Railway Transfer Basin

[Speedwheel]

Someone mentioned to me that there was an old Railway Transfer basin near Queens Head. A couple of minutes on Google earth and I found it so last weekend went to have a look.

 

The swing bridge itself didn't move when I tried it but looked in ok-ish condition so I recon could be opened. There was a fairly new BW sign telling people about correct/safe use of the bridge so it is obviously not out of bounds as far as they are concerned. The channel down was a good depth, certainly enough to get a boat through, but under the bridge was very shallow.

 

Anyone got a pair of chest waders, a shovel and a boat in that area? (and a sense of adventure/humour)

 

Location

 

Spleling Edit.

 

Edited March 16, 2011 by Speedwheel

[the grinch]

nice pics

looks like a good location for offline moorings when the monty opens properly

[Speedwheel]

nice pics

looks like a good location for offline moorings when the monty opens properly

 

No chance - it's a bloody nature reserve apparently

 

Called Rednal Basin BTW.

[the grinch]

No chance - it's a bloody nature reserve apparently

 

Called Rednal Basin BTW.

 

the monty has more nature reserve than navigation!! the whole of the weston arm is one too!!

[casper ghost]

I walked up the arm a bit last summer after the Monty rally. That swing bridge wouldn't budge but it obviously does as the last time I went down there was a small BW boat moored up the arm, the other side of the bridge?

Gary

[Josher]

Went to look myself a six months ago - found the following photograph on the internet, and an old article from the Indy ...

 

 

 

The precious life of an overgrown canal

 

When waterways are restored, boats must leave space for pond life. Christian Dymon reports

 

Saturday, 21 September 1996 Independent

 

Save for the wooden posts of a disused jetty and the decaying hull of a canal boat now shrouded in reed sweet-grass, little alludes to the once thriving life of the Rednal Basin, a few miles from Oswestry in Shropshire.

 

In Victorian times this half-acre pool of water and its adjacent railway line exemplified the term "integrated transport system". Goods were loaded on and off boats waiting in the small basin and from there it was a 200- yard journey down an arm of the Montgomery Canal into the canal itself.

 

For the last few years the place has had a new life as a nature reserve, one of 17 which will eventually run along the 35 miles of the canal from Frankton Junction, where it meets the Llangollen Canal, through Welshpool to Newtown in Powys.

 

The creation of different sized nature reserves on the Montgomery Canal was agreed 10 years ago by British Waterways and the then Nature Conservancy Council.

 

It was one way of tackling a sensitive environmental issue which arises whenever canals with stretches that are designated Sites of Special Scientific Interest (SSSIs) are restored: what to do with the diversity of flora and fauna, often including rare species, that have taken hold in the waterway during its semi-derelict state?

 

The idea on the Montgomery Canal is that, by physically moving many species from the waterway into the "off-line" nature reserves located alongside it, submerged and floating aquatic plants which might otherwise be affected by large numbers of boats will at least be secured for posterity, although only time will tell how they adapt to their new environments.

 

Andrew Hearle, English Nature's conservation officer for Shropshire, says: "While you can physically move individual plants, there is no guarantee that the nature conservation interest for which a site was designated SSSI will be maintained in these newly created reserves. The whole aquatic ecosystem, the relationship of different plant and animal communities to each other, will have to be taken into account in any future designation."

 

Nearly half the length of the Montgomery Canal comprises three separate SSSIs. Various species of pondweed, including reddish pondweed, fennel pondweed, curled pondweed and small pondweed; floating water-plantain; yellow water-lily; frogbit; water-violet; greater duckweed; reed canary- grass; flowering rush; and certain scarce varieties of damselfly and dragonfly are found in a number of places.

 

"The pace of canal restoration is accelerating with more money available from the National Lottery, from Europe and from regeneration grants. The challenge is to restore canals for navigation at the same time as maintaining their nature conservation value," says Jonathan Briggs, a British Waterways conservation ecologist .

 

"Whether British Waterways would now adopt the Montgomery solution - which was agreed 10 years ago - for other canals is open to question," Mr Briggs adds. "These days we would be more sympathetic to a solution that enabled wildlife to survive in the main channel, even if it meant limiting the number of boats. This would also avoid the high cost of off- line reserves."

