Housing benefit?

[bottle]

It appears my post (#5) kicked this off, the post was genuine, in the fact that I thought it the best advice.

 

£20,000 is not going to buy much of a boat and when you take out licence,insurance, survey and a contingency for the things that will go wrong there will be even less.

 

Then there will be all the hassle of trying to get a mooring.

 

I did and still do wish the OP good luck but he needs to go in with his eyes open.

[KirraMisha]

Can you get JSA and housing benefit to pay for a residential mooring? I may be returning to the UK and buying a narrowboat to live on and wondered can you get housing benefit on a residential marina. My Grandmother is desperate to return to Birmingham and said I can have £20,000 and I'm thinking about buying a narrowboat as I would prefer to live in the countryside rather than in Birmingham. I can't stand City's and much rather prefer the countryside. I would hate a flat in Birmingham. I have no savings.

 

If not it may be a non starter and have to rethink my plans.

 

I would like to start self employment, plumbing and all aspects of property repairs but wondered if there was any financial help until settled and the buisness started to bring in the money?

 

James

I thought there was going to be a twist when I read the title but no there is not,you are serious!

So you want to use your 20k to buy a boat to live the dream but have the system pay rent for it!

When I was unemployed and had the system paying my rent I had to live in a flat on such a rough estate that the flat was on a so called ''Hard to Let'' list.

No one else wanted to live there, it was so bad I bought an old bedford cf camper van for £500 in a bloody cold november and handed the keys back for the flat.

Just move the boat around and stop taking the mick.

Edited June 25, 2012 by KirraMisha

[Little Else]

I thought there was going to be a twist when I read the title but no there is not,you are serious!

So you want to use your 20k to buy a boat to live the dream but have the system pay rent for it!

When I was unemployed and had the system paying my rent I had to live in a flat on such a rough estate that the flat was on a so called ''Hard to Let'' list.

No one else wanted to live there, it was so bad I bought an old bedford cf camper van for £500 in a bloody cold november and handed the keys back for the flat.

Just move the boat around and stop taking the mick.

 

You were bloody lucky to have a spare 500 pounds lying around. I would have thought you would have been glad he was being sensible and not looking at becoming a cmer. I don't see anything in the original post to explain the bile spewing forth. The benefits system should be a safety net, the op isn't asking for anything more until he is properly on his feet. You can disagree or say its not such a good idea, with a decent argument for your case, without it sounding so petty and nasty.

[carlt]

You were bloody lucky to have a spare 500 pounds lying around.

Is that any different to saying "You are bloody lucky to have a spare £20k lying around?"

 

I'm not sure that thinking the benefit system is there for when the £20k runs out is necessarily "spewing forth bile".

 

Depending on your requirements I would have said that £20k is more than enough for a young single man to sort out a home (floating or not) buy the tools for his trade and survive for a few months while he gets a job or his self employment starts bringing in a few bob.

 

The only time I signed on for money was when I ran out of petrol for the boat because they don't put petrol in skips.

 

First Giro I got filled the tank and got me back to Banbury where there was always agency work to refill the wallet until nice work came back.

 

Have I joined the Daily Mail brigade because I don't think benefits are necessary, if there's 20 grand in the wallet?

[KevMc]

That's OK then, because the money Cameron has saved paying the needy can now be used to pay the OP because he doesn't want to use his family savings - easy

So you think a 30 year old should be bailed out by his grandparents to save the country a couple of weeks benefit while he gets on his feet? Even I'm not that harsh

[mayalld]

Wouldn't the 20k go quickly by renting a flat though? What if I couldn't find work? Would it be tough sxxt and no starve to death or would it be ok to claim welfare then, once the money has run out and I'm evicted?

 

Anyway I thank those who genuinely answered my questions but I have asked this thread to be locked or removed due to the various comments made by a small minority. I won't be replying

 

 

That would be a pity, and displays a certain lack of appreciation on your part of how internet discussion forums work.

 

By asking a question in public, you invite public comment, and relinquish any right to dictate what can be said (within the bounds of what is permitted on a forum). You can't then decide that you don't like the answer and have it removed.

