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alan_fincher

Historic Boats for sale online

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1 hour ago, Tiggers said:

It is a boat built by Stuart Hooper many moons ago but now owned by his children Alan and Julie. Alan has been doing some remedial work on her but I believe he is hoping to get her back in soon

One of 3 (or perhaps 4) built in the north west some years ago by their (then) respective owners from plans.

Ellis Dee, Etherow and Tetrad.  Detail differences but all are nice looking boats.

George ex nb Alton retired

 

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2 hours ago, billybobbooth said:

You wouldnt want mine then when in dock from tip of bow to very back of counter (not including the rudder) im at 72 feet and 1 & 1/4 inch. I was hoping it was a miss print when we get her but its not :-(

Think ill try the welsh cut

I thought most canals London through to Llangollen were 72ft max, I guess the charge hands boot size varied and therefore you gain your inch and a quarter! 

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8 hours ago, Mendip-Locks said:

I thought most canals London through to Llangollen were 72ft max, I guess the charge hands boot size varied and therefore you gain your inch and a quarter! 

The 72ft lock size is very "nominal" as indeed is the quoted length of some  boats.  Even the factory produced Grand Union boats can vary considerably in length.

George ex nb Alton retired

 

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8 hours ago, Mendip-Locks said:

I thought most canals London through to Llangollen were 72ft max, I guess the charge hands boot size varied and therefore you gain your inch and a quarter! 

 

I don't have immediate access to it, but a document published by BW some years ago conceded that all G U locks up to Birmingham could actually take around 75 feet.  (I seem to remember the ones from Wigrams up to Brum perhaps being even more, but might be wrong.

I think the wide boat "Progress" was/is something like 75 feet?  Certainly a lot more than a standard carrying narrow boat.

9 minutes ago, furnessvale said:

The 72ft lock size is very "nominal" as indeed is the quoted length of some  boats.  Even the factory produced Grand Union boats can vary considerably in length.

The gauge sheets for our "Grand Union" "Flamingo" (formerly "Letchworth"), show a length of 71' 8", 2" more than the stated design length.  I must admit I have not tried checking it!

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2 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

 

I don't have immediate access to it, but a document published by BW some years ago conceded that all G U locks up to Birmingham could actually take around 75 feet.  (I seem to remember the ones from Wigrams up to Brum perhaps being even more, but might be wrong.

I think the wide boat "Progress" was/is something like 75 feet?  Certainly a lot more than a standard carrying narrow boat.

PROGRESS was gauged as 75'0'' x 12'1½''.

Clearly TOWY has grown considerably over the years / rebuilds as it was B.C.N. gauged as 71'1'' x 7'1¼'' when new :captain:

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40 minutes ago, pete harrison said:

PROGRESS was gauged as 75'0'' x 12'1½''.

Clearly TOWY has grown considerably over the years / rebuilds as it was B.C.N. gauged as 71'1'' x 7'1¼'' when new :captain:

Where did the BCN company gauge the length? At the waterline, or at the furthest forwards part of the stem?

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8 minutes ago, FadeToScarlet said:

Where did the BCN company gauge the length? At the waterline, or at the furthest forwards part of the stem?

I have no idea.

In my opinion the length and beam are an irrelevance when gauging, and I do not think they measured these all that accurately. The only dimensions that do matter when gauging are the dry (or wet dependant on the Canal Company and historical period) side per ton added, and they captured this measurement in 100th's of an inch :captain:

Edited by pete harrison

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I have no idea on width as ive never measured this its was registerd as 72 with bw by last owners but what supprised me was dane when owned by claytons was too long at 72 feet to get up one of the locks and the bow was chopped but funny all the other boats that were from sccc and even uxbridge at 72 were fine! But anyways i guess you can loose or gain an inch when bows or counter blocks are changed.

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5 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

I don't have immediate access to it, but a document published by BW some years ago conceded that all G U locks up to Birmingham could actually take around 75 feet.  (I seem to remember the ones from Wigrams up to Brum perhaps being even more, but might be wrong.

