Help! Engine dead!

[Halfie]

We've just arrived at the boat after three weeks away. Loaded up, had a cup of tea, did usual engine checks and went to start engine. Initially all seemed fine: ignition light came on and buzzer sounded. Then turned to glow plugs position - and everything died. No sign of life in any position of key.

 

I've checked the battery voltage, 12.6V, and checked that bilge pump (powered by engine battery) works.

 

I've checked all obvious connections - battery, isolator switch, alternator, earth etc. and all seem sound.

 

Does anyone have any ideas which might help?

 

It's an Isuzu IM4LC38, with Sterling "advanced digital four-step split charge alternator to battery charger" device. The boat is 9 years old and we bought it last month. It's always started fine before.

 

Thanks in anticipation ...

[zenataomm]

You say you have power in the battery, but nothing at the key.

What about the other domestic doo-dabs?

 

If nothing there check any isolator switch you may have.

If domestics ok but nothing at engine starter check your 32 amp main fuse.

 

Others will be along to talk more sense.

 

Good luck

 

zenataomm

[Halfie]

Zenataomm, the domestic electrics are OK, it's just the engine electrics which are dead. I've checked the isolator switch which seems fine. I couldn't find any fuse anywhere - should there be one?

[Taslim]

Stupid question m'be but have you checked that the battery terminals are clean & the connectors are tight? I got caught out by that one. Tum_Tee_Tum..

 

taslim.

[Chalky]

Depends - we have fuses on both our battery banks. Follow the wires and look for something big. Does/do the alternator warning lights come on and the warning buzzer sound when turned on? Follow the lead from the instrument panel to the engine. There's a multiway connector in the middle of it that may have come loose. I put a cable tie round ours to hold the two halves together. (we have an isuzu 4lb33)

[Halfie]

Taslim, the battery connections look clean and they feel firm.

[MtB]

There is a bad connection somewhere. One of those that is fine with low current draw but goes open circuit when the demand is high (like a starter motor). Get yerself a multimeter and seek it out while someone holds the key in the 'start' position.

 

Alternatively try cleaning the engine battery terminals. They are the No 1 suspect.

[Halfie]

Chalky, I followed the +ve lead from battery to isolator switch to starter to alternator thingy and couldn't see a fuse holder. No, there's now no sound from the buzzer nor any lights. I have already tried reseating the multiway connector.

[Phil Ambrose]

Check out the ignition switch, I had this problem and it proved to be connections to the ignition switch.

 

Phil

[Halfie]

Mike, if it was a poor battery connection I would have expected the buzzer to still sound as it has a low current draw, only to die when I turned to glow plugs position. As it is, there is absolutely no sign of life.

 

But I have nothing to lose from remaking the battery connections, so I'll go and do that now...

[Pie Eater]

Chalky, I followed the +ve lead from battery to isolator switch to starter to alternator thingy and couldn't see a fuse holder. No, there's now no sound from the buzzer nor any lights. I have already tried reseating the multiway connector.

We got caught out when we first bought our boat. There is a fuse holder hidden underneath our engine ( Beta marine 1005

 

Steve

[MtB]

Undoubtedly a bad connection in my opinion. The battery would not have died that badly so quickly. Just need to find it. Multimeter is your friend here!

[by'eck]

Undoubtedly a bad connection in my opinion. The battery would not have died that badly so quickly. Just need to find it. Multimeter is your friend here!

 

Agreed but it could also be a fuse or re-settable circuit breaker which blew/tripped for whatever reason when the heaters were selected.

[MtB]

Unlikely given the way the fault developed, in my view.

 

First the heater plugs work but no starter, then later, neither. That means two separate fuses failed consecutively by your theory. Unlikely in my opinion.

 

 

Edit to correct a spilling misgtake

Edited May 25, 2012 by Mike the Boilerman

[NB Lola]

We need the answer?

[Wiltshire Moonraker]

Take a look at the wiring harness near the flange where the gearbox attaches & you should find a multi-pin connector, chances are one of the connectors/wires is corroded away... probably the big brown one! Either clean up the connection or bypass the connector block with yellow crimp connector (butt joint!!!)

