have done the same.

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As I stated

 

It's quite clear in the guidelines.

If you're prepared to take them as a hole. As I stated on another thread anyone with a trace element of intelligence and common sense should be able to follow them.

 

If you wish to take that personally that's you perrogative.

You made statement 2 & 3 in response to my original post 44,that was simply asking for an answer to a quiry,as is the case with so many posts from so many members every day..

 

Rather than do a sensible and helpful thing like Dog House did and post a link answering the Quiry, you made statments crypticly relating to the 'Guidelines' that out of the two of us,only you knew, & I had no knowledge of at that time, which was of no help what so ever.

 

You even evaded giving me the thread you where referring to when I specifically asked for it in post 61.which would have been a very easy thing for you to do, as demonstrated by Dog House. Instead you went to some effort and made several false statements and assumptions relating to intelligence,boat handling capabilities,personal feelings,private education & toilet hygiene practices, Evven dabbling in fortelling the future that were nither necessary or relivent to my original simple post 44 that basically asked,,,How far do you need to move,,, very odd behaviour.

Very sad.very sad.

Edited by Paul's Nulife4-2
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As I stated

 

It's quite clear in the guidelines.

If you're prepared to take them as a hole. As I stated on another thread anyone with a trace element of intelligence and common sense should be able to follow them.

 

If you wish to take that personally that's you perrogative.

 

 

But they are not 'guidelines' so searching for 'guidelines' would NOT be helpful

 

They are "Guidance for boaters without a home mooring"

 

Guidance = Guidance in interpreting the law ie CART do not make the law.

 

it is a completely different thing from 'guidelines' so it's important to make the distinction for reasons other than internet searches

,,How far do you need to move,,,

 

CART can't give minimum distances because the law does not give min distances.

In my opinion, any 'minimum distance' would vary from area to area (as they acknowledge with their 'place' in their guidance) and also it is the cruising pattern on the whole (over the term on the licence) that needs to be looked at rather than how far from A to B then how far from B to C etc

 

Does that make sense? I may not have explained it well

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Yes,thanks LoneWolf.

Found the link,& read it, yep all makes sence to me.

 

I can see that some of the problem / argument is that there doesn't seam to be a black & white definitive rule covering this subject.

EG 4 mile must be coverd every 14 days no return within 42 days , That sort of thing,(No,no,no I am not saying that should be the distance or time) i'm trying to take the ambiguity out of the interpretation of being a CCr that's all.

At least it's very clear parameters,that we could then argue over.

Edited by Paul's Nulife4-2
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Yes,thanks LoneWolf.

Found the link,& read it, yep all makes sence to me.

 

I can see that some of the problem / argument is that there doesn't seam to be a black & white definitive rule covering this subject.

EG 4 mile must be coverd every 14 days no return within 42 days , That sort of thing,(No,no,no I am not saying that should be the distance or time) i'm trying to take the ambiguity out of the interpretation of being a CCr that's all.

At least it's very clear parameters,that we could then argue over.

 

Paul. If it helps. I have given up trying to know "how much is enough". My feeling is I will just enjoy my boating, and if someones not happy with it, they can approach me, let me know where I've gone wrong, and I'll adjust my cruising to suit...if I feel they are justified in their objection. From my experience new CC-ers will try and see the whole network, or a wide area, but after some time...will begin cruising within a smaller range...covering just their favourite parts....but not remaining on the same stretch for very long. Problems arise when the cruising area....becomes too small.....and they are often seen by enforcers....in the same patch....thats when CRT start watching a little more closely.

Edited by DeanS
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But they are not 'guidelines' so searching for 'guidelines' would NOT be helpful

 

They are "Guidance for boaters without a home mooring"

 

Guidance = Guidance in interpreting the law ie CART do not make the law.

 

it is a completely different thing from 'guidelines' so it's important to make the distinction for reasons other than internet searches

 

CART can't give minimum distances because the law does not give min distances.

