ancient boats

[isail]

whats the oldest canal in britain,?

 

when was it built ?

[Laurence Hogg]

Buy a canal history book and find out, or do some proper research.

[twbm]

Contentious question: True canal or river made navigable? Popularly attributed to the Duke of Bridgewater circa 1761 but others will be along soon with alternative contenders.

 

Buy a canal history book and find out, or do some proper research.

 

Harsh but fair .....

 

Edited to add: although if others take LH's stance maybe they won't be along later.

Edited July 22, 2011 by twbm

[john6767]

Being slightly more generous, why don't you have a look on Wikipedia, a good starting point being History of the British canal system

[David Schweizer]

whats the oldest canal in britain,?

 

when was it built ?

Is the Sock Puppet at it again?

[Derek R.]

whats the oldest canal in britain,?

 

when was it built ?

 

Ask a Roman.

[Pluto]

Being slightly more generous, why don't you have a look on Wikipedia, a good starting point being History of the British canal system

I wouldn't rely upon Wikipedia as the article is based upon older sources of which most are not particularly thoughtful, repeating information which has been shown to be incorrect, and are very insular in their coverage. But then, you get what you pay for....

[magpie patrick]

It really does depend on how you define it. The Fossdyke is Roman in origin, but other than being in the same place it is doubtful that anything about it today is Roman, and it wouldn't have had a lock at Torksey in Roman times. The Exeter canal was built in in the 1560's, but has been heavily modified and extended several times, although even the canal you see today dates back to 1701, making it pretty old.

 

For true canals the Newry Canal in Northern Ireland comes next, being opened in 1741, whilst not in England, it is in the UK (Northern Ireland), and next came the St Helens Canal, the first Industrial Canal in England, opening in 1757. This is often missed because the Act was for a river navigation on the Sankey Brook, and gave power to build "Collateral Cuts", so they built one long Collateral Cut from Sankey Bridges to St Helens, only using the brook for water supply

 

The Bridgewater Canal opened from Worsley to Manchester in 1761, but arguably it started the canal age, as it was the one that caught the imagination of entrepreneurs and got them asking Brindley to survey others

[Naughty Cal]

It really does depend on how you define it. The Fossdyke is Roman in origin, but other than being in the same place it is doubtful that anything about it today is Roman, and it wouldn't have had a lock at Torksey in Roman times. The Exeter canal was built in in the 1560's, but has been heavily modified and extended several times, although even the canal you see today dates back to 1701, making it pretty old.

 

 

The Fossditch still retains the Romans love of straight lines

[Laurence Hogg]

Contentious question: True canal or river made navigable? Popularly attributed to the Duke of Bridgewater circa 1761 but others will be along soon with alternative contenders.

 

 

 

Harsh but fair .....

 

Edited to add: although if others take LH's stance maybe they won't be along later.

 

Yes a bit harsh but for good reason. There are a number of us in the "specialist" field who get these "one liners" coming at us a bit too often. I get a number of emails a week with questions such as "what can you tell me about Barlows", "how many forecabin boats were there?". These even come in through ebay's "ask a question system". To answer these would take up a fair time of my working week and for what? The question from this thread could have been answered in the same time as it took to post using Google! I know I am not alone on CWDF in that these silly posts arent amusing when the answers are at the fingertips of anyone capable of using a keyboard. If someone is doing serious research then the start out question would be or should be more detailed.

[kitman]

Yes a bit harsh but for good reason. There are a number of us in the "specialist" field who get these "one liners" coming at us a bit too often.

Roll over laurence, you love it really

[twbm]

Yes a bit harsh but for good reason. There are a number of us in the "specialist" field who get these "one liners" coming at us a bit too often. I get a number of emails a week with questions such as "what can you tell me about Barlows", "how many forecabin boats were there?". These even come in through ebay's "ask a question system". To answer these would take up a fair time of my working week and for what? The question from this thread could have been answered in the same time as it took to post using Google! I know I am not alone on CWDF in that these silly posts arent amusing when the answers are at the fingertips of anyone capable of using a keyboard. If someone is doing serious research then the start out question would be or should be more detailed.

 

OK - I see your point, but if it's too much trouble for you personally to impart all the knowledge you are burdened with then just don't answer.

[Guest]

OK - I see your point, but if it's too much trouble for you personally to impart all the knowledge you are burdened with then just don't answer.

