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First time owner - Inverter question


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Hello Everyone,

 

I have just bought my first narrowboat, it is 4 years old and seems to be well equipped, but I have some very basic questions. I'm not sure what section to post this but here goes ...

 

There is a Victron Energy Phoenix MultiPlus 12/2500/120 inverter/charger fitted, and there is a socket for connection to an electrical hook-up. I have never used an inverter before and the user manual is very technical - so can someone please describe what it does and how I should use it? I understand that it will let me use 240v equipment from home, TV, hair dryer, etc. Can I run a washing machine or a small electric fan heater? Do I need to be connected to the shore power supply or will it run off the leisure batteries?

 

There is a switch - inverter, off and charger only - how should these be set for each type of use - and what do all the light mean?

 

I know this is pretty basic but will appreciate any help or advice.

 

Thanks!

 

Davo

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I have almost the same thing on my boat and I had no idea what it was when I got it.

 

It does a number of things;

 

1) Away from your land line, it takes 12v from your batteries and supplies 240v mains to your mains sockets

 

2) When you are plugged into the land line it feeds the incoming 240v on to your mains sockets

 

3) When you are plugged into the land line it feeds a charging current into your batteries, so you don't need to run the engine. It charges them in a 'clever' way, sending in a big feed at first and them switching to a slow trickle when the batteries are full. This is good for the batteries.

 

4) If you were to run a generator while away from the land line, it will take the generator's supply and feed it to both your mains sockets and it will charge your batteries.

 

 

It is a good idea to turn it off when you are not using it. Even with no load it still takes a small current from your batteries.

 

 

Most of the lights relate to the battery charging. You can run a washing machine but it is best done while the engine is running and filling the batteries back up. A small heater works fine too, but I would not recommend a kettle or anything that draws lots of power, thy will just flatten the batteries very quickly.

Edited by WJM
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An inverter changes the 12v from the batteries into the more familiar 240v you'd use at home.

 

Yours is rated at 2500w, meaning it can provide that amount at a time. Most of your equipment will be rated in watts. 2500w is a fairly hefty inverter and should be able to power your washing machine. The only problem you'll have there is the amount of electricity it eats out of your batteries. I'd only do it with the engine running if I were you.

 

When plugged into shore power you want to use that directly rather than the inverter. I don't have a victron, but it sounds like you want to turn the inverter part off and the charger part on when plugged in.

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Hello Everyone,

 

I have just bought my first narrowboat, it is 4 years old and seems to be well equipped, but I have some very basic questions. I'm not sure what section to post this but here goes ...

 

There is a Victron Energy Phoenix MultiPlus 12/2500/120 inverter/charger fitted, and there is a socket for connection to an electrical hook-up. I have never used an inverter before and the user manual is very technical - so can someone please describe what it does and how I should use it? I understand that it will let me use 240v equipment from home, TV, hair dryer, etc. Can I run a washing machine or a small electric fan heater? Do I need to be connected to the shore power supply or will it run off the leisure batteries?

 

There is a switch - inverter, off and charger only - how should these be set for each type of use - and what do all the light mean?

 

I know this is pretty basic but will appreciate any help or advice.

 

Thanks!

 

Davo

 

 

Hi Davo

 

Welcome here and enjoy

 

You are correct in your assumption that the inverter will give you 220V ac from your 12V dc battery's BUT

It can drain your battery's very quickly - a 1000w at 220v is 4.5amps - at 12V it is 83 amps!!!!

You will see from this that if you have the standard 3 x 110amp leisure battery's they will become flat very quickly.

You must be watchful of the watts you ask from the inverter/battery's.

I have never thought it feasable to run a washing machine (or fan heater) from an inverter

From the little I know about these inverters, they automacticaly switch between land line and inverter for your 220V supply.

I think when connected to land line become a charger for your battery's.

It is a nice piece of kit but use sparingly for 220v.

 

Alex

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"When plugged into shore power you want to use that directly rather than the inverter. I don't have a victron, but it sounds like you want to turn the inverter part off and the charger part on when plugged in."