 

On Saturday, 21 September, in the canal's 200th anniversary year, a flotilla of vessels will herald the reopening, after 52 years, of a two-and-a-half- mile section of the Montgomery Canal in the West Midlands, stretching from Perry Aqueduct to Aston Locks.

 

Restoration has cost pounds 2.5m, money that has been channelled through Shropshire County Council from English Partnerships, the Government's regeneration agency. The new stretch will bring to 17 miles the total length which has so far been restored on both sides of the border. Rednal Basin, which had to be partially dredged in February this year because of a build-up of silt, lies just off the newly restored section, and so does another nature reserve at Aston Locks. Both are linked hydrologically to the canal, so ensuring a steady supply of suitable water.

 

Unlike Rednal, which already had some aquatic plant life and is part of an SSSI, the reserve at Aston Locks was created from a "green field" site by volunteers from the Inland Waterways Association's Waterway Recovery Group.

 

A water channel one-third of a mile long was dug out to take the transferred aquatic plants; on the dry areas there are alder, willow, oak, cherry and birch trees. So far the site has not been developed far enough to be designated an SSSI.

 

The two reserves have cost around pounds 100,000. In Wales, at what will be the biggest of the 17 Montgomery Canal reserves - the already SSSI-designated Guilsfield arm - more than pounds lm will eventually be spent, much of it on relining the arm of the canal and reinforcing the bank. At Welshpool a short section of new canal has been dug out for the use of boats, while the old channel has been left as an "on-line" reserve.

 

"The creation of these nature reserves is the first time anything like this has been attempted on this scale," says Andrew Law, district officer for the Countryside Council for Wales. "The intention is that when the reserves meet the appropriate criteria they will be designated as SSSIs."

 

Over on the other side of England, a different solution to a similar issue is being worked out. At the end of this month a draft report will be completed, after consultations between British Waterways and other bodies, concerning the future of the Pocklington Canal near York.

 

The nine-mile-long canal is navigable only from the River Derwent in the west to Melbourne, four miles to the east. Most of the canal comes within three SSSIs, two of which also form internationally important sites for migratory wildfowl.

 

"The intention is to draw up a 10-year management plan for the canal, and so avoid conflicts which might arise between different parties," says Keith Boswell, waterway manager for North Yorkshire Navigations.

 

"The management plan will look to retain the special nature conservation interest of the canal, and also consider what would be required to reopen the final five miles for navigation."

[Tim Lewis]

No chance - it's a bloody nature reserve apparently

 

Called Rednal Basin BTW.

 

So what would you rather cruise past, a nature reserve or a marina?

 

Tim

[Derek R.]

Such is the desire to preserve Nature I do at times wonder for what purpose. Natural wetlands and fenlands, shore line and estuary are often kept sacrosanct, yet where they have not, there has been in the past as in the present, a change in use that has benefited all in terms of industrial and manufacturing industries, and sadly pollution as well. Where did the bats in Greywell tunnel live when the tunnel was in use? Where did they live before it was built? Now the bats have somewhere to roost, are we getting crowds of visitors to Greywell to see the bats and perchance spend money in the local shop/Post Office? No, all is asleep. Left to the locals to walk their dogs along the towpath thereabouts and commute to work from the now dormitory village.

 

With such a basin at Rednal, there seems on the face of it, an opportunity to allow nature to return and encompass an area that hitherto it had receded from in the march for industrialisation and commodity movements. Where did Nature go in that period of movement and activity? Not far away for certain, for just as surely if the Black Country Museum would close and be left derelict, in a few short years Nature would return and encompass all that has been achieved for the benefit of those who work there and the visitors who gain enjoyment and some education.