I tend to agree. We could all take a supercilious attitude, declare all questions as silly or time wasting, and nobody would answer any questions. Close forums down, job done.

 

If anybody dislikes a question; ignore it. Simple.

[magpie patrick]

Yes a bit harsh but for good reason. There are a number of us in the "specialist" field who get these "one liners" coming at us a bit too often. I get a number of emails a week with questions such as "what can you tell me about Barlows", "how many forecabin boats were there?". These even come in through ebay's "ask a question system". To answer these would take up a fair time of my working week and for what? The question from this thread could have been answered in the same time as it took to post using Google! I know I am not alone on CWDF in that these silly posts arent amusing when the answers are at the fingertips of anyone capable of using a keyboard. If someone is doing serious research then the start out question would be or should be more detailed.

 

It would take you hours on Google to compile the answer I gave, and I never once looked at Google

 

Arrogant? Me? Very probably

 

informed and willing to share my knowledge? That's how you get employed by Heritage Lottery Fund

 

No Good reason, sorry Laurence, there are a number of "us" in the "specialist" field, and this one of us will answer any question going, it's what draws newbies in

[Derek R.]

If someone wanted to know something specific about the history of the canals and their infrastructure, and they could not find it through some fairly basic research using 'engines', then requests through forums such as this would indeed - and should prove fruitful. But the questions as asked, are asked in such a way as to show that the simplest kind of research elsewhere would have answered them. If isail had a real interest in discovering the answers, would they not have done that basic research, and if it is a genuine question, would they not have come back and perhaps better quantified their question?

 

To have popped up with one post, with such a question, might indicate the OP to be either a juvenile, or a troll, hence the somewhat abrupt responses from certain parties. A genuine interest is usually followed up is it not? Newbies are welcome - where is the newbie? Frightened off - or found out?

[magpie patrick]

I've spent the last two days in part at the Cotswold Canals Visitor Centre, where wide eyed innocents wander in and ask the daftest of questions. I am not a volunteer, I manage part of their funding. What surprised the volunteers was that I was one of them, a canal enthusiast. The attitude expressed in some of the responses to this question was not that of the enthusiast, it was that of the know it all. This is also a visitor centre of sorts, and it is quite possible that isail was doing the virtual equivalent of walking into the Cotswold Canals Visitor Centre.

 

I don't care what Isail's motives were, I ENJOYED ANSWERING THE QUESTION AS BEST I COULD, those volunteers in Stroud do the same, enjoy answering dumb questions, and enthusing on their subject, and it's infectious, people then join up, whereas the grumpy approach send people away.

 

Laurence may be a canal specialist, but his grumpy approach does not put him in the category of enthusiast, it's almost as if he sees his specialism as a curse.

Edited July 23, 2011 by magpie patrick

[Laurence Hogg]

I've spent the last two days in part at the Cotswold Canals Visitor Centre, where wide eyed innocents wander in and ask the daftest of questions. I am not a volunteer, I manage part of their funding. What surprised the volunteers was that I was one of them, a canal enthusiast. The attitude expressed in some of the responses to this question was not that of the enthusiast, it was that of the know it all. This is also a visitor centre of sorts, and it is quite possible that isail was doing the virtual equivalent of walking into the Cotswold Canals Visitor Centre.

 

I don't care what Isail's motives were, I ENJOYED ANSWERING THE QUESTION AS BEST I COULD, those volunteers in Stroud do the same, enjoy answering dumb questions, and enthusing on their subject, and it's infectious, people then join up, whereas the grumpy approach send people away.

 

Laurence may be a canal specialist, but his grumpy approach does not put him in the category of enthusiast, it's almost as if he sees his specialism as a curse.

 

I totally refute your comments. In fact I consider them insulting. Having spent the last two days getting pontoons out of Birmingham for a school in Brownhills I am fairly certain I am an enthusiast. The kids from the primary school concerned asked better placed questions than this one. Your people chose to walk to and into your centre, showing commited interest. These "one liners" send mesaages from I-phones and similar, cannot spell properly most of the time and have little deep interest, and almost never follow up. Although being a canal "specialist" in certain fields I class myself as a professional entusiast (BW call us Key enthusiast - dont know why) as I make my living from the interest and associated offshoots, I also run CanalScape-BCN with my colleauges which has no external funding, yet benefits the community.

