Angling match pegged on lock moorings!

[Jim Riley]

1349980194[/url]' post='954983']

I'm a boater and a fisherman, if find this thread quite amusing from a fishermans point of view and with some disbelief from a boaters standpoint.

 

Most of the accusations of anglers fishing where they shouldn't, on lock moorings, or besde 'no fishing' signs , leaving litter etc etc, fair enough it happens but if they are illiterate or perhaps stupid or indeed ignorant as has been indicated on this thread, then perhaps boaters should just hold their hands up and admit the same, just a short walk up the bank from the car park to my boats, one boat moored on the water point one on private moorings three boats overstaying on the 48hr visitor moorings and more rubbish on the bank than i've ever seen in any of the hundreds of fishing matches i've fished. Thats the story of just the local boats here over just 400 yrds of canal. If you wish other examples i am confident of finding a similar scene this weekend on my travels.

 

 

This whole thread developed from a sensible well founded complaint into display of apparant insecurity from boaters, are you really that scared of anglers that you need to get together on a thread as a gang just to give them a good shoeing from tha safety of your keyboards

 

 

Like it or not canals are a shared facility and i would think they will always be that way in our lifetimes.

 

Actually some of you must have angling in your blood, even though you cast the smelliest, most rotten bait in tnto the pond you still got a bite

 

 

Perhaps a more accurate comparison than individual boaters or anglers is to compare an organisation, after all it was a club that did the pegging. Now if CaRT were to leave it's workboats and floating skips moored in inappropriate places, tied inadequately with blue string, then you might have a point.

[Gibbo]

Never quite worked it out; does fishing make people miserable, or do miserable people go fishing?

 

I would guess it's 50/50

[GSer]

Perhaps a more accurate comparison than individual boaters or anglers is to compare an organisation, after all it was a club that did the pegging. Now if CaRT were to leave it's workboats and floating skips moored in inappropriate places, tied inadequately with blue string, then you might have a point.

 

 

Oh i don't think so, but even if it were a better comparison, as you probably well know, there are plenty of examples of badly imoored workboats.

[Boat&Bikes]

While you may find some of the posts disappointing surely the thread itself is a worthy cause. I have been highly restrained in my posts, far more restrained than when confronted by carelessly pegged anglers*. I find it disappointing that the fishing match was pegged out in an incompetent fashion, certainly not within the guidelines. What is your position on the topic, as both a fisherman and a boater?

 

*I did indulge in one subtle dig at odd anglers..... oops I've done it again, a missing "the" and a plural noun! My apologies.

 

 

edited because I can and I missed a crucial *

 

 

I should have said i find the replies disappointing rather than the original topic.Obviously i agree with you that anglers should not fish from such places and the club that pegged the match were in the wrong.

 

Ian.

 

I would guess it's 50/50

 

 

I would guess that you are wrong.

 

Ian.

[Jim Riley]

Oh i don't think so, but even if it were a better comparison, as you probably well know, there are plenty of examples of badly moored workboats.

 

its hard to type with tongue firmly in cheek. and why not a valid comparison, the topic is about an organisation that should know better, it was putting its members and their kit at risk after all.

[GSer]

its hard to type with tongue firmly in cheek. and why not a valid comparison, the topic is about an organisation that should know better, it was putting its members and their kit at risk after all.

 

 

Mmmmmm possible senario.

 

Club leases river fishing for a day to a match organiser, match organiser advertises the event in the press, anglers book into the match, river floods, organiser leaves it as late as possible to change venue just in case conditions improve, after all they wanted to fish the river, last minute decision is made to swap to the canal, from here loads can go wrong, the waters leaseholder gives the organisers pegs 100-300 on the canal, match organiser splits the pegs into 10 peg 'sections' on the morning of the match, each pegger takes 3 sections and pegs it out as best as he can in the space available, he never fishes the cut so know nothing of the rules so he pegs where he thinks it gives the anglers the better days fishing or it could be that the venue is permanently pegged, and the sections were divided up in the morning without even visiting he venue. Angler turns up to fish finds his peg on a lock landing, he has two choices fish or not fish. He may have travelled many miles to fish seems unlikely he's gonna turn around an go home after all there arn't many boats about due to the river in flood. It could have been a team match if one team member decides not to fish it generally means the team stands no chance, tho only way to fairly deal with that is to remove the section from the match, this does happen on occasions, but it is rare.

 

If i found myself pegged on a lockmooring, i'd fish, but i'd be prepared to give way if a boat approached, the only possible fly in the ointment would be if some self important captain birds eye lookalike came along spouting the rules and regs without the hint of understanding for the facti didn't want to be there on the first place.

