identifying my engine and fixing it

[Trix]

Once again i have a problem with the water system on my engine a core plug behind the diesel pump has started leaking , it looks like im going to have to remove the pump to get to it so i think a manual will have to be found , problem is i have to identify the engine its a ford that much i know so im guessing escort / transit , i think my plan is to go into a marina for two weeks and have a go at it, ill change the cam belt at the same time, at least i will have access to power and a shower whilst the engine is stripped down . Any one out there worked on ford diesels can tell me if ill need any special tools as I dont want to get held up by something as time will be crucial due to the mooring only being available for two weeks . Will timing the pump and bleeding it be an issue ? ill try and get a few pictures to add in case anyone recognizes it . It was installed by thornycroft and the boat was built in 1991 . I am going to have to nurse it through the next 6 days which requires watching the temperature and keeping the water topped up as it seems to get an air lock after running for about an hour im assuming this is all down to the core plug but i may change the stat as well just to be on the safe side ..

 

any tips greatly received

 

 

[BargeeSpud]

This link might help you find the identity of your engine from it's identifying number/plate & where you might find it.

[Tony Brooks]

I would stick a bottle of Radweld or Barrsleaks in it for the time being and that may effect a temporary seal on the coreplug. I would not be giving this advice if you had a heater matrix or radiator to consider.

 

I will hold back on the timing until we know what engine you have but if it is one of the Ford cam belt diesels then there is usually a timing kit needed. This includes a DTI and holder to screw into the back of the injector pump. There is a slim chance that you might get away with locking the engine before taking the pump off as long as the pump shaft does not turn, and it might if it had stopped with the follower roller on a cam. I think you may also need a special "bolt" to free the pump drive from its taper.

 

Once the engine is identified other will know more and confirm or not.

[Semitrad]

Do many marinas welcome major DIY engine work? It is my understanding that most restrict repairs to their own or "approved" engineers.

[Guest]

I would stick a bottle of Radweld or Barrsleaks in it for the time being and that may effect a temporary seal on the coreplug. I would not be giving this advice if you had a heater matrix or radiator to consider.

 

I will hold back on the timing until we know what engine you have but if it is one of the Ford cam belt diesels then there is usually a timing kit needed. This includes a DTI and holder to screw into the back of the injector pump. There is a slim chance that you might get away with locking the engine before taking the pump off as long as the pump shaft does not turn, and it might if it had stopped with the follower roller on a cam. I think you may also need a special "bolt" to free the pump drive from its taper.

 

Once the engine is identified other will know more and confirm or not.

Is that the only worry with Radweld, ie heater matrixes/radiators? Reason I ask is my engine has an annoying coolant drip and I have been tempted to try radweld. Something keeps putting me of the idea though.

[bizzard]

You most likely have and XLD 1.6 OR 1.8. I could go into detail of how to change the belt but I'm not it would take too long. To be safe I'd suggest you did it like this which would apply to virtually any engine with a timing belt. There are one or two special tools needed, Torx drive bits for example (essential) cambelt wheels locking devices (not essential) Procure a new CORRECT belt. Remove guards and anything else that's in the way including crankshaft fanbelt drive pulley. Now stop there. Whittle up little wooden wedges and tap them carefully in tight behind both the camshaft and injector pumps drive wheels to jamb them and stop them moving, the camshaft will especially try to jump off a cam.

Now get some paint and a wee brush to mark the position of the old timing belt by painting a paint stroke firstly on the belts facing edge where it passes over the camshaft wheel continuing this brush stroke onto the cam-wheel face to mark it. Do exactly the same with the injector pumps toothed drive wheel and the crank shafts toothed drive. If you paint a C or a T on the top of the belt at the camshaft it'll avoid faffing about trying to locate which marks are which when you fit the new belt. Let the paint dry.

Remove old belt by releasing or removing any belt tensioners. Make sure the new belt is the correct one (count the teeth). Place new belt over old and transfer by copying ''precisely'' all the paint marks from the old belt to the new. When done compare, check and double check these marks!!! any difference could destroy your engine. let the paint dry.it

Fit the new belt in the reverse order carefully aligning all the marks, actuate tensioner and re check all the marks. Pull out wedges, fit crank shaft pulley and turn the engine in its running direction by hand with a spanner on the crankshaft pulley bolt to make sure that nothing clashes and hits, like valves and pistons. Reassemble all the rest and start engine. EMPHASIS is on the new belt going on in exactly the same positions relating to the drive wheels as the old belt. One tooth out between crankshaft and camshaft and it'll run rough, two or three teeth out and your engine could be severely damaged.

There are of course cambelt fitting diagrams for all engines, but even if you have one I'd also do as I've explained if you've never changed a cambelt before to be absolutely certain that its on correct.

Its quite difficult trying to explain things like this in simple terms.

[Tony Brooks]

Unless you are inconveniencing other boaters I would suggest that any who try to prevent DIY repairs on/in the boat would be on very dodgy legal ground. I can see why they would want to restrict access by other "paid for" (I was going to say professional) help though. They would have to ensure their insurance is adequate and indemnify the marina against damage etc.

 

My present marina has never tried to stop me doing DIY work and sometimes an staff member working on a nearby boat will stop for a bit of mutual joshing engineer wise. The previous one would not allow DIY painting which is fair enough because the opportunity to splatter adjacent boats is too great.

 

I have never been refuse access to carry out maintenance training on boat and once it was in a very upmarket Solent marina.

