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Filleted chines on wide beam?


Danny1234

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The chine is a corner in the hull, so a Springer has a side, a chine, an angled bottom and a keel

 

A typical modern narrowboat has a side, a ninety degree chine and a flat bottom

 

A 'chamfered chine' isn't. It's two chines separated by a sloping face

 

Proper narrowboats have round chines

 

Richard

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Not necessarily. I used to own a Springer and the shallow chines didn't intrude into the living space at all. That's assuming a V bottom is considered as chined? :unsure: Don't some Dutch barge style NBs have chines?

 

Anyway, the point is that a slab-sided NB-style widebeam is no worse hydrodynamically than a slab-sided narrowboat. Since most people seem to be able to accept the idea of a slab-sided narrowboat, then there's no reason not to have the same (but strengthened) hull design in a wider boat.

 

 

As you say, there is absolutely no reason why not, as long as the strenght calculations are respected.

 

Most Freycinet (38/39m) barges have a 5 meter wide flat bottom, normally over (almost) the whole 28m of their hold, and are slab-sided, and are still plenty strong enough for commercial work.

 

Only the bows have a more or less hydrodynamical shape to penetrate the water, and the stern of the barges more adapted to riverwork have a well shaped swim to give the prop all the water needed.

 

When built those bottoms weren't as heavy as a NB, and were made of steel between 6 and 8 mm, depending on the yard, the Dutch and Belgium built ones were the heavier sort, and the French were better carriers because they were lighter, and had less draft with the same tonnage transported, as an example, many French barges could carry 262.5 ton with 1.8 m draft, and one of mine only 230 tons, and another 217 tons with 1.8 m draft.

 

Peter.

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The chine is a corner in the hull, so a Springer has a side, a chine, an angled bottom and a keel

 

A typical modern narrowboat has a side, a ninety degree chine and a flat bottom

 

A 'chamfered chine' isn't. It's two chines separated by a sloping face

 

Proper narrowboats have round chines

 

Richard

THE springer design with the V bottom meant less reinforcing material required.

 

Springer hulls cause less 'draw' than modern slab-sided narrow boats,

 

The only drawback with the Springer V bottom is that the boats were tender,more so than flat -bottom designs.

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THE springer design with the V bottom meant less reinforcing material required.

 

Springer hulls cause less 'draw' than modern slab-sided narrow boats,

 

The only drawback with the Springer V bottom is that the boats were tender,more so than flat -bottom designs.

They do steer nicely though as did the Harborough-Marine boats,one of which i once owned and steered well in astern too, more directionally stable in either direction than non chine boats.

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They do steer nicely though as did the Harborough-Marine boats,one of which i once owned and steered well in astern too, more directionally stable in either direction than non chine boats.

A friend had a SPRINGER 30 in the 70;s,with a 10 HP SABB,it was pleasant to steer,i recall the shell was less than 1k!

 

with engine and interior fit ,the whole boat was less than 3k...

 

It was only 1/8 th plate though,he always flinched if the boat was bumped into!

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A friend had a SPRINGER 30 in the 70;s,with a 10 HP SABB,it was pleasant to steer,i recall the shell was less than 1k!

 

with engine and interior fit ,the whole boat was less than 3k...

 

It was only 1/8 th plate though,he always flinched if the boat was bumped into!

The hulls were pretty well braced up inside though with big frame gusset plates which you had to hide in cupboards or combine with a bulkhead on fitout.

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Hello again

'Anyway, perhaps the OP can get some quotes for chined and unchined hulls and let us know. '

I will try and do so, though it won't be till June what I'm visiting various builders the probably not till July that I'm going to start getting some serious (itemised) quotes.

Meantime I will try and follow this up a bit with various builders and see if they think it's an 'extra' that would certainly cost more, or something they could/build in as part of the job, without it really affecting the price too much.

I guess you folks would know a lot more than me, ...... bit of a guess, ... maybe on a 6'6 narrowboat then adding a chine would mean more cutting/welding (are plates obtainable around 6' 6" wide), ... or maybe they use 6' and then taper out the sides. But on a wide beam 10'+, they would have to be using 2 plates anyway and maybe adding a chine is not much more work than the extra cutting/welding involved going up to around 12'.

I'll find out over the coming weeks I guess. For now I'll be adding them in, then will see if not having them would be cheaper and what the various would be builders have to say about it

Regards

Danny

Edited by Danny1234
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Any significant degree of chine will intrude into the interior space compared with a slab sided boat. This might be acceptable on a widebeam, bit could seriously constrain the interior layout on a narrow boat.

