Shot Gun On NB

[RLWP]

Quite an interesting concept. Take a cartridge and remove the bullet, replace with a solid ice bullet and kill your victim with it.

The ice bullet melts leaving no trace ie no rifling. Must suggest this to my boss for his next crime film.

 

Doesn't work:

 

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode1

 

Richard

 

MORE also:

 

The density of lead is 11.34 times that of water. Ice is roughly 90% the density of water, so lead is roughly 12.6 times the density of ice.

 

To get the same kinetic energy (Ek = 1/2 * m * v^2), you need to increase the velocity by the root of 12.6, in order to compensate for the reduced mass. This is a factor of 3.55 - the ice bullet must travel 3.55 times as fast as a lead bullet of the same size, to have the same kinetic energy.

 

from Snopes

Edited December 12, 2012 by RLWP

[Iain_S]

The density of lead is 11.34 times that of water. Ice is roughly 90% the density of water, so lead is roughly 12.6 times the density of ice.

 

To get the same kinetic energy (Ek = 1/2 * m * v^2), you need to increase the velocity by the root of 12.6, in order to compensate for the reduced mass. This is a factor of 3.55 - the ice bullet must travel 3.55 times as fast as a lead bullet of the same size, to have the same kinetic energy.

 

BUT,by conservation of momentum, the ice bullet WILL have a lot more velocity than the lead bullet, leading to a vastly increased energy transfer to the bullet, rather than the recoil. Not as much as 12 times, as the force exerted by the propellent will be reduced by the more rapid increase in volume between cartridge and the back of the bullet, if you see what I mean. (Need a faster burn, and longer barrel!)

 

Iain

[JDR]

but: ISTR a short story where an abused wife battered her husband to death with a frozen leg of lamb, left the house for a bit, came home and "discovered" the body and subsequently presented the now defrosted meat to the investigating officer.

 

Note, don't try this with the Christmas turkey unless you do weights.

 

Lamb to the Slaughter by Roald Dahl. His short stories were surprisingly dark for someone famous as a writer of fiction for children.

[Laurie Booth]

Doesn't work:

 

http://mythbustersresults.com/episode1

 

Richard

 

 

There goes another Oscar winning script.

[RLWP]

There goes another Oscar winning script.

 

I stopped googling when I found that. I was going to look for a film that had used the plot already

 

Richard

 

MORE: Most Wanted, 1997

Edited December 12, 2012 by RLWP

[Chris Pink]

When I'm on our shared ownership narrowboat I always take along my air pistol, more as a deterrent in case any lowlife takes an unhealthy interest in us or worse still tries to get onboard. Thankfully we've never so far come across anything more than a few kids chucking things at us, but I've got it just in case.

 

Some say why not just aim your phone camera in their direction which I'm sure can be enough sometimes and would be my preferred action obviously, but having the pistol as back up makes me feel safer just in case, and would of course using it would be a last resort.

 

That is so wrong.

 

Not only are you likely to get hauled off your boat on all sorts of charges you stand the chance of firing a pissy little weapon at someone who might have or knows someone who might have the real thing, or a load of mates, who will come and find your boat in the middle of nowhere and give you their opinion.

 

And if you succeed, and hit someone, how will you enjoy being in prison for assault or GBH? (with their mates).

 

I might be wrong, but I believe even your post on this forum is illegal.

 

 

 

 

..

 

Lamb to the Slaughter by Roald Dahl. His short stories were surprisingly dark for someone famous as a writer of fiction for children.

 

isn't that "His children's stories were surprisingly dark" ?

Edited December 12, 2012 by Chris Pink

[Guest]

I missed comfortably numb's post until it was quoted but man you seriously need a re-think. Having an interest in air weapons myself (for target shooting not shooting gongoozlers) I've been looking at the laws around them - they are effectively treated as fire-arms and playing fast and loose with one can land you in a shed load of bother -

 

 

 

Offence Penalties

The Penalties for breaking current UK firearms laws with Airguns are as follows:-

Carrying a loaded Air-weapon in a public place 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.

Trespassing with an air weapon 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.

Trespassing on private land with an air weapon 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.

Possessing or using an air weapon if sentenced to 3 months or more in custody 3 months imprisonment and / or £2,500 fine.

In addition if original sentence up to 3 years 5 year ban on use of firearms.

Or if for 3 years or more Life ban on use of firearms.

Killing or injuring any bird or protected animal unless authorised £5,000 fine.

Firing an air weapon within 15m / 50ft of a public highway £1,000 fine.

Selling or hiring air weapon or ammunition to person under 17 6 months imprisonment and / or £5,000 fine.

Making a gift of air weapon or ammunition to person under 14 £1,000 fine.