 

Catweasel. Such products seem to mainly coagulate in the presence of air and even though they might form "lumps" or filaments in the coolant they would, in my view, be very unlikely to block the coolant pipes or skin tank. I suppose they might block a gearbox oil cooler or heat exchanger but I would very much doubt it. The MOD certainly used to issue Barsseal for vehicle use and I doubt they would if it caused significant problems. I would never consider it a permeate repair but in Trix's case it might save the trip, especially as I would not like to advise a DIY attempt to re-time the Ford diesel i think it might be.

Agreed Bizzard for cam belt changing but Trix has asked about removing the injector pump and I think the XLDs have the pump on a non-keyed taper so the pump also needs setting in the correct position. This is why it needs the adaptor and DTI. happy to be proved wrong through.

[bizzard]

Unless you are inconveniencing other boaters I would suggest that any who try to prevent DIY repairs on/in the boat would be on very dodgy legal ground. I can see why they would want to restrict access by other "paid for" (I was going to say professional) help though. They would have to ensure their insurance is adequate and indemnify the marina against damage etc.

 

My present marina has never tried to stop me doing DIY work and sometimes an staff member working on a nearby boat will stop for a bit of mutual joshing engineer wise. The previous one would not allow DIY painting which is fair enough because the opportunity to splatter adjacent boats is too great.

 

I have never been refuse access to carry out maintenance training on boat and once it was in a very upmarket Solent marina.

 

Catweasel. Such products seem to mainly coagulate in the presence of air and even though they might form "lumps" or filaments in the coolant they would, in my view, be very unlikely to block the coolant pipes or skin tank. I suppose they might block a gearbox oil cooler or heat exchanger but I would very much doubt it. The MOD certainly used to issue Barsseal for vehicle use and I doubt they would if it caused significant problems. I would never consider it a permeate repair but in Trix's case it might save the trip, especially as I would not like to advise a DIY attempt to re-time the Ford diesel i think it might be.

Agreed Bizzard for cam belt changing but Trix has asked about removing the injector pump and I think the XLDs have the pump on a non-keyed taper so the pump also needs setting in the correct position. This is why it needs the adaptor and DTI. happy to be proved wrong through.

Ah right very likely, I can't remember. A lot of diesel camshaft belt wheels are on a plain taper too. I can't remember the core plug but almost certainly would be the flanged type. But if there's only an inch of clearance to work in between pump and engine block its often possible to renew the plug with the aid of various curved and bent implements ( small jemmy) hammer ect and maybe a mirror and by levering the new plug in with a stout flat bar. Very tedious but it can usually be done.

[springy]

Don't know whether any access to the core plug is possible - I once "temporarily" sealed a leaking core

plug (rusted through in the centre of the plug) by filling it with silicone RTV - lasted ok for qute a few

weeks before I changed it (it still wasnt leaking but having bought a new one I thought i'd better fit

it).

 

 

springy

[nb Innisfree]

I once replaced the timing belt on our Peugeot and a few days later I was driving along when a strange uncomfortable feeling came over me, don't ask me why but I decided to stop the car and engine and look under the bonnet, imagine my surprise, and relief, when I noticed that the crankshaft timing pulley bolt was about to come away and the pulley had slid to the very edge of the crank!

 

Spooky.

[Trix]

 

 

 

 

 

thanks for the advise so far , im not too worried about doing the cam belt as i have done many on Ducati motorcycles but diesels and diesel pumps are a bit foreign to me the idea of some how getting the plug in without removing the pump really appeals but i just dont think there is enough room , we have something called k seal at work so may give that a go as a temp repair , but it is quite a bad leak so i think it will need doing properly very soon . It keeps getting hot now as well so i really have to watch it . The engine has 84fm stamped on lots of the parts ive googled this hoping it may give away its origin but no luck

Edited July 15, 2013 by Trix

[BargeeSpud]

Don't be surprised if the venerable Tony Brooks can identify your engine exactly, from those pics. Nice one.

[bizzard]

It is a Ford XLD but I'm not certain whether its 1.6 or 1.8.

[Tony Brooks]

And I think the pump is a Rotadiesel one, not the Bosch that I am more familiar with, but timing it would be the same.

 

Trix - I really would not advise you to try removing and replacing the pump but do consider what Bizzard said about bent levers and things. Otherwise talk to Primrose engineering or any other person you have recommended by several people.

[bizzard]

If you can get your hand down there to bung it with filler I'd say you could renew it with patience, by removing the fuel pipework, throttle link ect out of the way first though

I don't suppose you mean one of the easy to get to core plugs above the pump on the cylinder head?

If you can get your hand down there to bung it with filler I'd say you could renew it with patience, by removing the fuel pipework, throttle link ect out of the way first though

I don't suppose you mean one of the easy to get to core plugs above the pump on the cylinder head?

If one plug has corroded through usually others are not far behind rusting through as well, others on the same level at any rate.

[Trix]

If you can get your hand down there to bung it with filler I'd say you could renew it with patience, by removing the fuel pipework, throttle link ect out of the way first though

 

 

I don't suppose you mean one of the easy to get to core plugs above the pump on the cylinder head?

 

If one plug has corroded through usually others are not far behind rusting through as well, others on the same level at any rate.

No of course it is the one directly behind the pump about 1 inch of room there I guess I will look to see if I can create more room by removing pipes etc if not it will have to come out , good news is now I know what it is I can get a manual and have a read cheers for replies , I'll let you know how it goes