I have now found the BW document I made reference to in this post......

Extracted info, which is at least consistent with Progress claimed 75 foot length.

(Good luck though with following any instructions to "consult local waterways office" and asking "can I really navigate a 78 foot narrowboat from Braunston to Camp Hill!.....)

GRANDUNIONCANAL

Brentford Basin to Berkhamsted (lock 54)

 

Maximum dimension

Absolute maximum*

Length:

72ft (21.95m)

76ft (23.16m)

Beam:

14ft (4.27m)

14ft 3ins (4.34m)

Draught:

N/A

N/A

Headroom:

8ft 2ins (2.49m)

N/A

*Consult local waterway office

 

Berkhamsted (above lock 54) – Braunston

 

Maximum dimension

Absolute maximum*

Length:

72ft (21.95m)

76ft (23.16m)

Beam:

12ft 6ins (3.81m)

13ft 8ins (4.16m)

Draught:

N/A

N/A

Headroom:

7ft 10ins (2.38m)

 

*Consult local waterway office

 

GRAND UNIONCANAL

 

Braunston to head of Camp Hill Top Lock

 

 

Maximum dimension

Absolute maximum*

Length:

72ft (21.95m)

78ft (23.77m)

Beam:

12ft 6ins (3.81m)

N/A

Draught:

N/A

N/A

Headroom:

6ft 6ins (1.98m)

N/A

*Consult local waterway office

 

Additional Cruising notes:

1.      Boats up to 14ft (4.27m) beam may be able to navigate this section, but some bridges have low arches and may not be passable, depending on cabin profile.

2.      Locks are more than 14ft (4.27m) wide so two narrowboats can safely share.

  • Greenie 1

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27 minutes ago, billybobbooth said:

I have no idea on width as ive never measured this its was registerd as 72 with bw by last owners but what supprised me was dane when owned by claytons was too long at 72 feet to get up one of the locks and the bow was chopped but funny all the other boats that were from sccc and even uxbridge at 72 were fine! But anyways i guess you can loose or gain an inch when bows or counter blocks are changed.

The "Crow" is tight for GUCCC boats which are nominally 71' 6" long.

I went up and down the Crow last year with Badger, which is nominally 71ft long, without trouble.

George ex nb Alton retired

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5 hours ago, alan_fincher said:

 

I don't have immediate access to it, but a document published by BW some years ago conceded that all G U locks up to Birmingham could actually take around 75 feet.  (I seem to remember the ones from Wigrams up to Brum perhaps being even more, but might be wrong.

I think the wide boat "Progress" was/is something like 75 feet?  Certainly a lot more than a standard carrying narrow boat.

You may well be correct Alan. Back in the 1960's i was considering buying and motorising an unpowered working boat, and looked at an old Joey at the Elements yard at Gravelly Hill. It seemed a bit long so I asked how long it ws, from recollection the answer was 75ft. Needless to say that was the end of the discussion.

Edited by David Schweizer

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6 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

You may well be correct Alan. Back in the 1960's i was considering buying and motorising an unpowered working boat, and looked at an old Joey at the Elements yard at Gravelly Hill. It seemed a bit long so I asked how long it ws, from recollection the answer was 75ft. Needless to say that was the end of the discussion.

But I can not imagine any Element's boat being at Salford Bridge / Gravelly Hill being longer than 72' as it simply would not have been able to get there via the local narrow locks :captain:

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21 hours ago, Tiggers said:

It is a boat built by Stuart Hooper many moons ago but now owned by his children Alan and Julie. Alan has been doing some remedial work on her but I believe he is hoping to get her back in soon

Good Ol Ellis, i helped Hoops (Alan) lift her out at Bollington and strip her ready for work..

Edited by Johnboy770

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On 03/03/2017 at 22:40, Marge the Barge said:

Won't be until after the Historic boat gathering at Alvecote (August Bank Holiday) as we are having some refit work done, Sarah is aiming for finishing the week before. If there is plenty of water in the Oxford Canal we will be coming down that way, so will stop at T n K overnight (find something to moor alongside).........

