Stoke Bruerne Visitor Moorings

[jenlyn]

It's difficult taking anything Jeff whyatt says believing it to be fact.

In February, on three counties radio, he stated the boaters that had moaned on the news item were expecting "something for nothing". In actual fact, every boater on there who had spoken, was either a paid up home moorer, or paid up winter moorer.

Over the past few weeks, his emails to us regarding lack of cutting overgrowth has been blamed on voles. Though secretly, he tells those in his circle that it's down to budget.

Even after CRT admit to having no complaints regarding VM's, Jeff whyatt continues to say they have?

I have no idea how good he was at selling sandwiches for M&S, but it's becoming clear he cannot sell the VM debacle.

[Tuscan]

I still think this is generous. By the time you've removed the winding hole, the disabled mooring and the narrows, I reckon it's more like 1200'.

 

Very useful, Kathryn. I like your reports on how many boats of various lengths can be accommodated. Very often, it's inevitable that unconnected smaller spaces mean that a full length boat can't fit in.

 

Frankly if there's no room at Stoke Bruerne, we just go on a bit.

 

I know it may be heresy to say, but I've never felt SB to be the best place to stop. There's no shop, no chandlery and it's a trek to the nearest station. Admittedly the indian restaurant is pretty good. It seems to be more of a honeypot site for gongoozlers than for boaters.

Don't forget the long pound below the two locks of additional VM's also covered by the rules/charges there is even more space there last time we came through. Agree the boat has become less of a boaters bar now they serve food in the small bar area but the Indian is good but I suspect we will stop at Cosgrove or Weedon now so we don't have to watch the clock.

[madcat]

Reading through the the whole of this thread has plunged me into despair, I simply could not handle the stress of worrying about all this stuff. I need a relaxing holiday not to be persued from 48 hr mooring to 48 hr mooring . Also what the hell do I do if I get too ill to move , I was lucky last time cos Jim from Hawne basin was able to come and get me but I was too ill to do anything for a couple of weeks and Boris insisted I went to the vet.

This is not customer care, this is not the behaviour I would expect from a charity.

The future looks bleak.

To be honest I am trying to talk myself into sellin Halsall and doing something different. I'm off to a re e actors event next weekend to see what that's all about.

The boat, I've been too ill to bother with it since I came off the slipway and I don't feel very motivated to bother now I'm fitter and caught up on all the other stuff. I'm rapidly losing heart.

[jenlyn]

Oh dear

It seems we have a problem.

I know some of you refuse to go to the darkside, so i have copied and pasted for you.

 

"WHY is the South end of the Oxford Canal being neglected? There is an air of general abandonment of the canal South of Banbury, writes Kevin McNiff.Overgrown towpaths barely passable in parts; overhanging trees and bushes obstructing the navigation. The situation has been getting worse year on year despite the Robin Evans 'Veg Pledge' and the annual 'Hedge to Edge' total cut on the towpath.

 

Not carried out

 

In March this year, we boated up to Hillmorton and noticed just how much offside work had been done north of Banbury. If there is a contract still in existence for regular towpath cutting, it isn't being carried out along the entire length from Hawkesbury to Oxford.However, so as not be seen to just grumble(!) and in an effort to assist towpath walkers in general, I took my own action to resolve an overhanging tree at a gate near Aynho. (Attached pictures before and after!)

 

Badly hung

 

Its not just vegetation though. At Somerton Deep lock, the bottom gate is so badly hung that it takes the strength of two people to get it to close! At Drinkwater's Lift Bridge, instructions to unlock the 'safety key' are wrong, and it took someone to stand on the bridge before the lock would release!I have brought the issues to the attention of the local contract manager and engineers. I also emailed Richard Parry to ask him to invite Jeff Whyatt to accompany him on an 'African Queen' cruise between Pigeons and Northbrook locks, then try the Somerton bottom gate for himself. Perhaps this may happen? I hope so."

 

It turns out now, that this whole epic has nothing to do with voles, but in fact comes down to budget.

No money to cut, yet money to waste on a useless unnecessary sevm scheme that has no real value or benefit to anyone. Preventative maintenance seems to come second to daft schemes.

[Leo No2]

Tonight's figures (slightly early because i) It is colder outside and ii) there's something I would like to watch on the box).

 

We have 3 x 70' (these are in the main the moorings above the winding hole - I think you would get 2 x 70' in there), 1 x 60', 4 x 40' and 1 x 30' - there could be a lot more room if the Wyvern Shipping hire boat moored with a bit more consideration but there was no need for him to do so and he's still learning! There are a number of boats that remain after a fair length of time and there's an additional 8" x 8" post so there's going to be information everywhere. Please don't forget this is on the Museum Green to the tunnel mouth - I have not looked at the long pound or lower down but I think it is a good representation.

 

The graph now has a trend line (green and dotted) which is the mathematical calculation on where the information is going based on the data we have - I am quite sure that line will level out over the next few days and may even point downwards a little.

 

Edited to remove graph

Edited August 13, 2013 by Leo No2

[matty40s]

Apparently it took 5 separate crt vehicles to turn up and the teams to put the bollards in

 

meanwhile, 5 months after it sank

 

 

 

is still there on the coventry....with kids kicking the windows in.