 

Sometimes it just dosn't go to plan and we have to get along with fellow users of the facility

[lydfordcastle]

Mmmmmm possible senario.

 

Club leases river fishing for a day to a match organiser, match organiser advertises the event in the press, anglers book into the match, river floods, organiser leaves it as late as possible to change venue just in case conditions improve, after all they wanted to fish the river, last minute decision is made to swap to the canal, from here loads can go wrong, the waters leaseholder gives the organisers pegs 100-300 on the canal, match organiser splits the pegs into 10 peg 'sections' on the morning of the match, each pegger takes 3 sections and pegs it out as best as he can in the space available, he never fishes the cut so know nothing of the rules so he pegs where he thinks it gives the anglers the better days fishing or it could be that the venue is permanently pegged, and the sections were divided up in the morning without even visiting he venue. Angler turns up to fish finds his peg on a lock landing, he has two choices fish or not fish. He may have travelled many miles to fish seems unlikely he's gonna turn around an go home after all there arn't many boats about due to the river in flood. It could have been a team match if one team member decides not to fish it generally means the team stands no chance, tho only way to fairly deal with that is to remove the section from the match, this does happen on occasions, but it is rare.

 

If i found myself pegged on a lockmooring, i'd fish, but i'd be prepared to give way if a boat approached, the only possible fly in the ointment would be if some self important captain birds eye lookalike came along spouting the rules and regs without the hint of understanding for the facti didn't want to be there on the first place.

 

Sometimes it just dosn't go to plan and we have to get along with fellow users of the facility

 

What a brilliant piece of common sense. You should stand for Parliament Sir, or at least as a Police & Crime Commissioner. Have a Greenie !

[Higgs]

What a brilliant piece of common sense. You should stand for Parliament Sir, or at least as a Police & Crime Commissioner. Have a Greenie !

 

All well and good. Just educate the planners and peggers. No problem. Ignorance is no defence.

[GSer]

All well and good. Just educate the planners and peggers. No problem. Ignorance is no defence.

 

That only really applies in law really, common sense and tollerance is what sorts most issues out in the real world.

 

And for the boaters who are also at fault, equal education? Or is it Ok for boaters to pick and choose what rules apply to them that is as long as they know they are in the wrong? No, it seems popuar to gather all anglers under the same umbrella and treat them all the same, in another world that might be lumping all boaters in with the bridge hopping, litter dropping, mooring hogging twits that seem to form part our boaty world, i'd not be happy about that either.

 

Some tolerance is what is really needed, recognition that the canals are to be shared by non boaters, some of these other users, just like some boaters, will make mistakes or indeed in the case of these anglers have mistakes dumped in their laps at times. Treat each case as an individual and accept that common sense to you might not appear so to others.

 

Don't forget i agree that the fishing club in the OP's post is at fault, but the example i gave explained how it might not be quite as black and white as that, i object to the way the thread just slipped into a boater/angler slagging match.

[Higgs]

That only really applies in law really, common sense and tollerance is what sorts most issues out in the real world.

 

And for the boaters who are also at fault, equal education? Or is it Ok for boaters to pick and choose what rules apply to them that is as long as they know they are in the wrong? No, it seems popuar to gather all anglers under the same umbrella and treat them all the same, in another world that might be lumping all boaters in with the bridge hopping, litter dropping, mooring hogging twits that seem to form part our boaty world, i'd not be happy about that either.

 

Some tolerance is what is really needed, recognition that the canals are to be shared by non boaters, some of these other users, just like some boaters, will make mistakes or indeed in the case of these anglers have mistakes dumped in their laps at times. Treat each case as an individual and accept that common sense to you might not appear so to others.

 

Don't forget i agree that the fishing club in the OP's post is at fault, but the example i gave explained how it might not be quite as black and white as that, i object to the way the thread just slipped into a boater/angler slagging match.

 

When I have passed fishermen, by the bank, they get a customary nod after slowing down. Fishermen on a lock landing are out of their plaice. Ignorance, of the needs of the boater to land in the appropriate place, is the fisherman's fault.

 

Don't see why it should be tolerated. Won't stop it by tolerating it. Education through angler's mags and clubs.

[Graham Davis]

GSer, in your "flooding" scenario, surely the pegger-outer would see the signs that say "No fishing" on the lock landings and not peg there? Or is that too simple?

[GSer]

GSer, in your "flooding" scenario, surely the pegger-outer would see the signs that say "No fishing" on the lock landings and not peg there? Or is that too simple?

