It's Happening again

[carlt]

No not really when you think about it. No one has the "right" to be offensive to another person, even if the other person is deemed to have deserved it. Although I do agree with your earlier post suggesting that it says more about the person adopting that approach than the person being abused.

So if somebody posts something which you believe to be "offensive bile" you don't think you should have the right to express that?

 

Is that not what you are doing now?

[NB Alnwick]

So I have very big axe to grind when others get away with it without redress.

 

Please use the report system whenever you feel that a forum contributor has infringed the board rules by using offensive language. The mods do their best but cannot be expected to see everything. Your reports are always welcome even if you do not always see the action taken as a result.

[Bones]

In one sense no, but I have always held the view that if any person is prepared to offend other people with their views and style of language, they should also be prepared to identify who they are. It is very easy (some would say cowardly) to shout at others and hide behind a wall.

 

P.S. This is not a go at you. I know you have a psuedonym, but you do not make your real identity a secret, And as for me, there is only one other person in the UK with the same name as me and no other boat on BW waters with the same name, so anyone offended by me can easily choose to ignore me, or have a go at me if they pass by.

 

 

But there is no telling whether you are using your 'real' name. Some would also disagree and suggest that I make my real identity secret (which is Bones in my view).

[Mick_B]

You'd never get a medal for tracking me down...

Secrecy??

[wonderdust]

And as for me, there is only one other person in the UK with the same name as me and no other boat on BW waters with the same name, so anyone offended by me can easily choose to ignore me, or have a go at me if they pass by.

 

Two, according to the Electoral Roll 2007, but granted this is a year old!

[mayalld]

I, personally, didn't feel you were being abused, Dave, though I also don't think your argument is "bile", either, but if someone genuinely does feel that then do they not have the right to say it?

 

They must have found your opinion pretty offensive, to describe it as such, although I think a more reasoned riposte would have been more productive.

 

To be honest, possibly due to the elephant hide, I didn't feel abused at the time!

 

However, having read this thread, I read it again. I still didn't feel abused, but I did note that daring to express an opinion that didn't fit in with the general back-slapping, we're all in this together that had dominated the thread, brought forth a series of responses, several of which were more concerned with trying to vilify me and those who share my view than in any attempt to rebut the views that I had expressed.

 

If somebody thinks my view is bile, then they must feel free to do so. I would hope that before they do so, they consider whether they risk tainting the thread with a "mob rule" straightjacket.

 

PM-ed abuse is always welcome.

[Athy]

Mr. Schweizer, I feel that I have every right to be offensive to another person, though it is a right which I seldom exercise, at least intentionally! Whether that "other person" then has the right to smack me in the mouth is, of course, a different question entirely.

[Chertsey]

Why is anonymity a problem if we don't know each other in real life anyway? And if we do, anonymity still makes no difference. I have met Bones on a number of occasions but I have no idea what her 'real' name is, but I still know her, and if she upset me I woulld be upset with Bones (not that she ever will of course). The only point at which 'real' identity becomes an issue is when you want to either send the police or bailiffs round, or if you want to go round and beat them up. Perish the thought that that would apply to anyone on here!

 

Why should expletives be masked? We all know what they are anyway (although some people's 'amusing' rendering of the word 'work' leads me to wonder sometimes). Unless of course for legal reasons.

 

I have less of a problem with personal abuse - it's easy to ignore it and it says far more - to everyone else on the forum - about the abuser than the abusee. The times I've been more inclined to complain (and I think I only did once) is when something politically inflammatory or misleading is posted, which might reinforce the views of the less savoury elements and might eventually be carried into action in the real world. IIRC, my complaint was about a nasty and derogatory comment about women in general. If it had been about me personally I would have either responded or ignored it.

[nigel fryer]

Can i just say sorry for my use of bad language last nite

I only put the thread on to ask for advice really.

Inverters are a nightmare.

 

Sorry

 

Nigel Fryer REAL NAME . And proud of it

[billyb]

Once again there are several threads running where I have view, but will not post it for fear of being villified by the same small group of evil minded members who clearly believe that it is acceptable to insult and abuse those people with whose views they disagree.

