Ammeter connections

[andy b]

Decided to purchase an ammeter to keep an eye on power consumption.

The instructions give me 4 different scenarios.

Cars with starter switches.

Separate or horn relay mounted terminal.

Starter solonoid mounted directly onto starter motor.

Control or regulator box.

 

I have a new Vetus diesel engine which I know very little about!

Which, if any of the above, fits my situation, And if not, What connects where.

As always, looking farward to your solutions.

[Moley]

I'd be interested in this too, in simple language.

 

Mine seems to have an ignition switched (I think) red wire to one side and damn all to the other. For some reason the needle never moves.

[alan_fincher]

.......and damn all to the other. For some reason the needle never moves.

 

I'm not sure if that was a tongue in cheek remark, or not, Ade!

 

If one of the main pair of terminals has nowt connected to it, nothing is going to move!

 

Wired like that it's main purpose is to prevent an unsightly hole in the control panel

[Keeping Up]

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QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 16 2006, 10:03 PM) 49357[/snapback]

Decided to purchase an ammeter to keep an eye on power consumption.

The instructions give me 4 different scenarios.

Cars with starter switches.

Separate or horn relay mounted terminal.

Starter solonoid mounted directly onto starter motor.

Control or regulator box.

 

I have a new Vetus diesel engine which I know very little about!

Which, if any of the above, fits my situation, And if not, What connects where.

As always, looking farward to your solutions.

Presumably you have one domestic battery (which may actually be 2 or 3 batteries in parallel) which is separate from the starter battery, and you wish to mponitor the current into/out of the domestic battery?

 

Also do you have any high-power kit (such as a big inverter, ie more than 500 watts) which takes too much current for the ammeter?

[Guest]

Try here if your engine is a Vetus. It does depend what type of ammeter you have purchased though.

http://www.vetus.nl/pdf/09M0419_0299.htm

[andy b]

--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 16 2006, 10:03 PM) 49357[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->

Decided to purchase an ammeter to keep an eye on power consumption.

The instructions give me 4 different scenarios.

Cars with starter switches.

Separate or horn relay mounted terminal.

Starter solonoid mounted directly onto starter motor.

Control or regulator box.

 

I have a new Vetus diesel engine which I know very little about!

Which, if any of the above, fits my situation, And if not, What connects where.

As always, looking farward to your solutions.

 

Presumably you have one domestic battery (which may actually be 2 or 3 batteries in parallel) which is separate from the starter battery, and you wish to mponitor the current into/out of the domestic battery?

 

Also do you have any high-power kit (such as a big inverter, ie more than 500 watts) which takes too much current for the ammeter?

Yes to monitoring question

No high power inverter

[Keeping Up]

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QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 16 2006, 11:02 PM) 49377[/snapback]

Yes to monitoring question

No high power inverter

At the moment you will have three major things connected together. The battery positive terminal, the charging system (probably by means of a relay) and the take-off to all the equipment (probably by means of a switch or fuse box).

 

You need to leave the charging circuit and the equipment take-off still connected together, but break the connection from them to the battery and fit the ammeter into it - one side of the ammeter to the battery, and one side to the charging/take-off point. You can do this at either end of the existing battery lead although making the connections can be tricky, or it may be easier to substitute to entirely new leads, one to the ammeter from the main switch-box (which if you recall is already connected to the charging relay etc) and one from the ammeter directly to the battery (or, if there's a battery isolator switch in that connection at the moment, connect to the isolated side of that switch rather than to the batery side of it).

 

The only complication is if you have an alternator controller fitted because that will probably have a sensor lead connected to the battery and that needs to remain.

 

Not sure if I've explained that clearly or if I've omitted some specific Vetus thing that I don't know about - no doubt someone else will step in if so. I'll post my own boat's wiring diagram a bit later on, which may help clarify (it's difficult to put into words).

 

Allan

[Moley]

I'm not sure if that was a tongue in cheek remark, or not, Ade!

Very.

 

I've removed most of previous electrical system rather than trying to make sense of it. Previous owner was quite a fan of making connections with crocodile clips, or maybe just twisting together. Sometimes even taped. And it passed a BSS - are those certs worth the paper they're printed on?

[andy b]

--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 16 2006, 11:02 PM) 49377[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->

Yes to monitoring question

No high power inverter

 

At the moment you will have three major things connected together. The battery positive terminal, the charging system (probably by means of a relay) and the take-off to all the equipment (probably by means of a switch or fuse box).