In my opinion, any 'minimum distance' would vary from area to area (as they acknowledge with their 'place' in their guidance) and also it is the cruising pattern on the whole (over the term on the licence) that needs to be looked at rather than how far from A to B then how far from B to C etc

 

Does that make sense? I may not have explained it well

 

I think most of us know what I mean on a thread talking about CC'in rules on a forum about boating, and TDH put the link up very shortly after anyway smile.png

Edited by Julynian
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I think that's a sensible approach Dean.

 

I've never experienced that sort of problem myself as a CCr, but it always raises it's head on here, so assume it's becomeing worse, so it got me thinking, a contributing factor might be one persons interpretation of a neighbourhood to another person's interpretation for example.

Even something like a postal code or area has a boundary, just a thought.

Edited by Paul's Nulife4-2
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My feeling is I will just enjoy my boating, and if someones not happy with it, they can approach me, let me know where I've gone wrong, and I'll adjust my cruising to suit...if I feel they are justified in their objection.

 

 

 

Totally agree dean, it's almost impossible to fix rules on a network so varied, basically as you say move on if when required and if C&RT don't like your movements for some reason, then adjust accordingly, that's why there's guidance issued and not specific rules as it doesn't always apply the same in different areas. Just fair play and some common sense is required, I would guess 90% + of boaters know and manage to comply without issue.

Edited by Julynian
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Paul. If it helps. I have given up trying to know "how much is enough". My feeling is I will just enjoy my boating, and if someones not happy with it, they can approach me, let me know where I've gone wrong, and I'll adjust my cruising to suit...if I feel they are justified in their objection. From my experience new CC-ers will try and see the whole network, or a wide area, but after some time...will begin cruising within a smaller range...covering just their favourite parts....but not remaining on the same stretch for very long. Problems arise when the cruising area....becomes too small.....and they are often seen by enforcers....in the same patch....thats when CRT start watching a little more closely.

I think that is sound advice. If you are cruising over a big enough area and not stopping too long then your not going to come up on the enforecement radar.

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Motive?? It is about boating and last time I looked this was a boating forum.

 

Or more specifically John it is about politics in boating between cc'ers and non cc'ers isn't it? I was a bit dissapointed with the video really. We met Anna Snowball on the towpath at Kensal Green last June I think. At the time she told us her brief was to make a film about families living on narrowboats, specifically from the perspective of the children. We pointed her in the direction of Peggy (Melmouth - not sure of spelling) and Heidi and Louise (in the video) becasue at the time they were the only people we knew of living on boats with children. I find it a shame the video appears to have been hijaked by boating politics instead. We were hoping that would not happen as there had already been so many other short films released around London boaters and K&A boaters of the same sort. Still, I guess there are a few good plugs for ACC in it.

 

By the way, while I have your attention, as you are a moderator on the Contimuous Cruiser Facebook group would you be kind enough to approve my request to rejoin, its taking an awfully long time to happen?

 

Derek.

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To me the most interesting thing about it is that the owner of the boat featured is currently not a CC-er, and the CRT Residential mooring she now rents commanded IIRC over £4,200 at auction, (I think I have the right one - and this for an unserviced mooring on a stretch of muddy tow-path). Yes you read that correctly - I suspect many people don't pay anything like that for a fully serviced and secure off-line berth.

 

I actually think if the film were to spell this out, it might dispel some of the myths that it is easy to just live on a boat in an area that you have ties to without a home mooring, and specifically the myths that CRT will leave you alone to get on with it.

 

The harsh reality is that whilst one regularly hears that countless people are giving up permanent moorings to declare themselves CC-ers, in this area, at least, I can produce an extensive list of auctioned CRT moorings that are now rented by boat owner that were previously without home moorings.

 

I have seen every evidence of CRT being much tighter on enforcement, and would suggest that on my most local stretch of canal anyone who assumes they can just get away with the legendary "bridge hop" would probably now be deluding themselves.

