Anti-freeze in heating systems

[Anode]

Hi,

 

our boat has a convection heating system connected to the back boiler of the solid fuel burner. When we left her for a few days last week the copper pipes froze up & popped a few joints. I was musing would it be possible to put anti-freeze in the system, does anyone do this ?

 

Cheers

 

A

[Nickhlx]

Hi,

 

our boat has a convection heating system connected to the back boiler of the solid fuel burner. When we left her for a few days last week the copper pipes froze up & popped a few joints. I was musing would it be possible to put anti-freeze in the system, does anyone do this ?

 

Cheers

 

A

 

 

Of course - Ours has it in and has had since day of manufacture - house should have it in as well - it also reduces rate of corrosion

 

Nick

[magpie patrick]

Of course - Ours has it in and has had since day of manufacture - house should have it in as well - it also reduces rate of corrosion

 

Nick

 

Ours uses glycol, but unless your other half works for a brewery I don't think it's that easy to get hold of

 

(Val used to work for one, she now has the less glamorous job of analysing ink)

[bigcol]

Defianatly!!!

 

you can use any anti freeze, but you can buy ihibitor which all central heating systems should have to prevent rust etc

 

We use this from screwfix £20 for the whole system treatment

 

 

http://www.screwfix.com/search.do;jsession...rchbutton.y=11d

 

Really glad I done mine,

 

Big Col

 

edited for bad spelling

Edited January 11, 2010 by bigcol

[bag 'o' bones]

Any half decent plumbers merchant should be able to get hold of some for you.

You shouldn't use glycol antifreeze designed for cars because its poisonous. Proper central heating antifreeze is non poisonous the idea being if a crack develops in the coils you won't poison yourself!

 

We used Sentinel X500

 

24.99 from screwfix

[magpie patrick]

Any half decent plumbers merchant should be able to get hold of some for you.

You shouldn't use glycol antifreeze designed for cars because its poisonous. Proper central heating antifreeze is non poisonous the idea being if a crack develops in the coils you won't poison yourself!

 

We used Sentinel X500

 

24.99 from screwfix

 

 

My Alde handbook actually recommends Glycol!

[Matthew Knowles]

Any half decent plumbers merchant should be able to get hold of some for you.

You shouldn't use glycol antifreeze designed for cars because its poisonous. Proper central heating antifreeze is non poisonous the idea being if a crack develops in the coils you won't poison yourself!

 

We used Sentinel X500

 

24.99 from screwfix

Poisoning yourself is bad is it? Wondered since I saw many people smoking at lunchtime.

[nb Innisfree]

Any half decent plumbers merchant should be able to get hold of some for you.

You shouldn't use glycol antifreeze designed for cars because its poisonous. Proper central heating antifreeze is non poisonous the idea being if a crack develops in the coils you won't poison yourself!

 

We used Sentinel X500

 

24.99 from screwfix

 

 

Hi

 

Is this suitable for engines? what percentage to give same as Ethyl Glycol at say 50%?

[Anode]

Ahhhh, it never previously occurred to me. Many thanks for all the prompt & future replies.

 

A

[bag 'o' bones]

Hi

 

Is this suitable for engines? what percentage to give same as Ethyl Glycol at say 50%?

 

Don't see why not. Bit of an expensive way of protecting an engine though!

[alan_fincher]

Any half decent plumbers merchant should be able to get hold of some for you.

You shouldn't use glycol antifreeze designed for cars because its poisonous. Proper central heating antifreeze is non poisonous the idea being if a crack develops in the coils you won't poison yourself!

 

We used Sentinel X500

 

24.99 from screwfix

How does it differ from having a calorifier, where one of the coils is heated by the engine water, and containing (say) up to 50% anti-freeze ?

 

I can't see the problem with conventional "motor" anti-freeze in the boats CH system as well, (or at least not from a potential "poisoning" viewpoint).

 

If you are drinking the boat's fresh water, and worried about this, it's surely best to limit yourself only to stuff drawn from the cold tap ?

[bag 'o' bones]

My Alde handbook actually recommends Glycol!

 

As long as not connected to a hot water tank I imagine.

 

How does it differ from having a calorifier, where one of the coils is heated by the engine water, and containing (say) up to 50% anti-freeze ?

 

I can't see the problem with conventional "motor" anti-freeze in the boats CH system as well, (or at least not from a potential "poisoning" viewpoint).

 

If you are drinking the boat's fresh water, and worried about this, it's surely best to limit yourself only to stuff drawn from the cold tap ?