 

This offensive behavior is not limited to one side of the arguement, but seems to be spread fairly evenly between the Hang them, Shoot, them brigade and the Let Everyone do what they want cohort. My views do not fall into either camp but in order to express them it is neccessary to identify the groups under discussion. However experience demonstrates that doing so risks the generation of a tyrade of abuse from one of the "extreemists" who either fail to read the posts properly, or fail to understand them.

 

I have disconnected myself from this forum in the past because of this behavior, and only returned when the general conduct has improved, However, having reflected on the matter, I feel that it is the offensive minority who should either be removed or behave more respectfully, rather than people like myself impose exile upon themselves.

 

 

I may be alone in my views, but I am remaining on the Forum in the hope that the offenders will either voluntarily control their anger or be asked to control it by the moderators.

 

Edited to correct spelling mistakes

 

It is not limited to this forum.

I have asked genuine questions on some other sites and been given the "Why is this cretin asking such an obvious question" reply.

I ask questions because I don't know the answer and I (mistakenly?) thought that everyone on forums with experience would willingly help out.

[gaggle]

edited because i dont want the schwiezer boy in a flood of tears.

[Jason Wilson and Family]

Let me go ahead and put something out there. If you with-hold your opinion, regardless of the amount of 'abuse' you fear then you must not feel strongly about the topic. If you don't feel strongly enough about what you're going to say and can't stand behind it in any sort of opposition, why bother.

 

In the thread you pointed out, this is a discussion between people who are at risk of losing everything they have in their life (their boat and their lifestyle) because British Waterways is levelling an idiotic tax that will benefit no one. The 'other opinion' in this matter is that it's perfectly okay for BW to rip-off a large group of boaters because the minority are breaking an arbitrary rule. How would you feel if you were booted from your home because of some stupid nonsense? If you are surprised that tempers are flaring in that thread then don't stick your head in the door.

 

By the way, Jason Wilson is my real name and I'd be more than happy to tell you the same in person. Nothing personal but I don't feel people should tone down justified outrage.

 

 

- Edited for clarity.

Edited November 24, 2008 by Jason Wilson and Family

[Denis R]

It is not limited to this forum.

I have asked genuine questions on some other sites and been given the "Why is this cretin asking such an obvious question" reply.

I ask questions because I don't know the answer and I (mistakenly?) thought that everyone on forums with experience would willingly help out.

Oftentimes that's forum speak for "If you'd used the search engine and read around a bit first, you'd have found this answered many times before." I've noticed that on a car forum to which I subscribe, questions are often preceded by words along the lines of "I've tried the search engine, but didn't find anything covering this...." as a way of deflating the 'obvious question' riposte.

[Jason Wilson and Family]

I (mistakenly?) thought that everyone on forums with experience would willingly help out.

 

If you walk around the streets asking random people questions do you think they will all respond favourably. With forums questions get asked over and over (I've probably asked a few daft ones here but have never got a sharp response) it grates on some people's nerves, especially when the answer could be found in a search. I think that's been my saving grace in some things, I've searched and at least got a basic idea of what I was looking for before asking for clarification.

 

Denis beat me to it.

Edited November 24, 2008 by Jason Wilson and Family

[OptedOut]

Can i just say sorry for my use of bad language last nite

I only put the thread on to ask for advice really.

Inverters are a nightmare.

 

Sorry

 

Nigel Fryer REAL NAME . And proud of it

 

I made the same mistake with battery negative hull bonding, not worth the hassle really.

[mayalld]

Let me go ahead and put something out there. If you withold your opinion, regardless of the amount of 'abuse' you fear then you have no opinion to make. If you don't feel strongly enough about what you're going to say and can't stand behind it in any sort of opposition, why bother.

 

In the thread you pointed out, this is a discussion between people who are at risk of losing everything they have in their life (their boat and their lifestyle) because British Waterways is levelling an idiotic tax that will benefit no one. The 'other opinion' in this matter is that it's perfectly okay for BW to rip-off a large group of boaters because the minority are breaking an arbitrary rule. How would you feel if you were booted from your home because of some stupid nonsense? If you are surprised that tempers are flaring in that thread then don't stick your head in the door.

 

By the way, Jason Wilson is my real name and I'd be more than happy to tell you the same in person. Nothing personal but I don't feel people should tone down justified outrage.

 

Quite amazing.