 

However, Rednal basin is not accessible by road and is in effect canal and railway locked away from access. Hardly a site that could be developed for future residential or cruising use. Interesting to note its whereabouts and the former history, but as a potential tourist honeypot - Nil chance. As a secluded hideaway for a few - just as little. A place where Nature must ultimately rule once again. I do find it a little hypocritical when I read of mankind managing Nature. In general it usually ends up as mankind managing something to his own tastes, which can vary greatly, and usually involve conflict and objection from other elements of mankind. Without any commercial basis, such Nature Management is doomed to survive only at the behest of volunteers. Step forward the next generation of volunteers to maintain something that no-one will get to visit.

 

Rednal Basin R.I.P.

 

 

 

Looks nice around Maesbury.

Edited March 17, 2011 by Derek R.

[Speedwheel]

So what would you rather cruise past, a nature reserve or a marina?

 

Tim

 

As I understand it, there were/are a number of designated nature reserves along the canal. These were set up due to the concern of environmentalists about the rare water dwelling plant life that may suffer as a result of resuming navigation on the canal. This basin was one of those reserves.

 

The picture Josher showed above shows it all nicely cleared. For these water plant species to survive they are going to need light and so the reserve will have to be managed to keep the trees from shadowing it and to prevent leaves falling into the water an smothering the plants.

 

Empty and unmanaged land of this type, in this area will naturally, over time, revert to mixed woodland. This is what it is doing. In order to maintain the environment required for these plants, that the environmentalists have deemed to be so special, human intervention is required to prevent this natural process from happening. It seems to me that this has not been happening so it is no longer a nature reserve it is just a piece of abandoned land with an old canal cutting in it.

 

Personally, I would rather the industrial archaeology of the basin was respected and it made possible for boats to access it. It's size and location mean that it could not practically or economically be a marina, merely a place for boats to access and or stop temporarily. But, if it is going to be a nature reserve, then those who insisted on it becoming so should take some responsibility for their demands and look after it for their desired purpose.

 

Currently it is neither be preserved for the ecological or archaeological importance that it has.

 

As Derek says, R.I.P.

 

 

Looks nice around Maesbury.

 

It is. The new cafe they built futher down the canal does very good scones too.

[magpie patrick]

snip...Where did the bats in Greywell tunnel live when the tunnel was in use? Where did they live before it was built? ...Snip

 

I've picked this out, not because I wish to criticise (I don't, and your post was a very well rounded and succinct statement of the position regarding Rednal basin) but because it deserves an answer

 

The bats almost certainly lived in Greywell Tunnel when it was in use, and would do again if it were restored. The problem with most nature conservation (and one the conservationists don't like to admit) is it is the restoration that does the damage, not the subsequent navigation. There are several canal tunnels in use (Saddington being one) where bats live, but they tend to get driven away when heavy plant comes in to fix the roof fall

 

There are even bats in the bridge that has replaced Armitage Tunnel, and at a recent meeting I had a bat conservationist enthusing about canal restoration because it would recreate a corridor for bats to move down

[Derek R.]

Patrick, I think that is absolutely correct. The passage of wildlife, people and even machines (motorways are havens for wildlife off the carriageways) can live in harmony, and this can be seen in any garden. But bring in the chainsaw and Kubota . . . .

 

Perhaps the best place for constructive Nature Conservancy is the garden and unploughed headlands. Hedgerows, and for Bats the avenues of trees and water, are precisely as you say - corridors for wildlife. They provide both cover and a source of food supply.

[avonside1563]

Likewise, railway lines are also thought to be corridors for nature as the ground between the lines and the fence is not managed very heavily and hence allows for all sorts of wild flowers and wildlife to live virtually undisturbed.

[Pluto]

I am still pushing for a management plan to control the trees around Bingley 5-rise, and most people, when the problem of too many trees is explained, are usually supportive of cutting back some trees so that the canal structures can be seen as they would have been throughout most of their history. Balancing the management of the built compared to the natural environment needs more informed discussion.

Getting back to the original post, where else were there railway interchanges, besides the best-known ones on the BCN. On the L&LC, besides coal tips, there are remains at Niffany, near Skipton, a possible site just above the bottom lock at Blackburn, and one at the 21st lock at Wigan. Several loco sheds also had their water from the canal - at Bank Hall, Rose Grove and Leeds.