 

 

If its permanently pegged, its quite easy to divvy up the pegs well away from the water, unfamiliarity could lead to a mix up with peg numbers. If i drew a peg and found a no fishing sign beside i'd not fish and ask for a redraw. As would many others but its not always possible. 'Pegger outers' may be doing this in the darbk of course. No defence for the organising club as i've said before it should never have been pegged.

 

There is the point that ' No mooring' signs don't stop some people mooring

Edited October 12, 2012 by GSer

[Higgs]

There is the point that ' No mooring' signs don't stop some people mooring.

 

It's not really a very sound defence, though.

[GSer]

When I have passed fishermen, by the bank, they get a customary nod after slowing down. Fishermen on a lock landing are out of their plaice. Ignorance, of the needs of the boater to land in the appropriate place, is the fisherman's fault.

 

Don't see why it should be tolerated. Won't stop it by tolerating it. Education through angler's mags and clubs.

 

 

 

So whats the answer with boats that moor up on lock landings then? I've seen more boats moored on lock landings than fishermen fishing and i've never been unable to moor on one that has an angler on it, but perhaps thats just a local issue on the k&a

 

Some education could work but you need to assume most of the anglers that are at fault read the appropriate paper, outside of the match circuit, most of the guys i see fishing in the wrong places are proper amateurs first timers even, the more experienced transgressors probably know they shouldn't but do it anyway.

Edited October 12, 2012 by GSer

[Guest]

There is the point that ' No mooring' signs don't stop some people mooring

 

What's that saying again - oh I remember

 

'Two wrongs don't make a right'

 

[adam1uk]

the only possible fly in the ointment would be if some self important captain birds eye lookalike came along spouting the rules and regs without the hint of understanding for the facti didn't want to be there on the first place.

 

And how would the boat know the backstory, given that he's only just arrived on the scene and presumably isn't clairvoyant?

[GSer]

And how would the boat know the backstory, given that he's only just arrived on the scene and presumably isn't clairvoyant?

 

 

For that very reason all involved should practice tolerance.

[Jim Riley]

For that very reason all involved should practice tolerance.

 

?? tolerate fishing in dangerous places? or deal with it reasonably and thoughtfully? I hope you are not insinuating that I came along like some self important captain birds eye lookalike, spouting the rules and regs without the hint of understanding for the fact that they didn't want to be there on the first place - and you are presuming the fishermen didn't want to be there in the first place, actually they hadn't a clue, or made a good pretence of not having a clue, that they shouldn't have been there in the first place. I mate of mine has some copies of the code of conduct he hands out - in a reasonable manner.

[GSer]

Nothing insinuated at all, as you say, your OP gave the impression that you were being very reasonable about it all. As i sad before the manner in which the thread developed that dissapointed me, but thats just my opinion of course.

 

This weekends boating, of 35 locks and a few swingbriges revealed equal rule breakers on both 'sides' three anglers fishing on lock moorings and three boats moored badly, one on a water point and two on lock moorings, one of the anglers was fishing below a national grid pylon from the lock mouth, i dd mention that it's quite a dodgy place to fish and he just shrugged even after i mentioned how electricity loves to jump gaps. I guess Darwins rule will sort that one out.

[Ishticar]

Let me introduce myself.

 

I am the President of Old Bank Angling Club, have been for the last 2 years and have been a member of said club since 1974, holding many positions of office.

 

In answer to Mr Riley and his "open" letter of complaint. Why did you not wait to get a written response to your letter instead of publishing for "ALL" to see?

 

On the date in question we did not hold a match on these canals nor did we plan to. The club in question was Mirfield Angling Club. We have an agreement with them that, if the river is unfishable, for whatever reason, they may use the canals.

 

You state, quote, "It seems that they were going to have the match on the river stretches but because the levels were high used the canal instead", you also state, quote, "On arriving at the Mirfield Flood lock the gates were shut". If the river was high and the flood gate shut didn't that tell you something? Should you have been travelling or moored in a safe haven until levels subsided?

 

The canals and their towpaths are open to all users and as such should be used sensibly. I do not condone the actions of irresponsible anglers nor do I accept that it is always anglers that are in the wrong. Were there visible signs warning anglers not to fish in this particular landing area? If not, why not? There are plenty of signs to indicate that Old Bank Angling Club has the fishing rights on these stretches. If these said signs have been removed, vandalised or whatever, whose responsibility is it to get them replaced?