[paddy r]

Apparently it took 5 separate crt vehicles to turn up and the teams to put the bollards in

 

meanwhile, 5 months after it sank

 

 

 

is still there on the coventry....with kids kicking the windows in.

CRT reply............Yer but....yer but.......yes but!

[Leo No2]

So the second week of August on a Saturday night enough space for 7 boats!!

I have now read the T&C for Stoke Bruerne and was interested in this piece on the £25 per day charge "This charge reflects our costs of

keeping the visitor moorings available." So in Gloucester Dock they can manage them for £5 per day and in Llangollen for £10 including Electric Hook up!!!

John - as I have yet to licence my boat permanently on a CRT waterway (it's still on the Wey) I thought I'd take a look at the T&Cs for the licence I'll need to purchase from October. One of the bits I noticed (apart from nearly all the obligation being on me and very little on CRT!) was this 'A daily extended stay charge may be payable if you stay beyond the time limit permitted. In some cases we may use our powers under s.8(5) of the British Waterways Act 1983 to move boats that are causing an obstruction. An overstaying boat is causing an obstruction at a mooring since it means that the mooring is not available for other boats to use. If we do need to move the boat, you agree to repay our costs'.

 

I know various people are keen to challenge CRT on their powers but it does seem that they may have a right to charge but it clearly, IMHO, is not a fine. Why it costs more to administer, for example, Stoke Bruerne than it does for Gloucester docks is, I suppose, for CRT to justify at an appropriate time and why I support this forum's communication with CRT.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Leo No2

[LEO]

John - as I have yet to licence my boat permanently on a CRT waterway (it's still on the Wey) I thought I'd take a look at the T&Cs for the licence I'll need to purchase from October. One of the bits I noticed (apart from nearly all the obligation being on me and very little on CRT!) was this 'A daily extended stay charge may be payable if you stay beyond the time limit permitted. In some cases we may use our powers under s.8(5) of the British Waterways Act 1983 to move boats that are causing an obstruction. An overstaying boat is causing an obstruction at a mooring since it means that the mooring is not available for other boats to use. If we do need to move the boat, you agree to repay our costs'.

 

I know various people are keen to challenge CRT on their powers but it does seem that they may have a right to charge but it clearly, IMHO, is not a fine. Why it costs more to administer, for example, Stoke Bruerne than it does for Gloucester docks is, I suppose, for CRT to justify at an appropriate time and why I support this forum's communication with CRT.

 

Hi,

 

How do they control mooring problems on the river Wey? - is it by access limitations (time and charges) or by limiting the number of boat licences issued?.

 

Both seem to be administered by charities, perhaps CaRT can learn from the National Trust in this instance.

 

Leo.

[Leo No2]

 

Hi,

 

How do they control mooring problems on the river Wey? - is it by access limitations (time and charges) or by limiting the number of boat licences issued?.

 

Both seem to be administered by charities, perhaps CaRT can learn from the National Trust in this instance.

 

Leo.

 

They are very tough on who gets a licence - you can only have an annual one if you have a recognised mooring - either a Trust one or in the Marina at Pyrford or at Farncombe. The boaters will complain if someone is taking the 'michael' and the lengthsmen (Trust employees) know their patch and who is on it. A visitor can only obtain a three week licence, at the end of which they must be off the navigation. It's only 19 miles long so it is easy to find anyone not complying and I understand a previous head lengthsman was known to hitch boats to a Trust work boat and tow it to Thames lock - no prisoners taken comes to mind. I think the Wey has a huge advantage over CRT mainly due to the smaller size of their waterway.

 

Just heard that Fountains have started a cutback between Cosgrove and Stoke Bruerne bottom lock so that's a result.

[jenlyn]

 

Just heard that Fountains have started a cutback between Cosgrove and Stoke Bruerne bottom lock so that's a result.

Am not surprised. I think if the emails that have been flying around were published, all hell would break loose. Still, I dont wish to go through "hell" every time something needs doing.

I am meeting jeff whyatt and the contract managers next week on site, so if anyone wishes to attend, or give me some input, feel free to do so.

[cotswoldsman]

Am not surprised. I think if the emails that have been flying around were published, all hell would break loose. Still, I dont wish to go through "hell" every time something needs doing.

I am meeting jeff whyatt and the contract managers next week on site, so if anyone wishes to attend, or give me some input, feel free to do so.

Having read the emails and taken a small part I would suggest you wear a life jacket and hard hat. Well done on your perseverance on this when many a person would have given up

[ChimneyChain]

I think it's also down to people like us to cut back any over hanging branches to keep a navigation clear. We all need to step up and do our bit, me thinks.

 

Darren

[jenlyn]

I think it's also down to people like us to cut back any over hanging branches to keep a navigation clear. We all need to step up and do our bit, me thinks.

Darren

Fair point, but this was a bit more than a few overhanging branches. Some of it is at water level and 3-4 metres across the canal.

The other point is, CRT cannot take it for granted that there is a volunteer for everything. There is only so much they should expect from volunteers. It would not be good to entrust reliabity to such an extent.

