Anyone know anything about a boatman called 'Warner'

[Mrs Trackman]

I have met a lady who is over 90 who knows very little about her father and Grandfather except that her father used to go and help his father work what she believes were coal boats. She thought maybe from Leicester to Birmingham. I would have thought Coventry to Birmingham might have been more likely?

I know a lot of you know an awful lot about old boats but I don't know if anyone knows about boat families or maybe could point me in the right direction. Warner is not a name I have heard of in what I have read.

[John Williamson 1955]

I'd go with Leicestershire on the Ashby canal from the Moira pits. They had their own narrowboat fleet until quite late on. The pit at Moira was still working into the 1980s and later.

 

The Coventry colliery was all but worked out by 1923, so there would likely have been little traffic from WW1 on, and the pits were likely only kept open that long due to the wartime war shortages.

[howardang]

I have met a lady who is over 90 who knows very little about her father and Grandfather except that her father used to go and help his father work what she believes were coal boats. She thought maybe from Leicester to Birmingham. I would have thought Coventry to Birmingham might have been more likely?

I know a lot of you know an awful lot about old boats but I don't know if anyone knows about boat families or maybe could point me in the right direction. Warner is not a name I have heard of in what I have read.

A quick google found the following, courtesy of Roots web, which might help (highlighted in red):-

 

".....From: ThlmMry@aol.com

Subject: [CANAL-PEOPLE] 1881 CENSUS BOATMEN

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:44:24 EST

 

 

"Workhouse" 7,Lester Rd,Rothley, Leicester

John BRANSTON/U/85/Formerly Boatman (No Occ), Inmate (Barrow,Leicester)

William WOODHOUSE/W/74/Late Boatman (No Occ)inmate (Barrow,Leicester)

Thos BROWN/M/70/Late Boatman (No Occ) Inmate (blank)

Anthony REPTON/U/77/Late Boatman (No Occ) (blank)

 

at 24 Thurtcaston Road,Belgrave,Leicester

John C.SIMONS/M/30/Boatman (Loughborough,Leicester) with wife & 5 ch

 

at Belgrave Wharf Coal Boat, Belgrave,Leicester

George /M/50/Captain (Seaman) (Loughborough,Leicester) alone

 

at 14 Richards St, Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

John WARNER/U/52/Boat Man (Leicester) Lodger with Edward Tebbutt & family

 

at 226 Syston St,Leicester Margaret,Leicester

William STOR (?) sic/U/46/Boatman(North Allingham,Nottingham) (Bro/in/law

with John Byrne & family

 

at 1 1/2 Providence St,Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

William GILBERT/M/50/oatman (Thurmaston,Leicester) with wife & 3 ch

 

at 44 Russell St,Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

 

I hope this helps,

 

Howard

 

Edited January 8, 2014 by howardang

[alan_fincher]

The Coventry colliery was all but worked out by 1923, so there would likely have been little traffic from WW1 on, and the pits were likely only kept open that long due to the wartime war shortages.

 

??????

 

Not quite!

 

Coal was being regularly loaded at many places on the Coventry Canal, and specifically in the Coventry area through the 1950s, and probably into the 1960s.

 

One such location is Longford, which is actually between Hawkesbury and Coventry, but there were many other loading locations near Coventry well beyond World War II, (e.g. at Newdigate, Bedworth only a mile or so North of Sutton stop).

 

EDITED TO ADD:

 

Warner is not a name I have ever encountered in connection with families who operated carrying Narrow Boats, but alongside all the "standard" names like Carter/Wain/Boswell/Ward/Peasland/Harrison/etc that stand out because they come up so often, there will still be plenty of others who worked the boats that are far less well known.