 

Without David ever expressing his opinion on that thread (merely by hinting that it wasn't at the polarised extremes), you have chosen to go for the jugular.

[johnthebridge]

Let me go ahead and put something out there. If you withold your opinion, regardless of the amount of 'abuse' you fear then you have no opinion to make. If you don't feel strongly enough about what you're going to say and can't stand behind it in any sort of opposition, why bother.

 

In the thread you pointed out, this is a discussion between people who are at risk of losing everything they have in their life (their boat and their lifestyle) because British Waterways is levelling an idiotic tax that will benefit no one. The 'other opinion' in this matter is that it's perfectly okay for BW to rip-off a large group of boaters because the minority are breaking an arbitrary rule. How would you feel if you were booted from your home because of some stupid nonsense? If you are surprised that tempers are flaring in that thread then don't stick your head in the door.

 

By the way, Jason Wilson is my real name and I'd be more than happy to tell you the same in person. Nothing personal but I don't feel people should tone down justified outrage.

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with your first paragraph. If someone witholds their opinion for fear of anything, be it abuse, embarassment, threats, shyness etc; I can't see how you can then say that that person has "no opinion to make". To take an extreme example, witness protection schemes operate to provide the opportunity for a person with an "opinion to make" some ability to do so, which otherwise might remain unheard. I think one has to respect someone elses' view, if they feel they cannot opine, for whatever reason. That reason doesn't in itself mean they don't have an opinion, merely that it isn't going to be aired.

[David Schweizer]

Two, according to the Electoral Roll 2007, but granted this is a year old!

Only two according to my search and, one of them is me!

[Bones]

As with all walks of life, there are some things that upset others, and some that don't. Why not make the complaint to the moderators and leave it to them to resolve? We can all take action against people we find offensive or those we find upset our equilibrium by using the 'ignore user' option. As for fairness - sometimes we just have to 'let it go' - a stratergy I find very useful.

[Jason Wilson and Family]

Quite amazing.

 

Without David ever expressing his opinion on that thread (merely by hinting that it wasn't at the polarised extremes), you have chosen to go for the jugular.

 

[Debby]

As with all walks of life, there are some things that upset others, and some that don't. Why not make the complaint to the moderators and leave it to them to resolve? We can all take action against people we find offensive or those we find upset our equilibrium by using the 'ignore user' option. As for fairness - sometimes we just have to 'let it go' - a stratergy I find very useful.

 

Well said.

[David Schweizer]

I am beginning to regret starting all this, particularly as some people seem to have misunderstood what I was trying to say.

 

I have no problem with people having strong opinions or feelings, and am perfectly OK with them expressing those opinions and feelings. It is the use of offensive and abusive language to which I am objecting.

[Debby]

I am beginning to regret starting all this, particularly as some people seem to have misunderstood what I was trying to say.

 

I have no problem with people having strong opinions or feelings, and am perfectly OK with them expressing those opinions and feelings. It is the use of offensive and abusive language to which I am objecting.

 

If you object to it, report it to the moderators.

[johnthebridge]

I am beginning to regret starting all this, particularly as some people seem to have misunderstood what I was trying to say.

 

I have no problem with people having strong opinions or feelings, and am perfectly OK with them expressing those opinions and feelings. It is the use of offensive and abusive language to which I am objecting.

Does the use of such language preclude you from replying, or offering an opinion though?

[Marc Harris]

I am beginning to regret starting all this, particularly as some people seem to have misunderstood what I was trying to say.

 

I have no problem with people having strong opinions or feelings, and am perfectly OK with them expressing those opinions and feelings. It is the use of offensive and abusive language to which I am objecting.

 

That's the hardest thing in an open forum, as you have people from all walks of life, upbringings, and sensitivities. I think if you sent a mass mail to all 5500+ members with say 50 commonly used "offensive" words or phrases, and asked them to tick which ones they found offensive, you'd get nearly 5000 different answers.

 

If you personally feel offended or abused, then hit the "Report" button, and let the mods intervene, as i don't think it's possible to be able to act for other people.

 

Personally, it takes a lot to upset me on a forum, or in real life, but i know other people are different. If anything i said upset someone, i'd either expect a pm from them or a mod outlining the problem, and hopefully resolve it from there.

 

Marc