I am not a retired person with time on my hands, but I am more than happy to contribute to enquires generated from serious sources if that information is here to be given. I add regulary to posts on this forum often giving out information which is not available readily from other sources.

[richardf]

 

 

No Good reason, sorry Laurence, there are a number of "us" in the "specialist" field, and this one of us will answer any question going, it's what draws newbies in

 

Great attitude

[AlanH]

I totally refute your comments. In fact I consider them insulting. Having spent the last two days getting pontoons out of Birmingham for a school in Brownhills I am fairly certain I am an enthusiast. The kids from the primary school concerned asked better placed questions than this one. Your people chose to walk to and into your centre, showing commited interest. These "one liners" send mesaages from I-phones and similar, cannot spell properly most of the time and have little deep interest, and almost never follow up. Although being a canal "specialist" in certain fields I class myself as a professional entusiast (BW call us Key enthusiast - dont know why) as I make my living from the interest and associated offshoots, I also run CanalScape-BCN with my colleauges which has no external funding, yet benefits the community.

I am not a retired person with time on my hands, but I am more than happy to contribute to enquires generated from serious sources if that information is here to be given. I add regulary to posts on this forum often giving out information which is not available readily from other sources.

Pots and kettles eh? Why on earth should this forum not be the first place of call when trying to answer a canal related question? Your curt and unhelpful reply will not encourage newbies to join us.

Edited July 23, 2011 by AlanH

[Derek R.]

Can I suggest the two Trumpet players face the audience, and not each other.

 

Personally, I feel the thread title confounds the OP's original to the point of creating suspicion as to sincerity. But even that's being a bit excessively judgemental.

 

A battle of the enthusiasts, was that the intention? Seems to have worked, and maybe someone is sitting back laughing their heads off.

[Chertsey]

Pots and kettles eh? Why on earth should this forum not be the first place of call when trying to answer a canal related question? Your curt and unhelpful reply will not encourage newbies to join us.

There is a difference between poor spelling and typing errors. Neither necessarily has a bearing on the validity or otherwise of a question but when it's clearly the result of carelessness (rather than, say, dyslexia, and yes, it is possible to tell the difference) you do have to wonder how serious a poster is, and how much (or little) respect they're showing to to those people whose opinions and knowledge they seek to benefit from, if they can't be bothered to take a bit of trouble over writing their question.

[Guest]

I am astonished. Somebody asks a simple question, and it kicks off. Bad spelling? Poor punctuation? Does it really matter in the grand scheme of things? We might all be dead tomorrow. Chill out!

 

I was always taught that there is no such thing as a stupid question.

[Max Sinclair]

Can I suggest the two Trumpet players face the audience, and not each other.

 

Personally, I feel the thread title confounds the OP's original to the point of creating suspicion as to sincerity. But even that's being a bit excessively judgemental.

 

A battle of the enthusiasts, was that the intention? Seems to have worked, and maybe someone is sitting back laughing their heads off.

On a practical note if you would like to experience an old canal with timber frame locks, self closing gates, rising flood stop gates all as a result of Brindleys experiments ( he built the first lock in the grounds of his Stafford New Hall home ) then come and enjoy the Droitwich Barge Canal while it is still peaceful.His lock on to the Severn was a great 1768 construction built under difficult tide conditions.

[Graham_Robinson]

On a practical note if you would like to experience an old canal with timber frame locks, self closing gates, rising flood stop gates all as a result of Brindleys experiments ( he built the first lock in the grounds of his Stafford New Hall home ) then come and enjoy the Droitwich Barge Canal while it is still peaceful.His lock on to the Severn was a great 1768 construction built under difficult tide conditions.

 

 

Great plug :D When's the DVD out?

[the grinch]

It would take you hours on Google to compile the answer I gave, and I never once looked at Google

 

Arrogant? Me? Very probably

 

informed and willing to share my knowledge? That's how you get employed by Heritage Lottery Fund

 

No Good reason, sorry Laurence, there are a number of "us" in the "specialist" field, and this one of us will answer any question going, it's what draws newbies in

 

i would give you a greenie for that response but i've used my quota for today! but if i knew the answer i too would of imparted it!

for what its worth i would think it was the romans that first canalised our fair land!