Engine hours - is 6000 a lot?

[DCH]

Hi all.

I am looking at purchasing a narrowboat and would like some advice on engine hours. Basically, how many hours would a well maintained engine need to do before it would require major work on it? Is 6000 hours on a well maintained engine a lot?

I expect this is too much of a generalisation, and each engine maker has it differences, but in general, on a 6 year old boat is 6000 hours anywhere near the time to expect problems? (The engine is a Beta Marine 43bhp)

 

Any help appreciated.

 

Thanks.

[Chris Pink]

It's a lot of cruising time, at 5 hours a day it's 1200 days.

 

At this stage of its life maintenance will be key, whether it has had regular and thorough servicing.

 

Beta are the people to give you life expectancies of major moving parts but the factor pf error will be immense.

 

A well maintained diesel will go on for a long time

[David Mack]

Hi all.

I am looking at purchasing a narrowboat and would like some advice on engine hours. Basically, how many hours would a well maintained engine need to do before it would require major work on it? Is 6000 hours on a well maintained engine a lot?

I expect this is too much of a generalisation, and each engine maker has it differences, but in general, on a 6 year old boat is 6000 hours anywhere near the time to expect problems? (The engine is a Beta Marine 43bhp)

 

Any help appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

After 6000 hours at an average speed of say 30 miles per hour, your car will have done 180,000 miles, so you might expect to see some signs of old age.

 

But boat diesel engines are generally simpler and more robust than car engines. Most are derived from engines developed for industrial or plant applications where they are expected to run for several hours a day every day for years.

 

Narrowboat use is pretty light compared to this, so as long as your engine has been properly maintained and regularly serviced it should have years left in it.

 

David

[soldthehouse]

Maintenance while being a good "on paper" indicator would only tell part of the story. In the 6000hrs the potential for extreme situations increases like overheating while left ticking over in a lock on the hottest of summerdays, or frost damage in the depths of winter, you get the picture, A current evaluation by checking oil quality and the "sounds ok" factor will go along way to giving you a guide along with visuals such as oil leaks and any physical signs of abuse by butchers or desperate repairs Also the type of engine you describe is best suited to high constant revs and they dont always get this on the canals

Edited November 16, 2011 by soldthehouse

[AlanH]

After 6000 hours at an average speed of say 30 miles per hour, your car will have done 180,000 miles, so you might expect to see some signs of old age.

 

But boat diesel engines are generally simpler and more robust than car engines. Most are derived from engines developed for industrial or plant applications where they are expected to run for several hours a day every day for years.

 

Narrowboat use is pretty light compared to this, so as long as your engine has been properly maintained and regularly serviced it should have years left in it.

 

David

According to my car computer my average speed is more like 22mph which would give a figure of 132,000 miles. Not an awful lot for a modern engine. Most diesel car engines are good for at least 200,000 miles and, as you say, they sre not engineered for the amount of work expected from an industrial engine.

[GSer]

I bought my last boat with 5600 hours on the Perkins 3HD engine ran it every day for 2-3hrs and cruised two weekends a month at weekends for 12-15hrs, PLUS holidays. I owned it for 10 years and apart from a decoke i did in 2008 it was faultless apart from a little blue smoke when cold and a very slight sump oil leak. On stripping it still had the hone marks in the bores and the valves and seats just needed a light fettle on reassambly. I treated it to new injectors but that had no apparant effect. Most of the rubber on the outside needed replacing but I suspect past owners treated the engine to a coating of WD40 on a regular basis and this may have rotted the rubber hoses in the end.

 

So as others have said, for some engines 6000 hrs means it might be just about run in

[cotswoldsman]

I used to run my trucks for 3 years and would recon in that time they did about 10,000 hours. They would then be sold and most probably do another 10,000 hours. I was always told a well maintained diesel engine would do at least 15,000 hours before any major surgery.

[Keeping Up]

My Perkins MC42 engine has done about 10,000 hours so far. Apart from regular oil and filter changes, the only work it has needed have been replacement of a couple of oil seals that had worn out, and replacing the injection pump which developed a leak. It was booked in for a decoke a couple of years ago, but a long period of hard running on the Trent burned the coke off the valves and restored the compression so the decoke was cancelled. Other than that it has needed no work; at the moment (touch wood) it uses less oil than when it was new, and it gives every impression of being "just about run in".

