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'Idle Women' in the North


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We've just come across a fascinating photo (which I'll put up later) of Willow and Ash on the Shroppie in 1943.

 

Not only is that extremely interesting in itself (it's our only pre 1974 photo of Willow) but the pair (of motors! Another rarity) are crewed by female trainees, and the boats leased from Severn and Canal by FMC.

 

I've seen mention briefly of this scheme- an unsuccessful variant of the succesful scheme by the GUCCCo- in I think Kit Gayford's book, but are there any more references, and any ideas where records might be?

 

Possible approaches would, I suppose, being to look through the S&CCCo archives (in Gloucester) or the FMC archives (? Ellesmere ?) for leasing paperwork.

 

I'm also going to comb through my collection of the Idle Women's books to see what's said.

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It turns out that the arrangement between S&CCCo and FMC was informal, so probably less of a.paper trail. Worth having a look, though.

i am not one for taking publications at face value but Alan H. Faulkner writes on page 31 of his booklet Severn & Canal and Cadburys the following:

 

"During the 1940's and with the virtual cessation of its own narrow boat traffics, the SCC hired out several of the Charles Hill motors to FMC. They were used between the Midlands and the North West. Some remained in this role well into 1949; ELM loaded 23 tons of flour at Ellesmere Port on 13 April destined for Wolverhampton."

 

No mention of women 'trainees' though.

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We know Willow wasn't hired to FMC after the war because of the Gloucester health inspector's reports, stating it as being worked by Severn and Canal.

 

I'd like to find out more about arrangements during the war with FMC, though, hence a forthcoming trip to various archives.

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We know Willow wasn't hired to FMC after the war because of the Gloucester health inspector's reports, stating it as being worked by Severn and Canal.

 

I'd like to find out more about arrangements during the war with FMC, though, hence a forthcoming trip to various archives.

The health inspectors reports are not that straight forward as they will list the owner of the boat (S. & C.C.Co. Ltd.) and not who was hiring it (F.M.C. Ltd.). The fact that WILLOW was still being regulary inspected at Gloucester suggests that it was not hired to F.M.C. Ltd. after the Second World War.

 

it was also not that much of a rarity for two S. & C.C.Co. Ltd. motors to work as a pair, especially following the disposal of all but five of their horse boat / buttys in 1942. WILLOW and PINE were paired under the captaincy of W. Helm in 1948 and 1949.

Edited by pete harrison
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We've just come across a fascinating photo (which I'll put up later) of Willow and Ash on the Shroppie in 1943.

If you have a photograph of WILLOW on the Shropshire Union Canal in 1943 it was almost certainly on hire to F.M.C. Ltd. as this canal was not a S. & C.C.Co. Ltd. route (unless they were under the control of the Ministry of War Transport). This would co-incide with WILLOW not being captured by the Gloucester inspections (missing from 15 July 1942 until 25 February 1944).

 

I have just completed a quick survey of the Gloucester inspections covering the period of the Second World War and all of the Charles Hill built 'Severners' were passing through Gloucester from time to time - but In 1942 ASH and PINE are missing, in 1943 ELM, FIR and WILLOW are missing, in 1944 ASH and ELM are missing and in 1945 ASH, BEECH and PINE were missing. It may be that these were the boats hired to F.M.C. Ltd. (or under the control of the Ministry of War Transport), or it may be that the Gloucester Inspector simply did not inspect them.

Edited by pete harrison
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If you have a photograph of WILLOW on the Shropshire Union Canal in 1943 it was almost certainly on hire to F.M.C. Ltd. as this canal was not a S. & C.C.Co. Ltd. route (unless they were under the control of the Ministry of War Transport). This would co-incide with WILLOW not being captured by the Gloucester inspections (missing from 15 July 1942 until 25 February 1944).

 

I have just completed a quick survey of the Gloucester inspections covering the period of the Second World War and all of the Charles Hill built 'Severners' were passing through Gloucester from time to time - but In 1942 ASH and PINE are missing, in 1943 ELM, FIR and WILLOW are missing, in 1944 ASH and ELM are missing and in 1945 ASH, BEECH and PINE were missing. It may be that these were the boats hired to F.M.C. Ltd. (or under the control of the Ministry of War Transport), or it may be that the Gloucester Inspector simply did not inspect them.