 

However, leaving that aside, I fear that the current state of this thread is something that you cannot be entirely blamed for. You asked a question (which I will offer a view on in a moment) and there were a number of replies that took different views, but which were constructive enough.

 

The problem came when one poster came up with a suggestion for organising things so as to maximise the opportunity to fleece the public purse by getting granny to buy the boat and rent it to you. It wasn't your suggestion, but unfortunately, you seem to have been tarred with the same brush. The suggestion may or may not be legal, but in the "doing the right thing" stakes, it was towards the Jimmy Carr end of the scale.

 

Now to the question at hand.

 

Your entry point can be summarised as follows;

 

• You want to live on a boat
• You have been offered the capital to buy a boat
• If you use that capital to buy a boat, you can't afford to pay the running costs
• This is a temporary situation until you find work
• You don't want to fritter away the capital on a flat until you get work, because then you won't have it to buy a boat.

Now, you have proposed a solution (buy the boat and HB pays the outgoings pro tem), that some agree with, and some would suggest is taking the taxpayer for a ride.

 

Others have proposed that you use the £20k to keep yourself, and don't bother the taxpayer at all, but this may well mean that when you get work you can't buy a boat, so it doesn't appeal to you.

 

My world view (and as a taxpayer, I trust that I am allowed a view on where that money is spent?!) is that the welfare system doesn't exist to fund you lifestyle choice, and that it would NOT be "right" for you to choose to live the dream, with the intention at the outset that the public purse should fund it.

 

However, I cannot subscribe to the view that others have put forward that you should spend the £20k on accomodating yourself. Taken to its logical conclusion, they are saying that anybody who has a granny with a few quid in the bank should go and sponge of the old dear rather than have any recourse to public funds. Such a state of affairs would harly be fair on grandparents!

 

Might I instead suggest an alternative approach which has much to commend it...

 

• Tell granny that her offer is MUCH appreciated, and that once you are in a position to manage a boat, you will gladly accept her money.
• Get a flat and clain the HB that you are entitled to for the flat, whilst you find work
• Once you are in work ask granny for the money, buy a boat and live the dream.

You haven't had the public purse paying for your lifestyle choice, you haven't frittered away your windfall such that you don't benefit from it, and who knows the prospect of the boat following in due course may give you an incentive to find a job...

 

 

 

[grahoom]

If, when I was 32 I had been given £20K and had the skills the OP has (plumbing/ gas fitting / house renovating - so some DIY skills), I'd have considered doing the following:

 

Buying a cheap boat that needs work, do the work while living on it and travelling the network whilst doing it up. There is the chance that once finished it could be sold on and the same process started again.

[mayalld]

Have I joined the Daily Mail brigade because I don't think benefits are necessary, if there's 20 grand in the wallet?

 

I hear that the current financial difficulties that we are experiencing have now spread even to Hell, where Satan himself is not too pleased at the prospect of paying out an increasing gas bill to counteract the unexpected cold snap that they are experiencing today.

 

Analysts are, however suggesting that as this unseasonal temperature was caused by carlt being significantly to the right of me in a debate on CWDF, they are not expecting a recurrence for many years!

 

There isn't 20 grand in the wallet. There is a potential for there to be 20 grand in the wallet FOR A SPECIFIC PURPOSE. Granny has offered £20k to buy a boat. She hasn't offered £20k to live on.

 

At the present time, the OP isn't in a position to use the money for the purpose it is being offered, and he can with a clear conscience ask granny to keep hold of it for now.

[carlt]

 

There isn't 20 grand in the wallet. There is a potential for there to be 20 grand in the wallet FOR A SPECIFIC PURPOSE. Granny has offered £20k to buy a boat. She hasn't offered £20k to live on.

 

The boat will be his home, Dave and he will be living on it.

 

If my Gran offered me £20k to live on a boat I would say "Thanks but would you mind me investing some in a boat, some on setting myself up in business and some to live on?"