 

As a responsible club we welcome comments that are constructive to better assist us in our endeavors to maintain peace and harmony with other users, BUT, I WILL NOT accept blanket abuse as has happened in this forum without first waiting for a reply.

 

I frequently am in contact with boaters on our canals and the vast majority are good natured with plenty of amusing banter. Then there is the odd one who makes a beeline for the towpath in the hope of disrupting a match that is in progress, as a minimum. I have had 2 keepnets completely shredded and the fish in them killed over the last 5 years. I fish for sport, not to kill, catch and release. Was that the thought of the morons who killed my catch? I think not.

 

As a boater you will pay a fee to use the canal, ie, licence, mooring fees and the like. Old Bank Angling Club also pays an annual fee to be able to fish these canals.

 

If you had had the decency to wait for a written response then I would not have had to reply this way and have to respond to this vitriol.

[matty40s]

Mr Ishticar, welcome to the Forum, it is a canalworld forum so most on here are boaters.....and some are anglers too.

 

Firstly, the fact that a flood lock is closed does NOT mean a navigation is closed, or indeed unsafe to navigate - some flood gates are closed for the 6 months from October to March as standard, not just because there are high river levels.

 

I also don't believe there has been blanket abuse at all - or vitriol, there is quite a good debate on here, citing examples of good natured co-existence along with examples of the opposite.

 

We have already had a clear example on here a month ago in Loughborough, where boaters went out of their way to accommodate an angling match pegged along a popular mooring stretch, only to find that the Angling club caused notices to be wrongly issued to boats following their complaints to CaRT officials.

I passed through a very long stretch of a match on the Shropshire Union Canal last weekend, over 2 miles of anglers. I could see they were fishing for roach, and stayed as near to the towpath as I could without disturbing nets - however the boats in front of me wandered everywhere which meant the fishermen were annoyed at their swims being disturbed.

A large board at each end of a match would assist boaters to steer more sympathetically, I have never seen this. Some of the anglers could see the line I was taking and were happy and said thanks, others ignored me completely.

We do have to live together on the same stretches, but as a single hander and boat mover, anglers moored on lock landings get short shrift from me, especially in strong current or wind situations.

Edited October 19, 2012 by matty40s

[Smelly]

Let me introduce myself.

 

I am the President of Old Bank Angling Club, have been for the last 2 years and have been a member of said club since 1974, holding many positions of office.

 

Were there visible signs warning anglers not to fish in this particular landing area? If not, why not?

 

 

It"s probably fair to concede that the emergence of man eating badgers coinciding with the transfer to CRT has left the signage questionable around this BLIMMIN GREAT BIG LOCK so we must show tolerance to our fellow anglers and remember to administer first aid where necessary

[tosher]

Slightly off topic but----- As a boater and a fisherman I always slow down to tickover when passing fishermen and generally speaking most of them acknowledge me if they are alone. If they are in a match then it is very different. A few weeks ago I passed a match on the Shroppie and conducted a little survey. I slowed to tickover as usual and started counting how many were fishing the match. My wife and I looked and smiled at every single one of them and it was peg 33 before one responded. We counted 77 fishermen in total and only 12 acknowledged us, five with no more than a grunt but only 7 actually smiled and spoke, the rest totally blanked us. Suggestions please for what I should do when next I pass a fishing match.

[frangar]

Suggestions please for what I should do when next I pass a fishing match.

 

Carry on at usual cruising speed and let them sulk in peace!....oh and if any are sitting where they shouldn't be you will find they soon move when 20 tons of steel is heading their way!

 

Cheers

 

Gareth

[Grace and Favour]

Slightly off topic but----- As a boater and a fisherman I always slow down to tickover when passing fishermen and generally speaking most of them acknowledge me if they are alone. If they are in a match then it is very different. A few weeks ago I passed a match on the Shroppie and conducted a little survey. I slowed to tickover as usual and started counting how many were fishing the match. My wife and I looked and smiled at every single one of them and it was peg 33 before one responded. We counted 77 fishermen in total and only 12 acknowledged us, five with no more than a grunt but only 7 actually smiled and spoke, the rest totally blanked us. Suggestions please for what I should do when next I pass a fishing match.

 

I think you've had an opportunity to appreciate first-hand the all-consuming concentration that the first-rate and competitive anglers simply must have in order to achieve those highest levels of skill necessary in order to take on and challenge their wily prey.

 

It should not be a surprise that they have to lose all powers of communication if they are to succeed in achieving the perfect balance of sitting on a chair and hold a rod.

 

Just be grateful that you've only got a 15 tonne plus boat to handle and control!