[Leo No2]

Snip

Badly hung

Its not just vegetation though. At Somerton Deep lock, the bottom gate is so badly hung that it takes the strength of two people to get it to close! At Drinkwater's Lift Bridge, instructions to unlock the 'safety key' are wrong, and it took someone to stand on the bridge before the lock would release!I have brought the issues to the attention of the local contract manager and engineers. I also emailed Richard Parry to ask him to invite Jeff Whyatt to accompany him on an 'African Queen' cruise between Pigeons and Northbrook locks, then try the Somerton bottom gate for himself. Perhaps this may happen? I hope so."

Somerton Deep - new lower gate (it's very heavy IIRC - over 3t) it's being replaced between 4-Nov13 and 15-Nov-13. See http://waterscape.com/media/documents/25006.pdf - it doesn't say it's the bottom gate but I understand it is - it must be a unique gate on the network.

 

ETA Bit more on Somerton Deep closure/stoppage http://www.waterscape.com/things-to-do/boating/proposed-stoppage/7966/somerton-deep-lock-34

Edited August 14, 2013 by Leo No2

[cotswoldsman]

I think it's also down to people like us to cut back any over hanging branches to keep a navigation clear. We all need to step up and do our bit, me thinks.

 

Darren

When this was suggested at our Birmingham meeting it was poo-pood on the basis of H&S (maybe understandable) but also on the basis that it is not a great idea just to allow boaters to hack down trees/branches on the basis that one single boater happens to think it should not be there (understandable)

[RLWP]

it must be a unique gate on the network.

 

I suspect every gate is unique

 

Richard

[Jerra]

When this was suggested at our Birmingham meeting it was poo-pood on the basis of H&S (maybe understandable) but also on the basis that it is not a great idea just to allow boaters to hack down trees/branches on the basis that one single boater happens to think it should not be there (understandable)

I would suspect that boaters hacking down branches was also of doubtful legality.

[ChimneyChain]

Fair point, but this was a bit more than a few overhanging branches. Some of it is at water level and 3-4 metres across the canal.

The other point is, CRT cannot take it for granted that there is a volunteer for everything. There is only so much they should expect from volunteers. It would not be good to entrust reliabity to such an extent.

Totally agree Steve, but hopefully if every one does a little bit it would improve the situation,

 

Darren

[LEO]

 

They are very tough on who gets a licence - you can only have an annual one if you have a recognised mooring - either a Trust one or in the Marina at Pyrford or at Farncombe. The boaters will complain if someone is taking the 'michael' and the lengthsmen (Trust employees) know their patch and who is on it. A visitor can only obtain a three week licence, at the end of which they must be off the navigation. It's only 19 miles long so it is easy to find anyone not complying and I understand a previous head lengthsman was known to hitch boats to a Trust work boat and tow it to Thames lock - no prisoners taken comes to mind. I think the Wey has a huge advantage over CRT mainly due to the smaller size of their waterway.

 

Just heard that Fountains have started a cutback between Cosgrove and Stoke Bruerne bottom lock so that's a result.

 

Thanks for the information

 

Yep, CaRT could learn a lot from the National Trust, but as soon as they try to introduce measures to improve the canals they administer all hell breaks loose.

 

L

[MtB]

 

I suspect every gate is unique

 

Richard

 

Maybe this one is more unique than the others....

 

I find three tons hard to believe for a wooden gate, even a high one.

 

 

MtB

[Leo No2]

Quite busy tonight just space for:

 

1 x 70, 2 x 60 and 1 x 40 - there's always more to it than just the numbers. There's some boats have been here a while - locked up and the owners seemed to have gone away - may well have permission from CRT but they don't seem to move (they'll be gone tomorrow of course!). A bit more considerate mooring would have given a wee bit more space.

 

 

 

 

I suspect every gate is unique

 

Richard

 

Richard I understand your view - just that there are not many as heavy and 'tall' (whatever their weight) is what I was attempting to convey!

 

Edited - removed graph

Edited August 14, 2013 by Leo No2

[AndrewIC]

The Llangollen moorings are £6/nt including electric (and water taps on each bollard).

And in Liverpool they can manage to provide 14 days on pontoons with water taps for nothing at all, and provide bridge keepers and lockies to help get you in and out!

[Ryeland]

As we came up the flight today, at about 17.00 there were two boats in the long pound, and we moored with another boat at the top within about 150 yds of the museum. At the bottom at about 15.00 all the 14 day mooring was full, the 48hr was empty.

 

Richard

 

For about 2 miles south of SB the nearside vegetation has indeed been well cut back, but the offside remains well overgrown in places.

Edited August 13, 2013 by Ryeland

[alan_fincher]

 

Maybe this one is more unique than the others....

 

I find three tons hard to believe for a wooden gate, even a high one.

 

 

MtB

Three tons is not at all unusual for a bottom gate of a eep lock, whether it be one of a pair for a wide lock, or a single gate for a narrow lock, as at Somerton.

 

Many have their weights engraved into them and numbers about (or above) 3,000 KG are by no means unusual.