 

This is not a right wing view point, btw, but a similar opinion that I have to rich folk wanting the state to look after their infirm parents so it doesn't eat into their inheritance.

 

If I can look after myself then I will, without claiming benefits.

[Tuscan]

The boat will be his home, Dave and he will be living on it.

 

If my Gran offered me £20k to live on a boat I would say "Thanks but would you mind me investing some in a boat, some on setting myself up in business and some to live on?"

 

This is not a right wing view point, btw, but a similar opinion that I have to rich folk wanting the state to look after their infirm parents so it doesn't eat into their inheritance.

 

If I can look after myself then I will, without claiming benefits.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Reading the OP's posts he worked in France for his grandparents doing up homes (plural) so sounds like a business. In return for his board and lodging and it would appear he is going to be given £20k by his grandparents. This wage or gift neatly circumvents French welfare taxes, so as these were not paid no social benefits were available. I would have thought if you were genuinely seeking work or looking to set up a business you first thought would be to go where the most work is which is likely to be the city rather than a nice rural mooring which certainly I would then aspire to. So like Dave argued I think the OP is asking for tax payers support to fund a lifestyle choice not a start up.

 

Not sure if this is right wing or not, economic times have changed and regardless of politics things are getting tougher and choices more limited for all.

[carlt]

...In return for his board and lodging and it would appear he is going to be given £20k by his grandparents. This wage or gift neatly circumvents French welfare taxes, so as these were not paid no social benefits were available....

So, let's get this all straight.

 

It's a wage for work done, disguised as a gift in order to evade taxes.

 

I used my wage to fund my boat purchases, finance my going self-employed, putting food on the table and for paying taxes.

 

My employer wasn't my gran but they also didn't tell me what I could or couldn't spend my wage on.

Edited June 25, 2012 by carlt

[mayalld]

The boat will be his home, Dave and he will be living on it.

 

If my Gran offered me £20k to live on a boat I would say "Thanks but would you mind me investing some in a boat, some on setting myself up in business and some to live on?"

 

This is not a right wing view point, btw, but a similar opinion that I have to rich folk wanting the state to look after their infirm parents so it doesn't eat into their inheritance.

 

If I can look after myself then I will, without claiming benefits.

 

As will I (Indeed, as have I)

 

However, I simply don't accept that if I fall on hard times, then my entitlement to assistance from the state should be predicated upon my having first raided the coffers of any relatives that I might have, and reduced them to poverty.

Edited June 25, 2012 by mayalld

[carlt]

However, I simply don't accept that if I fall on hard times, then my entitlement to assistance from the state should be predicated upon my having first raided the coffers of any relatives that I might have, and reduced them to poverty.

He was working for her...It was a wage not a gift and assuming that using her money as an investment in his future, rather than to fund his lifestyle, will make his gran one penny poorer is frankly more evidence that your debating skills are seriously awry at the moment, Dave.

Edited June 25, 2012 by carlt

[Bodgers]

So, you're a mature man, not a youngster just starting out, presumably in good health and with a trade which is in demand and yet despite you saying

' I am 32 and still live at home with my Grandparents:blush: who are 80 and 81. Property prices here are very affordable. They will be lucky to buy a flat.'

you'd still accept £20,000 from them leaving them only possibly able to buy a flat.

[Guest]

After many years the truth has dawned on me:

Some people read posts then misinterpret them to state what they would like to read, rather than what is actually said.

 

Why did it take me so long to realise that? (rhetorical question)

Edited June 25, 2012 by Guest

[Paul C]

After man years the truth has dawned on me:

Some people read posts then misinterpret them to state what they would like to read, rather than what is actually said.

 

Why did it take me so long to realise that? (rhetorical question)

 

About 12.8 volts.

[Guest]

About 12.8 volts.

Are you certain? I would have said cassette every time.

 

Edit: can't give you a greeny cause i've used 'em up.

Edited June 25, 2012 by Guest

[Guest wanted]

About 12.8 volts.

 

Have a greenie from me, good timing.

