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cotswoldsman

CRT No Longer Wish To Meet With Boaters

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Firstly I do not agree with a lot of the twoddle which is being aired in this thread,

 

<snip>

 

It is very hard to communicate with a herd of cats, which is why I suspect C&RT have now run away, it was taking a lot of time and effort and the cats would not agree, a thankless task for those on both sides.

 

Isn't the point that CRT haven't actually run anywhere??

If you read the thread you will see it's not all twaddle ~ I read the door is still open...it's just a different door.

Edited by The Dog House

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Watch.

 

There will be people going to law should the same farce be repeated.

They will mire CRT in legal costs which will wholly undermine the purpose. They only need to leave one seat free; two would look less aggressive.

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Firstly I do not agree with a lot of the twoddle which is being aired in this thread, there are an awful lot of axes out, about all sort of different grips, from someone who believes that all the towpath is a walking surface - wrong only the path part is maintained as a walk way, the green bit is grass and may well have holes in it which is why one should have a gang plank. The only part of a canal bank designed to tie up to is a wharf, not very mile of towpath. I'm sorry for the guy who knackered his ankle but be more careful this is the outside world and I for one do not want it to become a linear garden, for continuous moorers. Canals are a mode of transport not a housing estate, which they are becoming in certain places. If we need flaoting housing estates let build them offline somewhere, not have yet more linear moorings.

 

CRT need money, the Government have just given them £10M for towpath improvements mainly for bikes but walkers will benefit as well.9

 

Yesterday on The Ashton Canal which I walked down, between 9am and 3pm, I saw, 3 boats with a family on each, 5 families out walking 2 of which had canal side picnics, which I saw - not bad in urban Manchester, at least 47 bikers, of which a good few, maybe 10 were out and back bit hard to remember those you have seen before, 7 dog walkers, 9 joggers - 3 which were out and back, 5 fishermen. 7 boats moored at Portland basin and several moored in the new basin at Fairfield, didn't walk there to count them. 1 Continuous moorer who is now lurking up the old Isslington Arm.

 

As someone else has said getting boaters to collectively do, something is worse than herding cats, it has always been like this, the canals which have re-openned have not been because of boaters, except in a small minority, but because of activist who have a wide view than boaters, some of these have gone on to become boater owners but still have a wider view of the world. I am one such, as is John Dodwell.

 

It is very hard to communicate with a herd of cats, which is why I suspect C&RT have now run away, it was taking a lot of time and effort and the cats would not agree, a thankless task for those on both sides.

What a load of carp and ill informed rubbish :-)
  • Greenie 4

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the canals which have re-openned have not been because of boaters, except in a small minority, but because of activist who have a wide view than boaters, some of these have gone on to become boater owners but still have a wider view of the world. I am one such, as is John Dodwell.

 

 

I think not.

 

So, canals are restored with locks and filled with water for looking pretty?

Edited by Higgs

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What a load of carp and ill informed rubbish :-)

Your lucky most of the Carp have been fished out down south

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To re-assure those who asked, the Birmingham Floating Market will be going ahead, it is now very much an entity on its own. As for the Friday night social, we think this will still happen as planned by Cotswoldman, I am sure he will keep us advised.

 

Just as an adjunct to this, there may well also be a floating Christmas Market and there will be a summer one too, both at the Birmingham Waterfront.

 

All this the result of an idea originated by Cotswoldman.

 

Mike

RCTA Admin

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I think this is where many seem to miss why John Sloanes meetings were so good. He arranged the venue, paid for it out of his own pocket in some cases, and then asked boaters in a specific area (eg the North) if they would wish to attend a meeting (for northern boaters) in Leeds on such and such a date and time....and that the meeting would only fit x number of attendees. Anyone could then book a seat, and go. John never said he was representing anyone...he was merely facilitating a process whereby normal boaters could talk to CRT. CRT have now told normal boaters to go join an organisation before they'll sit around a table and talk to them.

 

I'm afraid I don't know who John Sloan is and that was one of my points that I was trying to make. John Sloan did not email me nor did he telephone me or write and ask me if I wanted to attend (I am not complaining about that, why should he contact me in those ways ). I do not always read the forums and when I do I generally

only look at the recent posts list rather the view new content. So I may well have missed that invitation. As I have said I am moored in the Selby Boatyard and there at least a half dozen other boaters there, probably more, who also had the right to ask for one of the limited places at those meetings for northern boaters. There are at least three of those boaters who have never even heard of CWDF but might have wanted to go to one of those meetings but were never given the opportunity to make that known. Canal World Discussion Forums is not the centre of the boating world therefore a lot of boaters, I would hazard a guess at the majority, have no idea about the discussions that go on this forum or that this forum even exists and that, to my mind at least, is unfair on some boaters who are paying their way like the rest of us

 