 

 

 

I have the 1800 version of the same inverter. I am fairly sure that the inverter automatically feeds the incoming mains directly to the sockets, bypassing the batteries (while simultaneously charging them)

 

The Victrons do lots of things automatically that you will hear other boaters talking about having to do manually. They are very 'plug,play and forget'

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With the Multiplus you also have 'Power Assist' this allows you to set it to the shorepower limit i.e. if shorepower is limited to 10 amps you set your Multiplus to that figure and if you exceed that limit e.g. a washing machine heater cuts in the Multiplus will prevent shorepower tripping out by automatically augmenting your w/m from the batteries.

 

We leave our Multiplus switched on 24/7 unless we leave the boat for some time.

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"When plugged into shore power you want to use that directly rather than the inverter. I don't have a victron, but it sounds like you want to turn the inverter part off and the charger part on when plugged in."

 

 

 

I have the 1800 version of the same inverter. I am fairly sure that the inverter automatically feeds the incoming mains directly to the sockets, bypassing the batteries (while simultaneously charging them)

 

The Victrons do lots of things automatically that you will hear other boaters talking about having to do manually. They are very 'plug,play and forget'

 

Yeah, my powermaster does that too :lol:

 

I nominate this thread for the FAQ forum.

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WOW = thank you both for such a fast response ... I can tell I'm going to like being part of this community!

 

Thanks again!

 

worth noting that 2500W is a lot of 240V power and if you want to use a laptop or a phone charger it will be a hideously inefficient way of doing it, using a lot of power just to keep itself going so for small 240V requirements I would recommend a £30 Maplin jobbie. And has been said, only use the big power stuff with the engine on.

 

At full whack it will use over 200 Amps and will flatten your batteries in about 20 minutes.

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worth noting that 2500W is a lot of 240V power and if you want to use a laptop or a phone charger it will be a hideously inefficient way of doing it, using a lot of power just to keep itself going so for small 240V requirements I would recommend a £30 Maplin jobbie. And has been said, only use the big power stuff with the engine on.

 

At full whack it will use over 200 Amps and will flatten your batteries in about 20 minutes.

 

The 12v Victron is 93% efficient throughout its power range. we can, and do, run one 20watt light and it uses 0.7 amps (24v version - 94% efficient) and reading from our battery monitor's ammeter that efficiency holds true however low or high the load is.

 

They are very good at supplying small loads.

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"They are very good at supplying small loads."

 

That is my experience too.

 

93% efficient! That confirms my earlier suggestion too, that when it is running with no load it still draws power from the batteries so best to turn it off when it is not needed.

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"They are very good at supplying small loads."

 

That is my experience too.

 

93% efficient! That confirms my earlier suggestion too, that when it is running with no load it still draws power from the batteries so best to turn it off when it is not needed.

 

Yes it will still use power tho we still leave it on overnight as our gas alarm is 230v powered.

 

When our old batteries were dying we used to regularly turn it off but with decent batts there really is no need.

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Yes it will still use power tho we still leave it on overnight as our gas alarm is 230v powered.

 

When our old batteries were dying we used to regularly turn it off but with decent batts there really is no need.

 

We have a "recent" (about 9 months since manufactured) 12/3000/120 and that sounds exactly the same apart from the load capability - we leave on all the time we are on the boat and switch to charger only when boat left for any length of time - also can confirm it only takes about 0.75 A when idle - and LESS if you have set the "economiser" ( AES ) set to on - this reduces (by 20%) the quiescent current for low loads / standby to around 600mA.

 

Nick

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If connected to shore power select "charger only" - this will charge batteries and supply 240 V to sockets. If you select "inverter" when plugged into shorepower this will also charge batteries and supply 240 V but if shorepower fails it will switch instananeously and seemlessly to batteries and if shorepower remains off could flatten them without your being aware if you have 240V equipment operating.

 

Mick

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If connected to shore power select "charger only" - this will charge batteries and supply 240 V to sockets. If you select "inverter" when plugged into shorepower this will also charge batteries and supply 240 V but if shorepower fails it will switch instananeously to batteries and if shorepower remains off could flatten them without your being aware (if you have 240V equipment operating)

 

Mick

 

We do this when charging from genny, also tells us when or if genny stops or is getting nicked!