 

Fair comment- it just that non toxic antifreeze is recommended. No one saying you have to use it!

[nb Innisfree]

Don't see why not. Bit of an expensive way of protecting an engine though!

 

True but I was looking at it from a poisoning angle.

[magpie patrick]

As long as not connected to a hot water tank I imagine.

 

 

 

Fair comment- it just that non toxic antifreeze is recommended. No one saying you have to use it!

 

Don't worry, being married to a brewer I'm acutely aware of the effects, the brewing industry goes to great lengths to keep it out of their product as dead customers are bad for sales. However, as Alan Pointed out, the hot water is also heated from the engine, which has gawd knows what nasties in it's cooling water. Hot water tank has a non-return valve, so it shouldn't get back to the cold water supply.

[nb Innisfree]

How does it differ from having a calorifier, where one of the coils is heated by the engine water, and containing (say) up to 50% anti-freeze ?

 

I can't see the problem with conventional "motor" anti-freeze in the boats CH system as well, (or at least not from a potential "poisoning" viewpoint).

 

If you are drinking the boat's fresh water, and worried about this, it's surely best to limit yourself only to stuff drawn from the cold tap ?

 

That's what we do + our engine coolant is connected to CH and is unpressurised so minimising chances of it passing into, usually, pressurised hot fresh water via coil.

 

I sometimes worry about low level, and therefore undetectable, long term contamination.

[bigcol]

How does it differ from having a calorifier, where one of the coils is heated by the engine water, and containing (say) up to 50% anti-freeze ?

 

I can't see the problem with conventional "motor" anti-freeze in the boats CH system as well, (or at least not from a potential "poisoning" viewpoint).

 

If you are drinking the boat's fresh water, and worried about this, it's surely best to limit yourself only to stuff drawn from the cold tap ?

 

Agreeing with Alans post and others

 

The fact is that not to have anything other than water in any central heating system is not good.

 

Any house central heating should have inhibitor in the water mix, Any new system will have this mix put inside by most heating engineers on service or and commisioning.

 

most engines which are water cooled will have anti freeze.

 

And using normal everyday Anti freeze is okay for any closed Central heating system on the boat.

 

And regards to poisining, if in the unfortunate instance you have a radiator leak,

I asure you as long as you dont lick it, drink it ,stuff it up you nose,

and just mop the leak it up with a mop and bucket and not your hair

 

you will be safe.

 

Best of Luck

 

ps of course if you dont want to put Anti freeze in your CH system, then your system canl get silted up as antifreeze also helps keep sediment down. Pipe work and radiators and your heating unit will be acceptable to freezing.

 

 

Big Col

Edited January 11, 2010 by bigcol

[nb Innisfree]

The fact is that not to have anything other than water in any central heating system is not good.

 

Any house central heating should have inhibitor in the water mix, Any new system will have this mix put inside by most heating engineers on service or and commisioning.

 

most engines which are water cooled will have anti freeze.

 

And using normal everyday Anti freeze is okay for any closed Central heating system on the boat.

 

And regards to poisining, if in the unfortunate instance you have a radiator leak,

I asure you as long as you dont lick it, drink it ,stuff it up you nose,

and just mop the leak it up with a mop and bucket and not your hair

 

you will be safe.

 

Best of Luck

 

 

Big Col

 

But what about a leak in the calorifier coil?

[bigcol]

Sorry can not believe Im answering this

 

If you turn the hot tap on and it comes out a green or yellow mix, then you have a fractured coil, in which place you replace or repair the coil within the calorifier .

In a domestic system in a house, the coil could split, but very rare I would inmagine. When having a bath/Shower and the waters a diferent colour just dont drink it!!!

 

 

The Fact is all Central heating systems whether house, boat, caravan etc should and will have treatment within the system to prevent silting freezing and rust etc.

 

The thing is contact your heating installer, manufactorer, or just read your unit manuals.

 

Years ago there use to be a CH system called micro bore, and if you didnt run inhibitor/Antifreeze, within 12 months your heating stoped due to sediment within the sytem that would knacker the pump,

 

In a boat which coulder be a harsher enviroment its is acceptable to freezing,and like your engine ,you dont want your heating system freezing do you?

it either will mean a burst pipe radiator,pump or/and blown water heating unit.

 

Same thing would happen anyway if your waters heated by the engine water closed system!!!, please please make sure you have Antifreeze in your engines system.