Pete

  • Greenie 1

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I'm afraid I don't know who John Sloan is and that was one of my points that I was trying to make. John Sloan did not email me nor did he telephone me or write and ask me if I wanted to attend (I am not complaining about that, why should he contact me in those ways ). I do not always read the forums and when I do I generally

only look at the recent posts list rather the view new content. So I may well have missed that invitation. As I have said I am moored in the Selby Boatyard and there at least a half dozen other boaters there, probably more, who also had the right to ask for one of the limited places at those meetings for northern boaters. There are at least three of those boaters who have never even heard of CWDF but might have wanted to go to one of those meetings but were never given the opportunity to make that known. Canal World Discussion Forums is not the centre of the boating world therefore a lot of boaters, I would hazard a guess at the majority, have no idea about the discussions that go on this forum or that this forum even exists and that, to my mind at least, is unfair on some boaters who are paying their way like the rest of us

 

Pete

 

I do not think anyone is suggesting that CWDF is the centre of boating but a lot of boaters do use it and an initiative was undertaken because of it. I do not see what is unfair about it. It was attempting to address the unfainess of the lack of boater influence on CaRT. Sally Ash is intimating that it can continue by some re-jigging of its consultations and liaisons about which we are awaiting, etc.

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There are at least three of those boaters who have never even heard of CWDF but might have wanted to go to one of those meetings but were never given the opportunity to make that known. Canal World Discussion Forums is not the centre of the boating world therefore a lot of boaters, I would hazard a guess at the majority, have no idea about the discussions that go on this forum or that this forum even exists and that, to my mind at least, is unfair on some boaters who are paying their way like the rest of us

 

Pete

 

May be these boaters are not curious enough. I presume they partipated in the council elections.

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I'm afraid I don't know who John Sloan is and that was one of my points that I was trying to make. John Sloan did not email me nor did he telephone me or write and ask me if I wanted to attend (I am not complaining about that, why should he contact me in those ways ). I do not always read the forums and when I do I generally

only look at the recent posts list rather the view new content. So I may well have missed that invitation. As I have said I am moored in the Selby Boatyard and there at least a half dozen other boaters there, probably more, who also had the right to ask for one of the limited places at those meetings for northern boaters. There are at least three of those boaters who have never even heard of CWDF but might have wanted to go to one of those meetings but were never given the opportunity to make that known. Canal World Discussion Forums is not the centre of the boating world therefore a lot of boaters, I would hazard a guess at the majority, have no idea about the discussions that go on this forum or that this forum even exists and that, to my mind at least, is unfair on some boaters who are paying their way like the rest of us

 

Pete

Pete,

 

The invitation to the Northern boaters meeting at Skipton was well promoted on here by Cotswoldsman aka John Sloan.

 

He can't be expected to be able to contact and personally invite all boaters on the Northern system, how could he?

 

Like it or not social media like this is how word spreads these days.

 

Ps We are up the Selby next week we will say hello, when we pass.

Edited by The Dog House

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May be these boaters are not curious enough. I presume they partipated in the council elections.

The meetings were advertised in many places, not just on here.

 

Edited to apologise fir the wrong bit quoted...

 

Mike

Edited by Michael Wooding

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It's not quite the same. Atheist's beliefs are partly based on evidence and also the lack of evidence from those of religious conviction.

 

Athiests do not have to "disprove" god. If there is a burden of proof then it rests with those who believe in the existence of something.

I'm not really bothered TBH. Was just being mischievous. I find the whole religious non-religious argument equally boring these days.

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I'm afraid I don't know who John Sloan is and that was one of my points that I was trying to make. John Sloan did not email me nor did he telephone me or write and ask me if I wanted to attend (I am not complaining about that, why should he contact me in those ways ). I do not always read the forums and when I do I generally

only look at the recent posts list rather the view new content. So I may well have missed that invitation. As I have said I am moored in the Selby Boatyard and there at least a half dozen other boaters there, probably more, who also had the right to ask for one of the limited places at those meetings for northern boaters. There are at least three of those boaters who have never even heard of CWDF but might have wanted to go to one of those meetings but were never given the opportunity to make that known. Canal World Discussion Forums is not the centre of the boating world therefore a lot of boaters, I would hazard a guess at the majority, have no idea about the discussions that go on this forum or that this forum even exists and that, to my mind at least, is unfair on some boaters who are paying their way like the rest of us

 

Pete

I don't mean this in a rude way, but it's upto the individual to take an interest in whats going on around him-her. It's no good blaming others for your not being that bothered or having better things to do.

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May be these boaters are not curious enough. I presume they partipated in the council elections.

Oh come on! most boaters didn't even know there were council elections or even cared. It's what I keep saying on and on and on.

I don't mean this in a rude way, but it's upto the individual to take an interest in whats going on around him-her. It's no good blaming others for your not being that bothered or having better things to do.

Another one who hasn't in any way grasped the meaning of my post. I don't think there is a lot of point in me saying anything else on the subject.

Pete,

 

The invitation to the Northern boaters meeting at Skipton was well promoted on here by Cotswoldsman aka John Sloan.

 

He can't be expected to be able to contact and personally invite all boaters on the Northern system, how could he?

 

Like it or not social media like this is how word spreads these days.

 

Ps We are up the Selby next week we will say hello, when we pass.