 

Edited to add, after seeing Steelaway's comment below, I forgot to include the fact that it has had the tappets adjusted twice.

So I would say that after 6000 hours a well maintained engine should still be in almost perfect condition.

Edited November 16, 2011 by Keeping Up

[Bob18]

Six thousand hours is a young to mid life engine depending how its been looked after and what work its done. As Allan implies modern small engines like to be worked. It should be good for at least two or three times that number of hours MORE than its done so far, provided its looked after and not abused by over heating or continuous under working.

[steelaway]

Hi all.

I am looking at purchasing a narrowboat and would like some advice on engine hours. Basically, how many hours would a well maintained engine need to do before it would require major work on it? Is 6000 hours on a well maintained engine a lot?

I expect this is too much of a generalisation, and each engine maker has it differences, but in general, on a 6 year old boat is 6000 hours anywhere near the time to expect problems? (The engine is a Beta Marine 43bhp)

 

Any help appreciated.

 

Thanks.

 

 

 

Hi

 

If it has not been done I would expect to have to service the injectors (£50 each) and maybe even the fuel pump (£150)

Also the tappets will have needed checking by this number of hours.

There will be a service schedule manual for this engine.

 

Alex

[bizzard]

A friend of mines Kubota Beta has done 54,000 hrs most of which is charging batteries.On 2 lift pumps and one set of injectors,and the odd oil and filters change.

[GSer]

A friend of mines Kubota Beta has done 54,000 hrs most of which is charging batteries.On 2 lift pumps and one set of injectors,and the odd oil and filters change.

 

 

Totals to over 6 years of continuous 24hr running!! I think I may have moored near him once

[Athy]

Totals to over 6 years of continuous 24hr running!! I think I may have moored near him once

Neat!

[mrsmelly]

Six thousand hours is a young to mid life engine depending how its been looked after and what work its done. As Allan implies modern small engines like to be worked. It should be good for at least two or three times that number of hours MORE than its done so far, provided its looked after and not abused by over heating or continuous under working.

 

agreed. I wold say it is just run in. I have had 2 beta engines my last a 43 it had done 4000 hours when I sold it and used no oil or water ever. There was no smoke of any kind ever and it was a completely oil and water tight unit. The hire fleets I have worked on with various engines do many more hours of complete abuse than that. In short 6000 hours is nowt.

[bizzard]

Totals to over 6 years of continuous 24hr running!! I think I may have moored near him once

I did before i new him,just getting dark 6pm,tied up behind him,sat down cat on knee and cup of tea, he starts it up.I had to spend the evening sitting on the toilet with the door shut until 11pm. He did become a customer so can't complain too much.

 

I'm almost certain he's not a forum member so,boat name is ''Zendu'' keep clear.

Edited November 16, 2011 by bizzard

[Dorman]

Hi all.

I am looking at purchasing a narrowboat and would like some advice on engine hours. Basically, how many hours would a well maintained engine need to do before it would require major work on it? Is 6000 hours on a well maintained engine a lot?

I expect this is too much of a generalisation, and each engine maker has it differences, but in general, on a 6 year old boat is 6000 hours anywhere near the time to expect problems? (The engine is a Beta Marine 43bhp)

 

Any help appreciated.

 

Thanks.

We had a perkins 4108 engine in our first narrowboat which had done 1200 hours and produced a lot of blue smoke which seemed odd as that is such a low number of hours for a 16 year old. I asked about and the boat didnt go very far apparently and found out it had a belt driven 240v gen on it (the mounting frame was still visible) and hence low load and stationary use had resulted in bore glazing. I was much more concerned after that seeing low hours on an engine in any boat.

Compression test should indicate a problem in that area.

Simon

[Neil2]

A few years ago I went to look at a Renault Espace which had done 550,000 miles. I rang the garage first as I thought it must be a misprint but no, they explained it had been an airport taxi from new, hence the colossal mileage. It had a full service history and whilst it didn't exactly drive like new, you could have taken a nought off the mileage figure and no-one would have suspected anything.

 

I had a work mate once who had an Austin Montego diesel with 350,000 miles on the clock and he was considering his first engine rebuild.

 

Doesn't have to be a diesel either - what about the American Volvo P1800 that has almost 3 million miles on it?

