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Damaged Morso Squirrel Stove


Dave_P

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Pig ( cast ) iron melts at 1200 degrees C !

All I can find in shops is silicone rated to 300 deg c or 1200 deg c which is obviously overkill but nothing inbetween. Another use for the mega high temp stuff is holding exhaust gaskets in place on motorcycle cylinder heads while your're fitting downpipes.PS: Just checked my fire cement (Firebrand) and that's rated to 1400 deg c which makes me think that while plumba flue may work ok at the stove end it is potentially getting close to it's maximum operating range.

Edited by JDR
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But then there are some chandler owning examiners who would have a interest promoting sales of new stoves or their parts.

 

Although what you say is true, I find you'r remark mildly offensive. Examiners sign up to a code of conduct. If anyone suspects the examiner is using the exam to boost other buisness they should complain that the code has been breached..

 

I would say that for people worrying about a small crack in the top and CO escaping, this stove has two round hatches that sit on the top, one over the fire the other over the oven, the one over the fire even sits in a removable ring that also just sits on the top of the stove. There are no seals around them, or around the fire door. I am sure the gaps would add up to much more area than a crack. But I do know they wont cause the stove to fall in half when its hot.

 

I think that the gaps in unsealed cast top plates are a bit smaller than you may imagine. Many have a bevelled contact face, as has the hole it fits in. This, not only prevents the plate falling through, but as the plate is quite heavy makes quite a good seal. It also keeps the seal while expanding and contraction by allowing the plate to move very slightly up and down. The thing to watch out for here is spilled food stuff entering the seal and baking on thus preventing the plate from "sitting" properly, (Usually cured by spinning the plate round a few times while in situ. (Providing its a round plate of course).

 

However, the issue here is unintended gapss. The issue should be 'What caused them?' Will any repair take account of the cause?

 

By the way, at a recent BSS seminar it came out that BSS estimate that the average life of a modern solid fuel stove to be between five and seven years!

 

Pig ( cast ) iron melts at 1200 degrees C !

 

If you are going to repair the stove firebox, top plate etc consider this temperature. Poorly attended stoves have been known to glow red hot, that is more than half way there! 300 deg C stuff is OK higher up in the flue but not in the area of the firebox.

 

 

Edited to add: - Lots of (Older) stove doors plates instead of rope seals have machined faces. These should be kept clean for a close fit.

Edited by Radiomariner
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the only place where super high tempretures exist is at the grate, and in the coals and firebricks, you use fire cement in those areas, silicone is fine for every where else, grates glow white hot but it's very hard to melt one,( 1100 Oc ) the cast iron casing or the flue is never going to get that hot.

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the only place where super high tempretures exist is at the grate, and in the coals and firebricks, you use fire cement in those areas, silicone is fine for every where else, grates glow white hot but it's very hard to melt one,( 1100 Oc ) the cast iron casing or the flue is never going to get that hot.

 

I did not sugguest such high temperatures. As the range of cement's seems to be 300oC (Generally limited to 250oC continuously) and considering that I was referring to the possibility of an overheating stove. the higher rated cement seems a wiser descision. (I have seen severly distorted (sagging) grates and firebars, and I might add, heat buckled steel top plates. Ask yourself, "Why did the plate crack in the first place?". I also recall that as a boy, the hot plate on my mother's Raeburn often used to glow a dull red.

Regardless, I believe, such a repair, should only be considered temporary.and worth being wary about. Different materials have different expansion rates and strengths, a cement filled crack will eventually breake up or work loose. Brazed or welded repairs if done properly will most likely be OK

Edited by Radiomariner
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Thanks for all the responses guys. I've been watching the readout on my CO detectors regularly and they've never showed anything other than 0ppm since this happened. (They have in the past but that's a different matter). So I'm not overly worried for the time being. I think I will be putting a new stove top on my shopping list though.

 

If the screws on the old top have set solid (likely) what's the best way forward? Grind off the screws and drill new screw holes? I'm not sure I'm handy enough to do a proper job of that.

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I think I will be putting a new stove top on my shopping list though.

You might be lucky, but you might find that the cracked top is indicative of a generally tired stove, and attempting to repair it simply causes other flaws to appear.

 

There's only one way to find out, though!

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My stove was tired and leaking, decided to replace it rather than repair even though I could, got £132 for it on Ebay a nice slice off the new stove cost.

I have played the repair game before and TBH 90% of the time its just not worth the effort

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My stove was tired and leaking, decided to replace it rather than repair even though I could, got £132 for it on Ebay a nice slice off the new stove cost.

I have played the repair game before and TBH 90% of the time its just not worth the effort

 

Thanks for the suggestion. Just one small flaw in the plan: new squirell - approx £800. Minus approx £130 for old one. Amount to pay approx £630. Right now I'd struggle with £30! We students aren't known for our limitless wealth! :banghead:

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Why go for a morso?

Personally I dont like them and I hae owned two.