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"If connected to shore power select "charger only" - this will charge batteries and supply 240 V to sockets. If you select "inverter" when plugged into shorepower this will also charge batteries and supply 240 V but if shorepower fails it will switch instananeously to batteries and if shorepower remains off could flatten them without your being aware (if you have 240V equipment operating)"

 

 

 

That is a relative thing, you might want the batteries to jump in and replace the lost shore power. But it is good to know what the various controls do.

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That is a relative thing, you might want the batteries to jump in and replace the lost shore power.

 

True but someone who will remain nameless, not me, did this but the shoreline failed because the onshore 'trip' had 'tripped' and the batteries were as flat as flat can be the next time the boat was visited, weeks later.

 

It did not help that a small heater had been left switched on, jut to keep the boat aired. :lol:

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OK - so we went out this weekend. The invertor worked OK, but when set to 'on' we had 2 flashing yellow lights under the charging section - bulk and absorbtion together .... any idea what this is telling me?

 

Thanks again!

 

Davo

 

To clarify - was this when the engine was running? If it was, I think it's telling you what the inverter is doing - in this case charging your batteries ....... However, someone with a far, far bigger brain will help. Over to you Willawaw and ValandPete!

Edited by wrigglefingers
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To clarify - was this when the engine was running? If it was, I think it's telling you what the inverter is doing - in this case charging your batteries ....... However, someone with a far, far bigger brain will help. Over to you Willawaw and ValandPete!

 

Thank you - no this was the state when engine was stopped - not conected to a mains hook-up, after cruising for a few hours ... we were running only a small electric lamp 20w on one of the 240 sockets - just to check it out really so no load as such on the system.

 

Thanks again!

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Thank you - no this was the state when engine was stopped - not conected to a mains hook-up, after cruising for a few hours ... we were running only a small electric lamp 20w on one of the 240 sockets - just to check it out really so no load as such on the system.

 

Thanks again!

 

Okay, I have no idea , but I will ask tomorrow if somebody can't help you in the meantime.

 

I've got to get in contact with the electrician for Cobbett to discuss the electrical installation including the Isolation Transformer Question (dah,de,da,da,daaahhhh!).

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With the Multiplus you also have 'Power Assist' this allows you to set it to the shorepower limit i.e. if shorepower is limited to 10 amps you set your Multiplus to that figure and if you exceed that limit e.g. a washing machine heater cuts in the Multiplus will prevent shorepower tripping out by automatically augmenting your w/m from the batteries.

 

We leave our Multiplus switched on 24/7 unless we leave the boat for some time.

 

The 'Power Assist setting is on the control panel BTW...

 

23.jpg

50.jpg

 

And if you wish to leave the inverter on, and use a heater / immersion heater as well (or more not accidentally leave the immersion on when on the move!), but not flatten your batteries if the shore power goes, it's possible, check out this link http://www.smartgauge.co.uk/nb_ac_sys.html

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To clarify - was this when the engine was running? If it was, I think it's telling you what the inverter is doing - in this case charging your batteries ....... However, someone with a far, far bigger brain will help. Over to you Willawaw and ValandPete!

 

The invertor worked OK, but when set to 'on' we had 2 flashing yellow lights under the charging section - bulk and absorbtion together .... any idea what this is telling me? This was with the engine not running and not connected to an electrical hook-up.

 

Anyone?

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The invertor worked OK, but when set to 'on' we had 2 flashing yellow lights under the charging section - bulk and absorbtion together .... any idea what this is telling me? This was with the engine not running and not connected to an electrical hook-up.

 

Anyone?

 

In the user manual the only condition like yours is with 2 yellows flashing (bulk and absorption) and the green (mains on) light which states "The mains voltage is switched through and the charger operates in raised absorption"

 

I would think raised absorption also means forced absorption though if there is nothing connected to shorepower inlet then that is a bit strange.

 

You could try switching off battery power to it for a short while and see if it resets itself.

Edited by nb Innisfree
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