Thanks, that makes sense.

 

here's the photo: © Molly Traill Archives

received_m_mid-1379960205537_256260d7dfd

Edited by Black Ibis
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The boats were being operated by S & C as a trial and FMC were acting as Agents not Hirers. There were close links between the 2 companies at this time. The date was October 1943. I am not sure who the Trainees were but they appear to have come from those ladies being trained by GUCCC after Molly Traill had been asked to leave that organisation as a Trainer. Unfortunately Molly did not keep very much of the paperwork that must have gone on over this trail, but it does not appear to have lasted very long as she went off to do other things and turned her back on the canals.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Love the "shed" doors to the cabins. Is that believed to be how they were originally?

I assume it is the case that part of the back of the hold had to be kept stanked off in some way, so that the doors could still be opened when there was a load on?

 

(If these are daft questions, I have never actually seen one of these boats in unmodified form, but am curious how things worked in practice......)

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Love the "shed" doors to the cabins. Is that believed to be how they were originally?

I assume it is the case that part of the back of the hold had to be kept stanked off in some way, so that the doors could still be opened when there was a load on?

 

(If these are daft questions, I have never actually seen one of these boats in unmodified form, but am curious how things worked in practice......)

I suppose that it's for the same reason that butties had splitting doors- for access and ventilation when loaded.

 

Those doors don't look particularly draught proof, if they're not it must have made the bed hole cold.

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  • 3 months later...

Exciting news- have been in contact with Molly Traill's grandson, and he has her scrapbook and notes, and some inspection reports concerning Ash and Willow from their trip as a pair with trainees in 1943.

 

There's also another photo of the same lock, but from the back:

 

4DlcAzo.jpg

 

It's a long shot, but does anyone recognise the trainees?

 

Unfortunately her scrapbook and correspondence don't have as y names. Because she was corresponding with the Ministry of War Transport, I wonder if their archive survives? I suspect it might be at Kew?

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Sadly, another northern volunteer boatwoman died just after Christmas. Nancy Ridgway was captain of the boat MU on the L&LC for just over a year around 1945. There was an article about her in Waterways World in 1988, and a couple of us are putting her reminiscences together for publication. The booklet should be ready for sale at the Easter Working Boat event at Ellesmere Port. Twelve women are known to have done their training on the L&LC, and I have names for nine of them. If anyone has any details, please let us know. Among the boats used were MU, EDITH, WEASEL and VENUS.

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Sadly, another northern volunteer boatwoman died just after Christmas. Nancy Ridgway was captain of the boat MU on the L&LC for just over a year around 1945. There was an article about her in Waterways World in 1988, and a couple of us are putting her reminiscences together for publication. The booklet should be ready for sale at the Easter Working Boat event at Ellesmere Port. Twelve women are known to have done their training on the L&LC, and I have names for nine of them. If anyone has any details, please let us know. Among the boats used were MU, EDITH, WEASEL and VENUS.

Was that Albert Blundell's Edith?

 

Hugh

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I am not sure, but it was a Leeds registered boat purchased by Canal Transport Ltd in 1940. It could have been sold to Blundells early in the 1950s when Canal Transport were rationalising their fleet, and he certainly bought Don, which became Christine, and Pluto at that time, renaming her Denise. It was going to be Denis, but his wife had a daughter.

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Happy New Year (a bit belated!) everyone

 

Just curious as to what happened to Mollie Traill - why did she turn her back on canals?

 

J

There was a disagreement with the Ministry of War Transport - I don't know the details, and she was fired. As a result, the scheme involving Willow and Ash (the photos depict a test run) was not carried through and they boats went back to Gloucester it seems

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My latest blog, including scans of a report written by Molly to the Ministry of War Transport about the boats.

http://severnerwillow.wordpress.com/2014/01/09/willows-history-idle-women-in-the-north-ii/

 

ash-willow-ministry-report-p1.jpg?w=354&

ash-willow-ministry-report-p2.jpg?w=354&

ash-willow-ministry-report-p3.jpg?w=354&

Edited by Black Ibis
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