Edited January 8, 2014 by alan_fincher

[Mrs Trackman]

A quick google found the following, courtesy of Roots web, which might help (highlighted in red):-

 

".....From: ThlmMry@aol.com

Subject: [CANAL-PEOPLE] 1881 CENSUS BOATMEN

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:44:24 EST

 

 

"Workhouse" 7,Lester Rd,Rothley, Leicester

John BRANSTON/U/85/Formerly Boatman (No Occ), Inmate (Barrow,Leicester)

William WOODHOUSE/W/74/Late Boatman (No Occ)inmate (Barrow,Leicester)

Thos BROWN/M/70/Late Boatman (No Occ) Inmate (blank)

Anthony REPTON/U/77/Late Boatman (No Occ) (blank)

 

at 24 Thurtcaston Road,Belgrave,Leicester

John C.SIMONS/M/30/Boatman (Loughborough,Leicester) with wife & 5 ch

 

Belgrave Wharf Coal Boat, Belgrave,Leicester

George /M/50/Captain (Seaman) (Loughborough,Leicester) alone

 

at 14 Richards St, Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

John WARNER/U/52/Boat Man (Leicester) Lodger with Edward Tebbutt & family

 

at 226 Syston St,Leicester Margaret,Leicester

William STOR (?) sic/U/46/Boatman(North Allingham,Nottingham) (Bro/in/law

with John Byrne & family

 

at 1 1/2 Providence St,Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

William GILBERT/M/50/oatman (Thurmaston,Leicester) with wife & 3 ch

 

at 44 Russell St,Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

 

I hope this helps,

 

Howard

 

Wow! Thankyou so much. I'm

Sure lady will be delighted when I tell her.

Thanks everyone for your speedy replies which look convincing to me. The father who helped his father when he was a boy would have been born before or around the beginning of the twentieth century.

Or earlier

[The Pipe]

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2002 10:44:24 EST


"Workhouse" 7,Lester Rd,Rothley, Leicester
John BRANSTON/U/85/Formerly Boatman (No Occ), Inmate (Barrow,Leicester)
William WOODHOUSE/W/74/Late Boatman (No Occ)inmate (Barrow,Leicester)
Thos BROWN/M/70/Late Boatman (No Occ) Inmate (blank)
Anthony REPTON/U/77/Late Boatman (No Occ) (blank)

 

I knew things were bad but we now have the "workhouse" back!

 

[Julie Marie]

On 08/01/2014 at 14:36, howardang said:

 

 

at 1 1/2 Providence St,Leicester St Margaret,Leicester

William GILBERT/M/50/oatman (Thurmaston,Leicester) with wife & 3 ch

Hi I have just recently joined this group and my great grandad is called William Gilbert and I have not long been told that he was the lock keeper and lived at the lock keepers cottage in Hatton I noticed your post and this bit of information but I don’t know what it means, could you please tell me. Many thanks Julie

[WotEver]

49 minutes ago, Julie Marie said:

I don’t know what it means

Simply that the 1881 census records a chap called William Gilbert, a male boatman, aged 50, living with his wife and 3 children at 1 1/2 Provident Street.

As he was 50 in 1881 I'd guess that he's your great, great grandad.

[Julie Marie]

Thank you for the reply but my great grandad was 54 when he died and that was in 1937. It’s such a common name as I’m finding out. 

[WotEver]

17 minutes ago, Julie Marie said:

Thank you for the reply but my great grandad was 54 when he died and that was in 1937. It’s such a common name as I’m finding out. 

Then possibly great great great grandad. 

[Julie Marie]

I never thought of that!! I have done my ancestry but I think I’ve possibly gone wrong on his branches, this would definitely make sense to me. Thank you

[Captain Pegg]

10 hours ago, WotEver said:

Simply that the 1881 census records a chap called William Gilbert, a male boatman, aged 50, living with his wife and 3 children at 1 1/2 Provident Street.

As he was 50 in 1881 I'd guess that he's your great, great grandad.

 

1 hour ago, WotEver said:

Then possibly great great great grandad. 

You’re leading @Julie Marie down the garden path here. This is supposition on a massive scale. It’s a potential lead but having looked at the other thread Julie Marie started and conducted some searches it’s nothing more than that. Gilbert is a very common name and Midlands folk with connections to canal boating in the 19th century are far from uncommon. I can find at least five groups of people having some connection to canal boating that share the same surname as my most immediate boating ancestors and between which I can find no link even after many years of research. One of them lived in the same street as my ancestors but we’re not related.

This is merely a starting point for research. Can Julie Marie confirm how she is conducting her research?

 

JP

Edited July 8, 2020 by Captain Pegg

[WotEver]

4 minutes ago, Captain Pegg said:

You’re leading @Julie Marie down the garden path here. This is supposition on a massive scale.