 

 

I love the presumptuous air to this thread, it would seem that if you work your balls off for your life and dare to exercise a little choice in how you spend the few precious moments when you are not breaking your back you are not entitled to a hand up. Let's all celebrate the fortnightly ritual humiliation where you have to dance for your crumbs.

 

We are not all in this together and we never will be if continue to pick the bones of the poor sod who wants to improve their lives.

 

OP I wish you all the best, feel free to spend the tiny amount of tax I pay that goes towards the benefit pot instead of the massive amount I pay to blow the limbs off of children in the name of terrorism.

 

 

(shitty day today? You betcha!)

[carlt]

 

OP I wish you all the best, feel free to spend the tiny amount of tax I pay that goes towards the benefit pot instead of the massive amount I pay to blow the limbs off of children in the name of terrorism.

 

Unfortunately the money comes out of the benefit pot, not the the blowing up children pot.

 

I do wish the first question on people's minds is "Do I need to take out of the pot?" rather than "Am I entitled to it?"

[Guest wanted]

Unfortunately the money comes out of the benefit pot, not the the blowing up children pot.

 

I do wish the first question on people's minds is "Do I need to take out of the pot?" rather than "Am I entitled to it?"

 

I think the OP has, I do get what you are saying and I personally have never claimed a penny, I made enough to move to London from Dorset by borrowing tools from people to do gardening jobs, but, I also don't get jealous of how other people may claim or not. My tax isn't going down either way and I'd rather it got spent on somebody who appears to be looking for a sustainable solution. Are we agreeing? Hmmmm

[Gibbo]

I do wish the first question on people's minds is "Do I need to take out of the pot?" rather than "Am I entitled to it?"

 

Ahh, now that could dig up a nest.

 

Many seem to rely on this "It's your entitlement".

 

By the same token, it was Jimmy Carr's "entitlement" to minimize his tax bill. The same people who scream "It's your entitlement" also seem to be the same ones who object to someone better off using their "entitlment" to reduce their tax burden.

 

Is there a difference? I can't see one.

[KirraMisha]

You were bloody lucky to have a spare 500 pounds lying around. I would have thought you would have been glad he was being sensible and not looking at becoming a cmer. I don't see anything in the original post to explain the bile spewing forth. The benefits system should be a safety net, the op isn't asking for anything more until he is properly on his feet. You can disagree or say its not such a good idea, with a decent argument for your case, without it sounding so petty and nasty.

Actually I did not have £500 laying around while living in a shit hole where no one else wanted to live there is nothing lucky about that it was hell.

I had to borrow the £500 and do back breaking building work for two months to pay the money.

Luck is having 20k and the ordacity and bare face cheek to expect housing benefit after buying a home that floats in the countryside but cant be arsed to be resourcefull enough to move it around!

 

No one has to become a cmer and can legitimately move on enough to satisfy the rules and still be able to work like many do.

 

The housing benefit system is there for people who are really hard up, and you have the cheek to call me words bile.

Get a reality check as my hard earned back breaking taxes are not for keeping people in countryside moorings because they want to be comfortable.

The damn cheek of it.

 

''edited due to extremely angry swear words''

Edited June 25, 2012 by KirraMisha

[Guest wanted]

Just to be clear, my description of entitlement is not someone who just expects it, I believe that the OP has worked and is using benefits as a means to an end.

[KirraMisha]

Just to be clear, my description of entitlement is not someone who just expects it, I believe that the OP has worked and is using benefits as a means to an end.

Fine then he can go live in a council estate where no one else wants to live and pay miminal rent and tax out of his 20k and work not chill in the countryside while his mooring is paid by the tax payer.

[Gibbo]

Just to be clear, my description of entitlement is not someone who just expects it, I believe that the OP has worked and is using benefits as a means to an end.

 

I've not read all this thread, but hasn't OP been living in another country? Perhaps contributing to their social system? Now, when the shit hits the fan, he's back to good old social security Blighty where they dish out everyone's hard earned money to people who don't work and haven't paid in a penny to our system. No wonder the place is bankrupt.

 

If I went to OP's country with 20 grand and bought a boat, would their social system pay for my mooring? No I thought not.