 

 

Keep safe

Col

Edited January 11, 2010 by bigcol

[boatboy]

Sorry can not believe Im answering this

 

If you turn the hot tap on and it comes out a green or yellow mix, then you have a fractured coil, in which place you replace or repair the coil within the calorifier .

In a domestic system in a house, the coil could split, but very rare I would inmagine. When having a bath/Shower and the waters a diferent colour just dont drink it!!!

 

 

The Fact is all Central heating systems whether house, boat, caravan etc should and will have treatment within the system to prevent silting freezing and rust etc.

 

The thing is contact your heating installer, manufactorer, or just read your unit manuals.

 

Years ago there use to be a CH system called micro bore, and if you didnt run inhibitor/Antifreeze, within 12 months your heating stoped due to sediment within the sytem that would knacker the pump,

 

In a boat which coulder be a harsher enviroment its is acceptable to freezing,and like your engine ,you dont want your heating system freezing do you?

it either will mean a burst pipe radiator,pump or/and blown water heating unit.

 

Same thing would happen anyway if your waters heated by the engine water closed system!!!, please please make sure you have Antifreeze in your engines system.

 

 

Keep safe

Col

 

 

i agree with you col but the water will taste sweet poss the water will not change coloer.

 

you can not replace a coil in a calorifier thay are a sealed unit you will need to replace the calorifier

Edited January 11, 2010 by boatboy

[CJR]

If i could find a non toxic alternative to do the engine and central heating i would use it.The chances of a coil leaking into the calorifier may be slim but there is nothing to stop it happening, a face full while in the shower wont be a healthy way to find out

[nb Innisfree]

Sorry can not believe Im answering this

 

If you turn the hot tap on and it comes out a green or yellow mix, then you have a fractured coil, in which place you replace or repair the coil within the calorifier .

In a domestic system in a house, the coil could split, but very rare I would inmagine. When having a bath/Shower and the waters a diferent colour just dont drink it!!!

 

 

The Fact is all Central heating systems whether house, boat, caravan etc should and will have treatment within the system to prevent silting freezing and rust etc.

 

The thing is contact your heating installer, manufactorer, or just read your unit manuals.

 

Years ago there use to be a CH system called micro bore, and if you didnt run inhibitor/Antifreeze, within 12 months your heating stoped due to sediment within the sytem that would knacker the pump,

 

In a boat which coulder be a harsher enviroment its is acceptable to freezing,and like your engine ,you dont want your heating system freezing do you?

it either will mean a burst pipe radiator,pump or/and blown water heating unit.

 

Same thing would happen anyway if your waters heated by the engine water closed system!!!, please please make sure you have Antifreeze in your engines system.

 

 

Keep safe

Col

 

 

If you pour slightly contaminated water straight into a kettle then pour boiling water straight into teapot/coffee pot you won't see it and won't taste it if you take sugar, I'm talking of a low exposure over a prolonged period. Domestic CH usually has non toxic inhibitor (Fernox) doesn't it? Does it also have a non toxic antifreeze?

[bigcol]

Hi there

 

Below are cosh sheets for fernox and anti freeze

 

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/pdfs/39/p3801539.pdf fernox

 

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/pdfs/60/p4764960.pdf normal anti freeze

 

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/pdfs/93/p4776793.pdf normal CH anti freeze,inhibitor

 

hope this helps

 

 

col

[alan_fincher]

If you pour slightly contaminated water straight into a kettle then pour boiling water straight into teapot/coffee pot you won't see it and won't taste it if you take sugar, I'm talking of a low exposure over a prolonged period. Domestic CH usually has non toxic inhibitor (Fernox) doesn't it? Does it also have a non toxic antifreeze?

A non return valve in the feed from the cold water system to the calorifier, plus a rule not to drink water out of the hot taps would seem pretty sensible.

 

As your fresh water system is pressurised to something up to 30 psi, and you are unlikely to have more than about 15 psi in either heating coil in a calorifier, it seems far more likely to me that fresh water would be forced into the heating circuit, rather than water laced with anti-freeze or Fernox from it, thus contaminating your hot water supply..

[the grinch]

glycol based antifreeze is readily available in mixed or unmixed solutions as we use it in solar hot water systems

10 litres - £30 delivered to your door.

[bigcol]

plus a rule not to drink water out of the hot taps would seem pretty sensible.

 

 

Thank you Alan for making me smile

 

I was thinking about giving up, as I dont think that I was explaining my self properly, youve done it all within one sentence

 

 

Col

Edited January 11, 2010 by bigcol