 

Not so! See my earlier post with picture of the boat Dawdler. This was a standard Arcrite hull shape and the "bottom plank" did not intrude into the cabin at all on a 6' wide base plate. This is because, by the time you take into account, two inch angles (to carry the ballast clear of the floor)five inch high steel cross bearers (to clear the slabs) and the timber floor bearers, the floor is at the top of the chine. So no loss of cabin space.

 

Arcrite staff at that time (1990) included Danny and Paul, both of whom worked for Harborough Boats in their time, so clearly there was some inheritance of the lines that that company produced. The boat in question in an overall length of 45' had a 10' bow swim and 15' stern swim the result was a boat that moved nicely through the water with very little wash.

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The chine is a corner in the hull, so a Springer has a side, a chine, an angled bottom and a keel OK

 

A typical modern narrowboat has a side, a ninety degree chine and a flat bottom OK, sometimes referred to as a hard chine.

 

A 'chamfered chine' isn't. It's two chines separated by a sloping face OK, in other words a double chine.

 

Proper narrowboats have round chines Sorry, I don't understand?

 

Richard

 

THE springer design with the V bottom meant less reinforcing material required.

 

Springer hulls cause less 'draw' than modern slab-sided narrow boats,

 

The only drawback with the Springer V bottom is that the boats were tender,more so than flat -bottom designs.

 

If you're correct and springers draw less than modern narrowboats, isn't that simply because they were made with thinner plate and so have less displacement? Surely any boat with a V bottom will have a greater maximum draught than a boat with a flat bottom, all other things being equal?

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Proper narrowboats have round chines Sorry, I don't understand?

 

This is Snipe, a Yarwood's boat for Cowburn and Cowpar

 

001big.jpg

 

She has round chines

 

Richard

Edited by RLWP
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This is Snipe, a Yarwood's boat for Cowburn and Cowpar

 

001big.jpg

 

She has round chines

 

Richard

 

Where did you get that picture?

 

Trouble with these rounded chine Narrow Boats, they do tend to roll easily..

 

Snipe-1.jpg

 

 

(same boat, same spot)

I think that is Yours truly kneeling next to the boat.

 

Tim

Edited by Timleech
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There seems to be a lot of confusion here as to the correct terminology.

 

A chine is an angle so an "unchined" hull has a round bottom.

 

A single chine is a v-bottomed boat.

 

A Narrowboat has a double chine and the boat in Richard's photo has rounded chines.

 

The "v-bottomed" Springer is actually triple chined and then you move onto the multi-chined sea-boats which eventually become smoothed, back to a round-bottomed "unchined" hull again.

 

Describling a slab sided flat-bottomed boat as "unchined" is incorrect.

Edited by carlt
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There seems to be a lot of confusion here as to the correct terminology.

 

A chine is an angle so an "unchined" hull has a round bottom.

 

A single chine is a v-bottomed boat.

 

A Narrowboat has a double chine and the boat in Richard's photo has rounded chines.

 

The "v-bottomed" Springer is actually triple chined and then you move onto the multi-chined sea-boats which eventually become smoothed, back to a round-bottomed "unchined" hull again.

 

Describling a slab sided flat-bottomed boat as "unchined" is incorrect.

Well described Carl. I tried to by mentioning multi-chine earlier.

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There seems to be a lot of confusion here as to the correct terminology.

 

A chine is an angle so an "unchined" hull has a round bottom.

 

A single chine is a v-bottomed boat.

 

A Narrowboat has a double chine and the boat in Richard's photo has rounded chines.

 

The "v-bottomed" Springer is actually triple chined and then you move onto the multi-chined sea-boats which eventually become smoothed, back to a round-bottomed "unchined" hull again.

 

Describling a slab sided flat-bottomed boat as "unchined" is incorrect.

 

& despite Richard's comment about 'proper narrow boats', the vast majority of working Narrow Boats had a (very nearly) square chine. It was a necessary result of the construction method with wooden boats, and only a very small number of steel boats were built with rounded chines.

Most long-distance working Narrow Boats were not truly slab-sided, the bottom strake or the side plating below the bottom guard was usually angled in slightly, you could class this as another chine if you were being pedantic.

Some others had rather more shape

 

image1-2-1.jpg

 

Tim

Edited by Timleech
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