 

You need to leave the charging circuit and the equipment take-off still connected together, but break the connection from them to the battery and fit the ammeter into it - one side of the ammeter to the battery, and one side to the charging/take-off point. You can do this at either end of the existing battery lead although making the connections can be tricky, or it may be easier to substitute to entirely new leads, one to the ammeter from the main switch-box (which if you recall is already connected to the charging relay etc) and one from the ammeter directly to the battery (or, if there's a battery isolator switch in that connection at the moment, connect to the isolated side of that switch rather than to the batery side of it).

 

The only complication is if you have an alternator controller fitted because that will probably have a sensor lead connected to the battery and that needs to remain.

 

Not sure if I've explained that clearly or if I've omitted some specific Vetus thing that I don't know about - no doubt someone else will step in if so. I'll post my own boat's wiring diagram a bit later on, which may help clarify (it's difficult to put into words).

 

Allan

Thanks Allan.

I will need to inspect the engine etc over the weekend to try to clarify all the information.

Many thanks

[endeva]

in simple terms an ammeter has to be connected in "Series" with the battery, that means simply cutting the positive cable and connecting it either side with the cut cables

 

it's simple really

[Keeping Up]

It probably sounds more complicated than it is, but I tried to cater for all eventualities (for example it was no good just saying "cut the battery lead" becasuse it's conceivable that the alternator output connects directly to the battery terminal, whereas my description of the three separate things you need to identify (charging, take-off, and battery) should help you get it right first time.

 

I don't know if this helps here (or on some of the other threads) but FWIW here's Keeping Up's wiring diagram. It shows the power wiring, the mains wiring, and the earthing. It doesn't show the 12-volt distribution, or the engine harness, or the alternator-controller system. For those who don't know, the Rediline is a sort of big old-fashioned mechanical inverter.

 

I know it's a sort of a cross between a circuit diagram and a wiring diagram, and it uses some unconventional symbols, but I just drew it this way because it relates most easily to what's actually there. And I know the wiring isn't perfect, it sort of grew over the last 14 years; the most recent change (which prompted me to re-draw this) was when I got a new fridge and it was better for it to share the domestic bank rather than have its own separate battery - but that's why there's a 3-way diode splitter with two sections paralleled. Others may well be able to suggest improvements I could make - if so let me know.

 

And I don't know why the lettering is so hard to read. The diagram was done in PowerPoint and it doesn't seem to export to jpg very well.

 

Allan

 

[Maffi]

in simple terms an ammeter has to be connected in "Series" with the battery, that means simply cutting the positive cable and connecting it either side with the cut cables

 

it's simple really

 

 

Alternatively you could put the shunt in the negative lead for the same effect.

[dor]

I've got 2 ammeters. A standard car-type which is in the line between the alternator and the battery. This gives you the output from the alternator, but is not very accurate. It does the important thing though, and that is telling you that your alternator (and controller if fitted) is doing its job.

 

I've also got one fitted in the main negative to the battery, this one is digital with a big shunt. This will tell me exactly how much I am either putting into or out of the batteries.

 

No complicated wiring here, and I think it gives me the information I need.

 

With a shunt type meter, you can fit additional shunts and switch between them, but you need very high quality switches, the type suitable for electronics, as the current being measured by the meter is very small.

[DHutch]

Also, is this a shunt-type ampmeter or not?

[andy b]

Also, is this a shunt-type ampmeter or not?

Ammeter is a (TIM 004) model, Purchased from modworld on tinternet. Just has the 2 connections at the back. Dont know what you mean by "shunt" type. Crimp eyelet connectors supplied in box will only take a small cable.

Please keep technical jargon to minimum if possible.

[John Orentas]

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QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 17 2006, 06:25 PM) 49528[/snapback]

Ammeter is a (TIM 004) model, Purchased from modworld on tinternet. Just has the 2 connections at the back. Dont know what you mean by "shunt" type. Crimp eyelet connectors supplied in box will only take a small cable.

Please keep technical jargon to minimum if possible.

 

 

Hi Andy.

 

You have a direct reading unit, all the current to be measured passes through the ammeter and out again. I assume it has a 'centre zero' how many amps is it calibrated to example. -30 . 0 . + 30.

[andy b]

--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(andy b @ Feb 17 2006, 06:25 PM) 49528[/snapback]</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->

Ammeter is a (TIM 004) model, Purchased from modworld on tinternet. Just has the 2 connections at the back. Dont know what you mean by "shunt" type. Crimp eyelet connectors supplied in box will only take a small cable.

Please keep technical jargon to minimum if possible.

Hi Andy.

 

You have a direct reading unit, all the current to be measured passes through the ammeter and out again. I assume it has a 'centre zero' how many amps is it calibrated to example. -30 . 0 . + 30.

Hi John.

Yes it has a "centre zero"

Its -60. 0. +60