Having air weapon or ammunition with intent to damage property 10 years imprisonment.

Having air weapon with intent to endanger life Life imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.

Using air weapon to resist or prevent arrest Life imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.

Threatening others with an air weapon (even if unloaded) to cause them to fear unlawful violence 10 years imprisonment and / or appropriate fine.

Not forgetting the chance of being shot and killed by the police should you not obey instructions when challenged by them, they cannot tell if you have just an airgun or a more lethal firearm so will treat all arms as lethal and respond accordingly.

[haggis]

That is so wrong.

 

Not only are you likely to get hauled off your boat on all sorts of charges you stand the chance of firing a pissy little weapon at someone who might have or knows someone who might have the real thing, or a load of mates, who will come and find your boat in the middle of nowhere and give you their opinion.

 

And if you succeed, and hit someone, how will you enjoy being in prison for assault or GBH? (with their mates).

 

I might be wrong, but I believe even your post on this forum is illegal.

 

 

And as it is a shared boat, it might be other owners on board when the mates come looking.

 

haggis

[FrigateCaptain]

When I'm on our shared ownership narrowboat I always take along my air pistol, more as a deterrent in case any lowlife takes an unhealthy interest in us or worse still tries to get onboard. Thankfully we've never so far come across anything more than a few kids chucking things at us, but I've got it just in case.

 

Some say why not just aim your phone camera in their direction which I'm sure can be enough sometimes and would be my preferred action obviously, but having the pistol as back up makes me feel safer just in case, and would of course using it would be a last resort.

 

Sorry this is totally irresponsible. It's people who carry air weapons as side arms who ruin it for the rest of us who shoot.

Not only that, the legal limit for a air pistol is 6 fb, all your going to do is Piss them off if you hit them

[Theo]

but: ISTR a short story where an abused wife battered her husband to death with a frozen leg of lamb, left the house for a bit, came home and "discovered" the body and subsequently presented the now defrosted meat to the investigating officer.

 

Note, don't try this with the Christmas turkey unless you do weights.

 

I remember that. It was read on Radio 4 years (36?) ago.

 

Google...

 

Ah. here it is:

 

Link

 

This classic Emmy-nominated episode stars Barbara Bel Geddes as Mary Maloney, the wife of philandering police chief Patrick Maloney (played by former cowboy star Allan Lane, best known to TV fans as the voice of Mister Ed). When Patrick comes home to tell his wife that he is leaving her for another woman, the outraged Mary clubs her husband to death with a frozen leg of lamb. She then calls the police to announce that she has come home to find her husband dead, with no murder weapon in sight. Eventually the cops arrive to comb the Maloney apartment for evidence -- little realizing that the solution to the crime is literally under their noses. Arguably the most famous Alfred Hitchcock Presents episode of all, "Lamb to the Slaughter" is one of those rare murder yarns which can be enjoyed repeatedly even after the viewer knows the outcome.

 

 

 

[David Mack]

There goes another Oscar winning script.

 

When did scientific truth ever get in the way of a good (or bad) film script?

[Arthur Brown]

When did scientific truth ever get in the way of a good (or bad) film script?

 

Remember that most crime dramas and investigation dramas (CSI NCIS etc) are all solved with corroborating evidence within 50 minutes (an hour less the adverts!) which may be fiction for the real forensic work needed to conclude a case in real life. -So there may be a story there without a realistic plot timescale! Look at a Bond film probably the biggest film franchise ever and still going after 50 years and a great film but rather restricted crimefighting accuracy!

[Laurie Booth]

When did scientific truth ever get in the way of a good (or bad) film script?

Very true

[Arthur Brown]

OP have you consulted your FLO/ELO they are the ones who can offer proper advice.

[comfortably numb]

Some of you obviously haven’t read my OP properly. I did emphasise that I’d kept the air gun on the boat as a last resort as I fully understand the potential ramifications of using one, and I wouldn’t use it ‘willy nilly’. The way some of you talk it’s as if I wave it about indiscriminately at the slightest sign of potential trouble which is definitely not the case.

 

I also have never used it for sport as I abhor killing wildlife for ‘fun’ and don’t enjoy using it for target practice like some folk do. So it always remains very much tucked away and I doubt I’d ever use it but I liked having it there just in case. It has been regulary tested to make sure it complies with the legal criteria.

 

However, I have taken on board some of your comments and will now think very seriously about whether or not to take it with me in future, not just due to the legal implications but also because of the risk of retaliation. We are soon buying our own boat for living aboard and perhaps I was getting a bit paranoid about the added potential of encountering low life.