 

Hope it helps

 

Chris

[Halfie]

FIXED! Well, I haven't actually spun the engine but I'm confident it will work. I found another multiway connector near the engine (the first one I found and reseated was by the control panel). When I brushed against the one by the engine the buzzer sprang into life (I'd left the ignition in the first position so I would know when things started to work). This one has a cable tie holding the two halves together, but I was able to exercise the connector sufficiently for the buzzer to stay on constantly.

 

I didn't actually start up as it was approaching 10 pm. If it doesn't start in the morning I shall be very surprised.

 

Thanks for all your suggestions. Bad connection in the end (had to be, really)

[Nose Miner]

Another common source of failure is the isolator switch - overheating of this can lead to it not making a proper connection which will go open circuit when a load is applied. Try wiggling the big red key whilst trying to turn the engine over.

 

Also check the big thick earth lead which should go from your battery negative to the engine - can be prone to vibration damage.

 

The fact that the battery is showing 12.6v is no guarantee that the battery is OK - you need to have a meter on it when operating the glowplugs or trying to turn the engine over. If the battery voltage suddenly drops out when you do this, the battery is sh*gged.

 

Just noticed our posts crossed - hopefully you have it sorted now then.

Edited May 25, 2012 by Nose Miner

[Smelly]

I've not read the rest of this, but there are two fuses wrapped in with the loom, on mine they're wrapped in with the multipin connections.

 

Either one going gives exactly the described problem.

 

Run down the cable from the control panel and unwrap anything; you'll soon find them.

[Canal Rat]

I had my glow plug relay go down. I expected £50 - £70. Nearly past out when he said £150

 

Hope she runs in the morning for ya

[bizzard]

FIXED! Well, I haven't actually spun the engine but I'm confident it will work. I found another multiway connector near the engine (the first one I found and reseated was by the control panel). When I brushed against the one by the engine the buzzer sprang into life (I'd left the ignition in the first position so I would know when things started to work). This one has a cable tie holding the two halves together, but I was able to exercise the connector sufficiently for the buzzer to stay on constantly.

 

I didn't actually start up as it was approaching 10 pm. If it doesn't start in the morning I shall be very surprised.

 

Thanks for all your suggestions. Bad connection in the end (had to be, really)

By just waggling ''excercising it,the trouble will almost certainly reoccur''Take that plug apart and clean and gently squeeze tighten the contacts slightly before plugging back together.

[Chalky]

The connectors used on the isuzu engines that I've seen are very poor and would never be considered for an automotive application. A decent connector would have an anti-back out feature for the pins, a positive mechanical latch and would also be sealed (and have a lot of other things as well). The connectors are more of a domestic grade than marine.

[Halfie]

Bizzard, you're right. I was so pleased to have found the dodgy conection that I stopped at that point (it was getting dark, after all!) I will take the connector apart tomorrow and do as you suggest.

 

Chalky, yes, I'm beginning to discover this.

[MtB]

Bizzard, you're right. I was so pleased to have found the dodgy conection that I stopped at that point (it was getting dark, after all!) I will take the connector apart tomorrow and do as you suggest.

 

Chalky, yes, I'm beginning to discover this.

 

Yeah should have got a Kelvin. No wiring to go wrong....

[bizzard]

Bizzard, you're right. I was so pleased to have found the dodgy conection that I stopped at that point (it was getting dark, after all!) I will take the connector apart tomorrow and do as you suggest.

 

Chalky, yes, I'm beginning to discover this.

To be honest i doubt very much whether you would ever need to unplug that plug apart from when it next gives trouble.

I hate unecesary bloomin plugs most of which are only there for ease of connecting up during engine installations and the like.

I'd be inclined to do away with it and just strip each wire back and twist em firmly together and preferably solder them too.

If done one at a time so's not to get em mixed up and bind them all individually with insulting tape finishing off by binding the bundle up with ''self amalgamating tape,this will make it perfectly water proof and trouble free forever more.