For a stove I would go for a charnwood country 4

Or if space is a problem a hobbit, which is what I have just replaced my little wenlock with.

We also have a county 6 in the cottage now that is a beast.

Edited by idleness
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I did not sugguest such high temperatures. As the range of cement's seems to be 300oC (Generally limited to 250oC continuously) and considering that I was referring to the possibility of an overheating stove. the higher rated cement seems a wiser descision. (I have seen severly distorted (sagging) grates and firebars, and I might add, heat buckled steel top plates. Ask yourself, "Why did the plate crack in the first place?". I also recall that as a boy, the hot plate on my mother's Raeburn often used to glow a dull red.

Regardless, I believe, such a repair, should only be considered temporary.and worth being wary about. Different materials have different expansion rates and strengths, a cement filled crack will eventually breake up or work loose. Brazed or welded repairs if done properly will most likely be OK

 

 

1. I take "cement" to mean fire cement, which is ALL rated around 1250 deg C min.

 

2. Distorted and sagging grates does not mean they are getting close to any dangerous tempreture. It's not possible to melt cast iron with a natural draft furnace, you need a blower. ( ask any iron age man )

 

3. the dull red color of the hot plate is in the 600 to 700 deg C range. ( A heat treating color chart will tell you this )

 

4. if all the castings had free space to expand you could bring the thing up to white hot with no ill effects, they crack because they are heated up to quick from cold, faults in the castings, or the castings get stressed.

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1. I take "cement" to mean fire cement, which is ALL rated around 1250 deg C min.

 

2. Distorted and sagging grates does not mean they are getting close to any dangerous tempreture. It's not possible to melt cast iron with a natural draft furnace, you need a blower. ( ask any iron age man )

 

3. the dull red color of the hot plate is in the 600 to 700 deg C range. ( A heat treating color chart will tell you this )

 

4. if all the castings had free space to expand you could bring the thing up to white hot with no ill effects, they crack because they are heated up to quick from cold, faults in the castings, or the castings get stressed.

 

I agree with all your points. Nothing I did not know.

1. Other posters were referring to cements and sealants of much lower temperature tollerance

 

2..I did not mention melting any metal whatever. Distorted grates of firebars, do indicate that the stove has been allowed to burn out of controll creating its own draft. I have seen this mainly on the older "pot belly" stove (Never on a boat though.

 

3. 600o C is a lot hotter than 250o C which the 300oC cement mentioned in an earlier post is limited to.

 

4. This is exactly the point I was making when I said "Ask yourself why it cracked in the first place" You have to first eliminate the cause.

 

Cement repair practically useless, differing expansion rates almost guarantee this.

 

Edited cos I couldn't spell guarantee!

Edited by Radiomariner
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For a while now I've had a small crack on the top of my stove in the corner at the left rear. Recently I've noticed the crack getting a bit bigger so I had a poke at it with my finger and a small section of the stove top has completely broken off in the corner. About an inch or so long.

 

Should I be worried about CO escaping and is there anything i can easily do to repair it? Also, what might have caused the crack in the first place?

 

My stove in centrally located in my boat and I have carbon monoxide detectors both fore and aft of it, neither of which have gone off.

 

Just to pass on some information. When I bought my very first boat (being a newbie), I asked a friend of mine, who is a marine engineer and also owns a fireplace shop, to check over my morso squirrel. It had a hairline crack and he advised me not to use it and to replace it. When it was removed, it collapsed in pieces apparently. It was only 10yrs old. He said that very few boaters check their fuel burners, and that they should have new fire bricks inside every few years, and should never be used, if they have any cracks and they only have a working life of around 8 yrs. I eventually sold that boat (with new burner) and every boat that I looked to buy after that, if it was over 10yrs old, had cracks on the fuel burners and the sellers had no knowledge of the dangers. I have ended up replacing the burner with each boat I have bought. It's interesting that the BSS are now taking it into consideration from Jan 2013.

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I have a welded steel stove, a ''Boatman'' that runs 24/7 throughout the winter, its 13 years old now and still almost like new, original grate, everything. I would never bother with cast iron stoves especially of the Morso type that are built up of bolted together horrible thin cast iron panels that have the habit of cracking and opening up at the blooming seams like a blooming Tulip.

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It does depend on the way the stove is built. I have just finished re-furbishing my 50 odd year old Rayburn Royal it needed about £200 of bits and a bit of work and it is now ready for another 50, it all hinges on what is available as spare parts. :cheers:

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  • 1 year later...

I seem to have the same problem , How difficult is it to fit a new top plate ? mine is a morso squirrel !

See my post #11 in this thread. It's a filthy job, awkward, but not difficult. The (new) bolts go into the new top so no need for drilling and tapping. I always use A2 or A4 stainless cap heads from the local fastener stockist and coat them with copper grease. It is easiest to to stick the fire-rope to the top so get some rope glue as well as the top, the bolts and the rope.

 

N

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