Not much room in T & K these days, very full, but I’m shure Lee can find somewhere. We will/hope to be going out beginning of April so will miss you.  

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21 hours ago, pete harrison said:

But I can not imagine any Element's boat being at Salford Bridge / Gravelly Hill being longer than 72' as it simply would not have been able to get there via the local narrow locks :captain:

It was definitely at the Saltford Yard, which seemed almost derelect, with just a few old boats tied up and an old lorry parked outside the "office". I can still remember it taking ages to negotiate the motorway junctions to find the yard entrance, which from recollection was between the motorway and a private house. The man I was talking to certainly didn't seem to know much about boats, so It is always possible that did not know the exact length of the boat and made it up, and I did not have a tape measure long enough to confirm the length.

In retrospect, it was probably a blessing, wooden boats do seem rather costly to maintain.

Edited by David Schweizer

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On 05/03/2017 at 14:30, furnessvale said:

The "Crow" is tight for GUCCC boats which are nominally 71' 6" long.

I went up and down the Crow last year with Badger, which is nominally 71ft long, without trouble.

George ex nb Alton retired

We shall see how well a 72' (or 71'9" gauged length) boat copes on the BCN challenge this year!

 

I have a photo of Willow going up, will have to see if we can get back down again forwards or backwards.

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7 minutes ago, FadeToScarlet said:

We shall see how well a 72' (or 71'9" gauged length) boat copes on the BCN challenge this year!

 

I have a photo of Willow going up, will have to see if we can get back down again forwards or backwards.

I think I was all fenders up.

What goes up must come down............but it may well be backwards!  :)

Good luck!

George ex nb Alton retired

 

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I find Smethwick Three tight in Scorpio, not tried the Crow with Scorpio. Going downhill with the single gates is the problem, usually end up with rudder hard against the cill, all fenders up and pushing the bows hard over to the lock wall which gives just enough clearance to get the bottom gate open.

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1 hour ago, Rob-M said:

I find Smethwick Three tight in Scorpio, not tried the Crow with Scorpio. Going downhill with the single gates is the problem, usually end up with rudder hard against the cill, all fenders up and pushing the bows hard over to the lock wall which gives just enough clearance to get the bottom gate open.

Bottom Smethwick is the tightest lock I have ever gone down with Alton and still managed to get out.

It was all fenders up with a jemmy easing the bottom gate around the bows.  I swear, if it had been a hotter day, Alton would have been longer and I would have had to reverse up! :)

George ex nb Alton retired

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Not tried Smethwick yet. Will be able to do a comprehensive report after the BCN challenge!

Minworth and Curdworth I found tighter than some BCN locks, Farmer's Bridge was OK going down and coming up with one tipcat and no bow fender, but it was all fenders off for a few.

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23 minutes ago, FadeToScarlet said:

Not tried Smethwick yet. Will be able to do a comprehensive report after the BCN challenge!

Minworth and Curdworth I found tighter than some BCN locks, Farmer's Bridge was OK going down and coming up with one tipcat and no bow fender, but it was all fenders off for a few.

B & F is snug. Cassiopaeia is a bit long and Mick struggled down there the other year.

George ex nb Alton retired

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2 hours ago, FadeToScarlet said:

We shall see how well a 72' (or 71'9" gauged length) boat copes on the BCN challenge this year!

 

I have a photo of Willow going up, will have to see if we can get back down again forwards or backwards.

We had to come down backwards with Yeoford.

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Like  Rob -M said  Smethwick  is a tight fit came  down  with  Scorpio  on a Skiper  Training  Day  two  weeks  a go fun when  you have a blade full yards of material removed.

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First time went into smethwick with thaxted there were glue heads dancing around the place. Wishing to get through fast we were thwarted by the need to remove all fenders bow and stern and hold the tiller over. Nearly went the other way. It's the little things you remember...

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We found Brades were rather short and needed all fenders up with Auriga many years ago. We also stuck trying to get out of Camp Hill top lock we eventually got out with the help of BW a tirfor and every body rocking the boat!

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