 

How it's been used and how it's been serviced is way more important than hours/mileage.

[MikeV]

I remember at an OwnerShips meeting once someone asking what the average life of an engine was so their syndicate could budget for a new one. Ownerships, who at that time had about 100 boats, said that in their experience it varied from 5,000 - 21,000 hours. IIRC the 5,000 was an exception - a duff engine from new. Most of the earlier boats, where they had the most experience were, I believe, BMC 1.8s.

 

I was once one talking to a fellow boater about the fact that I had to have the drive plate replaced after 2800 hours on a Beta 1903 and it turned out he had the same age of engine, same driveplate, and he had done 31,000 hours. If you look after them they go on for a loooong time!

[Bobbybass]

My beta 43 has done 7500. It starts on the button...doesn't smoke...and uses zero oil between services.

I did check the tappets recently...and spoke to Adrian at Beta for the clearances. He said if any of thenm were 'out' it was more likely that I had measured them wrong !

My neighbours Beta 43 has done 12,500 and is much the same as mine.

Down to servcing ....200 hours engine and 700 hours for gearbox and fuel filters in my case.

The Beta manual says ...250 hours engone and 750 for PRM160 gearbox.

 

I am familiar with this engone in Plant business....as its the same unit we had on mini diggers and generators.

At steady and continuous speeds...( similar to boat use)...there is very little correlation between service life in boats and equivalent life in...say a car...

 

I would 'expect'..(actual expectation may vary from description )..my engine will go on for many years.

[Nickhlx]

My beta 43 has done 7500. It starts on the button...doesn't smoke...and uses zero oil between services.

I did check the tappets recently...and spoke to Adrian at Beta for the clearances. He said if any of thenm were 'out' it was more likely that I had measured them wrong !

My neighbours Beta 43 has done 12,500 and is much the same as mine.

Down to servcing ....200 hours engine and 700 hours for gearbox and fuel filters in my case.

The Beta manual says ...250 hours engone and 750 for PRM160 gearbox.

 

I am familiar with this engone in Plant business....as its the same unit we had on mini diggers and generators.

At steady and continuous speeds...( similar to boat use)...there is very little correlation between service life in boats and equivalent life in...say a car...

 

I would 'expect'..(actual expectation may vary from description )..my engine will go on for many years.

 

Me too - a 2 litre engine producing 43 bhp peak (and usually about half that) is a fraction compared to a car engine or bike engine. With current oils being very good, any good engine design should now last decades, assuming the vital regular maintenance, and not being subjected to abuse...

 

Nick

[matty40s]

My gardner has over 3000 hours on the clock,however, the clock was only installed in 2008 and the engine built in 1943, so perhaps it is slightly under-houred. oil change every 400 hours.

My skoda engine(10 yrs) 1.9tdi has just passed 275000 miles, and with regular timing belt changes and services should be good for a few miles more yet.

[DCH]

Many thanks to everyone who has responded to my request. I didn't expect such a massive discussion.

So I think I can conclude that providing the engine sounds ok and is not dripping oil and billowing smoke, then it should be good for many more thousands of hours with regular servicing.

Cheers everyone!!

[bizzard]

Many thanks to everyone who has responded to my request. I didn't expect such a massive discussion.

So I think I can conclude that providing the engine sounds ok and is not dripping oil and billowing smoke, then it should be good for many more thousands of hours with regular servicing.

Cheers everyone!!

The best test for a diesel engine is to arrive on a cold morning,early, before the vendor has had a chance of starting it before you get there.

If it starts easily when stone cold there's not much wrong with it, compression wise anyway.

[Bob18]

Nicely summed up Bizzard.

Then get it warmed up, stop it from medium to high revs (just turn the key or pull the stop) for a couple of minutes and re-start and look for any trace of blue smoke as it starts - there shouldn't be any.

(Grey or black are to be expected)

Edited November 17, 2011 by Bob18

[Naughty Cal]

Nicely summed up Bizzard.

Then get it warmed up, stop it from medium to high revs (just turn the key or pull the stop) for a couple of minutes and re-start and look for any trace of blue smoke as it starts - there shouldn't be any.

(Grey or black are to be expected)

 

Why would you want to stop the engine at mid to high revs? Surely that will do more harm than good