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Hi John

 

Did you say sometime earlier it was part 1 of 3 ? if so when do we get part 2 & 3

 

In anticipation.

 

Julian

 

I found 2 other videos on Anna Snowball's website relating to canal boating, one is in post production (River Gypsy) and the other is entitled "Allayne & Paul".

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Or more specifically John it is about politics in boating between cc'ers and non cc'ers isn't it? I was a bit dissapointed with the video really. We met Anna Snowball on the towpath at Kensal Green last June I think. At the time she told us her brief was to make a film about families living on narrowboats, specifically from the perspective of the children. We pointed her in the direction of Peggy (Melmouth - not sure of spelling) and Heidi and Louise (in the video) becasue at the time they were the only people we knew of living on boats with children. I find it a shame the video appears to have been hijaked by boating politics instead. We were hoping that would not happen as there had already been so many other short films released around London boaters and K&A boaters of the same sort. Still, I guess there are a few good plugs for ACC in it.

 

By the way, while I have your attention, as you are a moderator on the Contimuous Cruiser Facebook group would you be kind enough to approve my request to rejoin, its taking an awfully long time to happen?

 

Derek.

Your barred from that group Derek. You won't be allowed back in. Sorry.
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I have seen every evidence of CRT being much tighter on enforcement, and would suggest that on my most local stretch of canal anyone who assumes they can just get away with the legendary "bridge hop" would probably now be deluding themselves.

 

On our return to the Lee & Stort this Winter Alan, we have heard accounts from individual boaters which concurs with what you are saying, and more people looking for moorings too.

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To me the most interesting thing about it is that the owner of the boat featured is currently not a CC-er, and the CRT Residential mooring she now rents commanded IIRC over £4,200 at auction, (I think I have the right one - and this for an unserviced mooring on a stretch of muddy tow-path). Yes you read that correctly - I suspect many people don't pay anything like that for a fully serviced and secure off-line berth.

 

I actually think if the film were to spell this out, it might dispel some of the myths that it is easy to just live on a boat in an area that you have ties to without a home mooring, and specifically the myths that CRT will leave you alone to get on with it.

 

The harsh reality is that whilst one regularly hears that countless people are giving up permanent moorings to declare themselves CC-ers, in this area, at least, I can produce an extensive list of auctioned CRT moorings that are now rented by boat owner that were previously without home moorings.

 

I have seen every evidence of CRT being much tighter on enforcement, and would suggest that on my most local stretch of canal anyone who assumes they can just get away with the legendary "bridge hop" would probably now be deluding themselves.

 

Have to agree, especially with ref to enforcement. I just posted this a short time ago on another thread.

 

It does seem there's more enforcement now, I noticed quite a lack of boats in a prominent mooring spot recently and most of the remaining boats on that stretch had winter mooring permits. A few days after this someone walking on the tow path mentioned that a C&RT enforcement officer had been around a few days prior. So I think something is being done, I wouldn't expect a noticeable overnight increase in enforcement though, I believe it will be a slow process, but pretty sure it's happening or some plan is in motion.

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I found 2 other videos on Anna Snowball's website relating to canal boating, one is in post production (River Gypsy) and the other is entitled "Allayne & Paul".

 

Cheers Paul I'll keep a look out. I thought they were pretty good considering the short length, very professionally done as well IMO of course.

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The video was well produced and comes across as a neutral standpoint, airing both sides of the debate, but I feel it could have been longer and focused on more than one boater. So, if the producer produces 2 more videos then my criticisms are answered! Agree that the topic isn't "boating", but "boating politics" however.

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I've been banned Steve, how odd, what for?

Derek if my memory serves me right you were a member of the group and left

The video was well produced and comes across as a neutral standpoint, airing both sides of the debate, but I feel it could have been longer and focused on more than one boater. So, if the producer produces 2 more videos then my criticisms are answered! Agree that the topic isn't "boating", but "boating politics" however.

I thought it showed both sides and was not really political
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