[the grinch]

josher has found an interesting picture there!

it goes to show that keeping boats out isn't the answer as the basin is looking stagnant in the later pictures taken by speedwell

unless there is flow of some sort then all that will happen is silting and stagnation, the wildlife will then depart pretty rapidly into the main canal and the vegetation will become brambles etc within a short while. very short sighted in my mind

[Timleech]

I am still pushing for a management plan to control the trees around Bingley 5-rise, and most people, when the problem of too many trees is explained, are usually supportive of cutting back some trees so that the canal structures can be seen as they would have been throughout most of their history. Balancing the management of the built compared to the natural environment needs more informed discussion.

Getting back to the original post, where else were there railway interchanges, besides the best-known ones on the BCN. On the L&LC, besides coal tips, there are remains at Niffany, near Skipton, a possible site just above the bottom lock at Blackburn, and one at the 21st lock at Wigan. Several loco sheds also had their water from the canal - at Bank Hall, Rose Grove and Leeds.

 

Preston Brook.

There was a siding into the 'Railway Shed' (the one at the Runcorn end of the complex), I think there was also some sort of interchange siding on the Preston Brook arm near to Cotton's Bridge.

 

Tim

 

Edit - of course there was the tramway interchange at Walton Summit, in fact when I first saw these pics it reminded me in a distant sort of way of how Walton Summit looked 45 years ago

 

Tim

Edited March 18, 2011 by Timleech

[hmallett]

I'm quite familiar with Rednal Basin. Wile in some ways it's sad to see it neglected and unusable, in reality it's not accessible by car, so has very limited scope to be used by boats I think. Besides, the railway line that goes right by it is the Wrexham - London line (I think), so I imagine it's not the quietest place on the Monty!

[the grinch]

any good for trainspotting?

[Speedwheel]

in reality it's not accessible by car, so has very limited scope to be used by boats I think.

 

My local NCP car park has good vehicle access but also limited scope for boats. Rednal basin has a canal running to it which I believe is ideal for boats - not cars though, unless you are Scottish and it's very cold.

 

Tongue firmly in cheek BTW.

 

http://www.canalrestoration.org.uk seems to have a bit of a spam problem!

 

Yes it is quite loud when the trains go by. I don't really know the requirements for trainspotting but I assume there is a name or number you have to record, which might be difficult given to speed the ones I saw were going.

Edited March 18, 2011 by Speedwheel

[the grinch]

I don't really know the requirements for trainspotting but I assume there is a name or number you have to record, which might be difficult given to speed the ones I saw were going.

 

you'll have to be quick then!! LoL

[Pluto]

Preston Brook.

There was a siding into the 'Railway Shed' (the one at the Runcorn end of the complex), I think there was also some sort of interchange siding on the Preston Brook arm near to Cotton's Bridge.

 

Tim

 

Edit - of course there was the tramway interchange at Walton Summit, in fact when I first saw these pics it reminded me in a distant sort of way of how Walton Summit looked 45 years ago

 

Tim

Careful Tim, You're showing your age! By the way, I was looking at a Harry Arnold photo of Charlie Atkins on Mendip at Stretford in the late 1960s. It looked like Edith moored in the background. Did you keep her there?

[Timleech]

Careful Tim, You're showing your age! By the way, I was looking at a Harry Arnold photo of Charlie Atkins on Mendip at Stretford in the late 1960s. It looked like Edith moored in the background. Did you keep her there?

 

No, Sale (Cruising Club!!), then latterly Preston Brook.

I do have a picture of Charlie passing us at Worsley though, 1965 or 1966.

 

Tim

[Josher]

Interesting thread. I should have put the link in for the earlier photograph, Secret Shropshire Here.

 

It does seem a pity that you have to hack through the undergrowth simply to find out what is there though.

 

My photographic efforts from last year here:

 

 

 

 

I can see why people say it is isolated!

 

[Tiny]

Such is the desire to preserve Nature I do at times wonder for what purpose. Natural wetlands and fenlands, shore line and estuary are often kept sacrosanct, yet where they have not, there has been in the past as in the present, a change in use that has benefited all in terms of industrial and manufacturing industries, and sadly pollution as well. Where did the bats in Greywell tunnel live when the tunnel was in use? Where did they live before it was built? Now the bats have somewhere to roost, are we getting crowds of visitors to Greywell to see the bats and perchance spend money in the local shop/Post Office? No, all is asleep. Left to the locals to walk their dogs along the towpath thereabouts and commute to work from the now dormitory village.