[haggis]

Some of you obviously haven’t read my OP properly. I did emphasise that I’d kept the air gun on the boat as a last resort as I fully understand the potential ramifications of using one, and I wouldn’t use it ‘willy nilly’. The way some of you talk it’s as if I wave it about indiscriminately at the slightest sign of potential trouble which is definitely not the case.

 

I also have never used it for sport as I abhor killing wildlife for ‘fun’ and don’t enjoy using it for target practice like some folk do. So it always remains very much tucked away and I doubt I’d ever use it but I liked having it there just in case. It has been regulary tested to make sure it complies with the legal criteria.

 

However, I have taken on board some of your comments and will now think very seriously about whether or not to take it with me in future, not just due to the legal implications but also because of the risk of retaliation. We are soon buying our own boat for living aboard and perhaps I was getting a bit paranoid about the added potential of encountering low life.

I didn't for a minute think that you used your gun "willy nilly" but it worried me that you even had it on board "just in case". I am glad that you are thinking seriously about having your gun on the boat at all and trust that you will come to the right decision.

 

haggis

[Guest]

Some of you obviously haven’t read my OP properly. I did emphasise that I’d kept the air gun on the boat as a last resort as I fully understand the potential ramifications of using one, and I wouldn’t use it ‘willy nilly’. The way some of you talk it’s as if I wave it about indiscriminately at the slightest sign of potential trouble which is definitely not the case.

 

I also have never used it for sport as I abhor killing wildlife for ‘fun’ and don’t enjoy using it for target practice like some folk do. So it always remains very much tucked away and I doubt I’d ever use it but I liked having it there just in case. It has been regulary tested to make sure it complies with the legal criteria.

 

However, I have taken on board some of your comments and will now think very seriously about whether or not to take it with me in future, not just due to the legal implications but also because of the risk of retaliation. We are soon buying our own boat for living aboard and perhaps I was getting a bit paranoid about the added potential of encountering low life.

 

Whilst I applaud your re-think I do not think I incorrectly read your post, it painted a picture of somebody quite willing to shoot at someone who was stepping aboard your boat without you permission - now whilst an air pistol pellet is unlikely to do someone serious harm there would be the possibility of somebody being blinded as a price of 'giving it a bit large', hardly proportionate in my opinion.

 

I do think not taking any more is a good move.

[lesrollins]

Every mans home is his castle so they say.

I am sure there are lots of better options of weaponary on the n/b instead of using an air rifle, and they have a reason for being on the boat.

axe for chopping wood,

lump hammer used for mooring pins,

mooring chains.

I,m sure all items could be used in self defence. As times move on society is getting more violent and i am damn sure any towrag making his or her way onto the boat would be dealt with accordinaly. As we get older there is always going to be someone younger who fancies there chances and sometimes its better to have something to hand rather than nothing at all.

I remember making a delivery to glasgow once and i was shocked the first time i walked into a off licence and was confronted by plate glass and where you had to put your money through an hatch before you got the goods, hareshill leeds some houses have got wrought iron railings on the doors and windows probably not for decrotive purposes thou. Not everybody lives in nice little hamlets with duck ponds and village greens it always pays to be prepared in unfamiliar territory whilst enjoying your cruise.

[Boondock]

 

 

I also have never used it for sport as I abhor killing wildlife for ‘fun’ and don’t enjoy using it for target practice like some folk do. So it always remains very much tucked away and I doubt I’d ever use it but I liked having it there just in case. It has been regulary tested to make sure it complies with the legal criteria.

 

 

 

Get rid of it then as you have no good reason to possess one (other than for the illegal reasons you alluded to in your original post) you are only going to affect those that use and hold guns legally.

[onionbargee]

sell it to me, is it a good one ?

[Old git]

Hi,

 

Is it legal to keep a Shot Gun on a boat??

In 1983, yes in rural Yorkshire L &L, and no in London on Gu........confiscated and given an almighty bo@@@cking...........Today ?..........Ask,

I had two steel gun chests watertight, welded under the floor with proper locks when i built the boat, one for guns and other for ammo.

It turned into a nightmare and I had held a licence for 12plus years!

[Phil Ambrose]

Hi,

 

Is it legal to keep a Shot Gun on a boat??

 

Not on the Broads. Elsewhere I cannot say.

 

Phil

[GlenBlk]

WOW!

Would the tiller extension and pots and pans not be a more effective but demure affair in such circumstances!!

I would hasten to add that an air pistol would be ineffective unless you shot an attacker in the face which would leave a lot of explaining to do in relation to the ''reasonable force''law.

Edited December 14, 2012 by GlenBlk

[Laurie Booth]

Not on the Broads. Elsewhere I cannot say.

 

Phil

Depends on your licence.

[Abe]

If your having trouble with A---holes in the cut, get what I have Paint Ball gun and freeze the paint balls

Makes them YELP