I wasn't suggesting that and in fact said that in my post it was aretorical (if thats how it's spelt ) my point, again, is that CWDF only represents a very very small number of boaters.

 

 

Okay what day? The canal is way down on water at the moment and very weedy but I will bellow hello as you pass if I am at the boatyard.

 

Pete

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I write/mod for a blog with 7x the readership of CWDF. Based on this information I will be gathering them into an army. Sign-up sheets will be provided, admission open to all, uniforms mandatory... Our first major attack will be running a profitable drive-thru movie theatre marina for narrowboats.

 

In all seriousness I'm really into politics and volunteering - would adore to get in touch with others in the southwest who are interested in coming up with productive ways to address their problems here.

Edited by nailora

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Oh come on! most boaters didn't even know there were council elections or even cared. It's what I keep saying on and on and on.

Another one who hasn't in any way grasped the meaning of my post. I don't think there is a lot of point in me saying anything else on the subject.

I wasn't suggesting that and in fact said that in my post it was aretorical (if thats how it's spelt ) my point, again, is that CWDF only represents a very very small number of boaters.

 

 

Okay what day? The canal is way down on water at the moment and very weedy but I will bellow hello as you pass if I am at the boatyard.

 

Pete

No idea what day Peter we normally just boat with each day as it comes..we draw very little and don't fear the weed hatch.

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I write/mod for a blog with 7x the readership of CWDF. Based on this information I will be gathering them into an army. Sign-up sheets will be provided, admission open to all, uniforms mandatory... Our first major attack will be running a profitable drive-thru movie theatre marina for narrowboats.

 

In all seriousness I'm really into politics and volunteering - would adore to get in touch with others in the southwest who are interested in coming up with productive ways to address their problems here.

Get in touch with Panda Smith at http://kanda.boatingcommunity.org.uk/

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Oh come on! most boaters didn't even know there were council elections or even cared. It's what I keep saying on and on and on.

 

 

Come on, nothin'. You'd have to have been walking around with your eyes and ears shut to have missed the elections. And, if they didn't care, what's the beef?

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Your mind is very muddled. C&RT has a duty to maintain the canals, but it needs income to do so, and boaters' licence fees don't provide enough. So it is entirely proper and correct to remind people of the fact that boaters are in fact receiving a massive subsidy from the Exchequer.

Do CaRT maintain the canal infrastructure for cyclists, are the cyclists paying their way? Do they maintain the canal infrastructure for walkers and are the walkers paying their way? Do CaRT maintain the canal infrastructure at all?

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I think not.

 

So, canals are restored with locks and filled with water for looking pretty?

how little you know, they were restored because it was the cheaper option (see Pluto's bit) and had political gain. Getting boats back on to them was almost a side effect. The economic gains are quite clear, just a few boats bring quiet large financial rewards into the area, as someone pointed out people need to see boat on canals, without them the general public's perceived requirement vanishes. If safe facilities are provided for boaters which attract them, there is then economic push-down, thus the Ashton fails but the Lower Peak forest wins, however you need both for it to work so both were restored. Long live Droylsden Council. A study done early on by Liverpool university proved this.

Ian Mac - former Council Member of the PFCS. without which very little would now be left up north!

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One thing that the economic recession brings home to nearly everyone is the necessity to make the most of what one has.

 

Throwing more money at problems or into services is currently not an option.

 

I do not see a boater's organisation's top priority would be raising money for the waterways. CaRT as a charity has that within its remit. Even then I would not see it as its top priority. In changing to CaRT from BW there should have been a major management overhaul not carrying on with the same old fudge. IMHO CaRT needs to manage its resources better and in that it needs the support of those that use what it is charitably offering.

The remit of CRT is not just to serve the needs of boaters. We can certainly argue that CRT should deliver better value for money (I have made this point frequently in meetings with their staff) and I know for a fact that there are cheaper ways of getting jobs done than by involving CRT and their contractors. Even if we can find cost effective solutions, the fact is that more funds are needed to maintain our waterway network. I agree that there is no point in throwing money or problems, but more funds – used wisely – are certainly needed.

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Oh come on! most boaters didn't even know there were council elections or even cared. It's what I keep saying on and on and on.

Election packs were sent to all boat owners - I spent hours on submitting ours because I care.

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how little you know, they were restored because it was the cheaper option (see Pluto's bit) and had political gain. Getting boats back on to them was almost a side effect. The economic gains are quite clear, just a few boats bring quiet large financial rewards into the area, as someone pointed out people need to see boat on canals, without them the general public's perceived requirement vanishes. If safe facilities are provided for boaters which attract them, there is then economic push-down, thus the Ashton fails but the Lower Peak forest wins, however you need both for it to work so both were restored. Long live Droylsden Council. A study done early on by Liverpool university proved this.

Ian Mac - former Council Member of the PFCS. without which very little would now be left up north!

 

In your paragraph above, it appears the canal and boats go hand in hand.

 

Not a surprise or, a side effect. It's a natural occurrence and people expect to see them on it. Boats are a key element in any plans.

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