Agreed. But it might be a starting point

[Julie Marie]

Hi, I started doing my family tree on ancestry and got the names etc which my mother confirmed (we do not know any further back than my great grandad William Gilbert) my mother has since found out from my great great aunt that they lived at Hatton at the lock keepers cottage and also moved to Knowle still being a lock keeper at around 1920 (as this is when my grandad was born) I am aware that Gilbert is a popular name and seem to be a lot in the same area of no relation to each other. It does make it extremely confusing for me researching them but any information is helpful no matter how small as I could hopefully build on it to find out matching facts from ancestry. 

[Mike Todd]

2 hours ago, Julie Marie said:

Thank you for the reply but my great grandad was 54 when he died and that was in 1937. It’s such a common name as I’m finding out. 

Quite surprising how, especially in small rural communities, the same name is given to so many people, all alive at the same time. In the past there was a lot of emphasis on maintaining the family's traditional names - sometimes using a maternal line surname as a forename. Also, to add to confusion, if a particular name meant a lot to a family, and that child died young, then it would be given, again, to a later child. Must have played havoc with child psychology!

[Captain Pegg]

12 minutes ago, Julie Marie said:

Hi, I started doing my family tree on ancestry and got the names etc which my mother confirmed (we do not know any further back than my great grandad William Gilbert) my mother has since found out from my great great aunt that they lived at Hatton at the lock keepers cottage and also moved to Knowle still being a lock keeper at around 1920 (as this is when my grandad was born) I am aware that Gilbert is a popular name and seem to be a lot in the same area of no relation to each other. It does make it extremely confusing for me researching them but any information is helpful no matter how small as I could hopefully build on it to find out matching facts from ancestry. 

I suspect your main problem is that the information you are seeking is contained in the 1921 census and you’ll have to wait until next year until that becomes available online. Unfortunately your great grandfather died before the 1939 England & Wales Register was compiled so the most useful source of more recent information is not of help. Have you found your grandfather on the 1939 Register?

 

JP

[Julie Marie]

2 hours ago, Mike Todd said:

Quite surprising how, especially in small rural communities, the same name is given to so many people, all alive at the same time. In the past there was a lot of emphasis on maintaining the family's traditional names - sometimes using a maternal line surname as a forename. Also, to add to confusion, if a particular name meant a lot to a family, and that child died young, then it would be given, again, to a later child. Must have played havoc with child psychology!

Yes I noticed that, thank you, I will hopefully figure it all out, EVENTUALLY!

1 hour ago, Captain Pegg said:

I suspect your main problem is that the information you are seeking is contained in the 1921 census and you’ll have to wait until next year until that becomes available online. Unfortunately your great grandfather died before the 1939 England & Wales Register was compiled so the most useful source of more recent information is not of help. Have you found your grandfather on the 1939 Register?

 

JP

Yes that’s true!! I will hopefully get my answers on the 1921 census. I know about my great grandfather and have found the newspaper article of when he got killed in 1937 and I know where he was living then also. 

[Mike Todd]

6 hours ago, Julie Marie said:

Yes I noticed that, thank you, I will hopefully figure it all out, EVENTUALLY!

Yes that’s true!! I will hopefully get my answers on the 1921 census. I know about my great grandfather and have found the newspaper article of when he got killed in 1937 and I know where he was living then also. 

the Warwickshire Local History Society Facebook says

 

One of our readers has the following appeal for information: "I’m not sure if anyone can help me in any way, I have just discovered that my Grandad Norman Gilbert’s father was living at Hatton lock keepers cottage with his family in 1920, I was wondering if there was anyone who knew any information or had any photos of them at that time? his father was called William Gilbert and he was the lock keeper around that time. My Grandad was born in 1920. As far as I know there are no photos of my great grandad in our family. I just thought it was worth a try messaging a few different businesses and such in the area in case anyone has a knowledge of the history. "

 

(Unless your name is also Julie Price!)

[Julie Marie]

Yes this is me! The name was already taken on here. Thank you so much for looking, my heart skipped a beat though as I thought someone else was looking! I’ve literally messaged anywhere and everywhere I can think of, think I’m running out of options. 
thank you