 

With such a basin at Rednal, there seems on the face of it, an opportunity to allow nature to return and encompass an area that hitherto it had receded from in the march for industrialisation and commodity movements. Where did Nature go in that period of movement and activity? Not far away for certain, for just as surely if the Black Country Museum would close and be left derelict, in a few short years Nature would return and encompass all that has been achieved for the benefit of those who work there and the visitors who gain enjoyment and some education.

 

However, Rednal basin is not accessible by road and is in effect canal and railway locked away from access. Hardly a site that could be developed for future residential or cruising use. Interesting to note its whereabouts and the former history, but as a potential tourist honeypot - Nil chance. As a secluded hideaway for a few - just as little. A place where Nature must ultimately rule once again. I do find it a little hypocritical when I read of mankind managing Nature. In general it usually ends up as mankind managing something to his own tastes, which can vary greatly, and usually involve conflict and objection from other elements of mankind. Without any commercial basis, such Nature Management is doomed to survive only at the behest of volunteers. Step forward the next generation of volunteers to maintain something that no-one will get to visit.

 

Rednal Basin R.I.P.

 

 

 

Looks nice around Maesbury.

 

Futher towards Frankton is an aqueduct and nearby is a seat. Moored nearby we noticed an old chap sat on the seat enjoying the peace as this spot is a mile from the nearest road by towpath. Enter a helicopter racing up and down the canal.

 

The helicopter is obviously going to land in a field and it does on the seat side. It's a police copter and to prove it out gets a copper who is obviously a car and town type. He marches across a ploughed field and climbs over a fence in a 'lets do my trousers' way but gets away with it then he approaches the old boy.

 

Having checked the old boy is OK the cop waves off the helicopter which departs and our bastion of the law plonks himself on the seat next to the old boy.

 

The wife, being nosey, yells across the cut to find out what is going on an finds the old boy (a local ex-farm hand) is missing from an old folks home and the copper has come to collect him. After this she is dismissed and cop and old boy begin a discussion about how they will get back to civilization.

 

 

The conversation involves the cop, who is not local, asking the old boy, who is how, he got here to be told that he walked and now they can walk back along the towpath. The cop then asks how far to the road to be told a mile. This idea of walking a mile is obviously an alien one to the cop but he has to do it or lose his capture as the old boy, grinning at us, tells him to get up and walk and does just this himself. As the straight there is a good half mile we can see the pair - large cop stopping and starting and still not really believing being chivied on by the little old bloke. Lovely!

 

Now the cop and old boy would have passed the nature reserve mentioned a few hundred yards before they reach the road with its public carpark at Rednal. Most walkers know about the reserve and when a rare bird was spotted in the area we (passing on boat) noted about 100 twitchers rushing up and down said towpath so it is not unknown.

 

Incidentally the oiriginal canal line was changed when they built the railway and, of course when the railway first open, the 'fast boat' - as in Newtown to Rednal in 5 hours for the midday train then return to Newtown in 5hours - used to run to the (now restored) interchange building at Rednal.

Edited March 19, 2011 by Tiny

[Derek R.]

What price to deploy a manned chopper for a few hours - £12,000? Nice to know how tax payers money is being spent. Must have been one dangerous 'Old Boy'. I think I'd be a bit 'dangerous' if my bit of peace and quiet was interrupted by some p***k and his chopper. (Same thing isn't it?).

[ditchcrawler]

What price to deploy a manned chopper for a few hours - £12,000? Nice to know how tax payers money is being spent. Must have been one dangerous 'Old Boy'. I think I'd be a bit 'dangerous' if my bit of peace and quiet was interrupted by some p***k and his chopper. (Same thing isn't it?).

Quite often you will see police choppers training in that area anyway and if your old dad was missing would you appriciate it if the police used their helicopter to help to find him.