Bilge pump

[Memories]

This may seems a bit pointless asking as water rising is an indicator, but how can I tell if my bilge pumps are working without inspecting the bilges by lifting flooring or engine bay boards?

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Is there water being pumped out overboard every so often? If there is, the pump is working. Most pumps are installed wirh the outlet going to a hull skin fitting. 

[Tony Brooks]

3 hours ago, Memories said:

This may seems a bit pointless asking as water rising is an indicator, but how can I tell if my bilge pumps are working without inspecting the bilges by lifting flooring or engine bay boards?

 

Switch to manual and listen for the buzz of the motor, then look outside, as Jen says to see if it is pumping water out. If so keep going until it reduces to an occasional glug. If it did pump water for several a while and if it had been switched to auto, the there is a good chance the auto part is not working. Note that not all boat bilge pumps have an auto setting and if it does then that setting is not very reliable.

 

Bilge pumps rarely can drain every drop of water from bilges, that is what sponging or absorbent pads like nappies are used for.

 

I would suggest that the vast majority of twin bilge narrowboats do not have a bilge pump in the accommodation bilge.

 

Some, usually older boats, may have a pump for a separate bilge under a low floor front well deck or pipes draining that area back to the stern, or an all-in-one bilge that drains the whole bilge area to the stern. If you don't know how your boat is built then it may be time for a bit of investigation.

 

I suspect the vast majority of boaters do lift engine boards or inspection traps to check their bilges for water. It is usually the quickest and simplest way. Inspection traps can be cut into cabin floors failrly  easily.

 

 

 

 

[Tonka]

Personally I'd be more worried as to why there is water in the bilge?

A thimble full of water is too much in my opinion.

 

[Alan de Enfield]

6 hours ago, Memories said:

but how can I tell if my bilge pumps are working without inspecting the bilges by lifting flooring or engine bay boards?

 

Normally, when in the water and in use, you would need to lift your engine boards when doing the "DI" (daily inspection) of the engine and ancilliaries.

 

We have become spoilt by modern cars reliability & a "jump in and drive" mentality has overidden the thoughts of doing checks and maintenance.

[Arthur Marshall]

7 hours ago, Memories said:

This may seems a bit pointless asking as water rising is an indicator, but how can I tell if my bilge pumps are working without inspecting the bilges by lifting flooring or engine bay boards?

You can't. 

As has been said, auto pumps leave a couple of inches at least in the bilge. If there's gaps in your deck planks over the engine you're going to get rain water in, plus drips from the prop shaft. You will probably get some water out by switching to manual, but the only way to be certain that your pumps are NOT working, without lifting the boards and looking (ie, doing something yourself), is by sinking, whuch does seem a little drastic.

[Memories]

5 hours ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Is there water being pumped out overboard every so often? If there is, the pump is working. Most pumps are installed wirh the outlet going to a hull skin fitting. 

I've never heard the pump or seen water being pumped out, I am on my own so even if I press the bilge pump I can't see the effect because I'm in the boat pressing the button 

[Memories]

4 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Switch to manual and listen for the buzz of the motor, then look outside, as Jen says to see if it is pumping water out. If so keep going until it reduces to an occasional glug. If it did pump water for several a while and if it had been switched to auto, the there is a good chance the auto part is not working. Note that not all boat bilge pumps have an auto setting and if it does then that setting is not very reliable.

 

Bilge pumps rarely can drain every drop of water from bilges, that is what sponging or absorbent pads like nappies are used for.

 

I would suggest that the vast majority of twin bilge narrowboats do not have a bilge pump in the accommodation bilge.

 

Some, usually older boats, may have a pump for a separate bilge under a low floor front well deck or pipes draining that area back to the stern, or an all-in-one bilge that drains the whole bilge area to the stern. If you don't know how your boat is built then it may be time for a bit of investigation.

 

I suspect the vast majority of boaters do lift engine boards or inspection traps to check their bilges for water. It is usually the quickest and simplest way. Inspection traps can be cut into cabin floors failrly  easily.

 

 

 

 

As I say I am in the engine room we hen I turn the pump off and back on, there is no actual button to manually test the pump I can only switch it on or off at the fuse box

[Memories]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Normally, when in the water and in use, you would need to lift your engine boards when doing the "DI" (daily inspection) of the engine and ancilliaries.

 

We have become spoilt by modern cars reliability & a "jump in and drive" mentality has overidden the thoughts of doing checks and maintenance.

I agree with that, a certain amount of complacency has certainly effected the way i manage my boat

[Memories]

1 hour ago, Arthur Marshall said:

You can't. 

As has been said, auto pumps leave a couple of inches at least in the bilge. If there's gaps in your deck planks over the engine you're going to get rain water in, plus drips from the prop shaft. You will probably get some water out by switching to manual, but the only way to be certain that your pumps are NOT working, without lifting the boards and looking (ie, doing something yourself), is by sinking, whuch does seem a little drastic.

Ok, I can't.

[Memories]

19 minutes ago, Memories said:

I agree with that, a certain amount of complacency has certainly effected the way i manage my boat

Someone, sorry for not fully recalling the stream, mentioned the Screwfix wet and dry vacuum, but they said something about filters but can't recall what it was they said something about using different filters I think, any  ideas. I am going to buy the Titan from Screwfix but not sure about the filter issue.

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, Memories said:

Someone, sorry for not fully recalling the stream, mentioned the Screwfix wet and dry vacuum, but they said something about filters but can't recall what it was they said something about using different filters I think, any  ideas. I am going to buy the Titan from Screwfix but not sure about the filter issue.

 

If you are just using it for wet bilges then it does not need the filter fitted, that is to stop it spewing dust out when vacuuming up dust, dirt, sawdust, ash etc.

2 hours ago, Memories said:

As I say I am in the engine room we hen I turn the pump off and back on, there is no actual button to manually test the pump I can only switch it on or off at the fuse box

 

In that case it is probably NOT an automatic pump. Those normally have their own three position switch, Non-manual, off, on-auto. That does not mean someone has not done something unexpected, put the switch you have to on and go through the boat listening for the motor buzzing. They are usually perfectly audible unless the engine or other noisy things are running. I think that in this case you should go looking for the pump. It is probably at or towards the back of the boat.

Edited March 21 by Tony Brooks

[Arthur Marshall]

5 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

If you are just using it for wet bilges then it does not need the filter fitted, that is to stop it sewing dust out when vacuuming up dist, dirt, sawdust, ash etc.

I think it needs a filter to stop water getting into the motor. I have a feeling it comes with both.

[Tony Brooks]

Just now, Arthur Marshall said:

I think it needs a filter to stop water getting into the motor. I have a feeling it comes with both.

 

They normally have a ball in a cage so that as the water rises in the "tub" the ball rises also and eventually blocks the outlet leading to the motor. I can well see that a real cheapy may omit the plastic cage and just use the filter to retain the ball, but I have yet to see one like that.

[Arthur Marshall]

3 hours ago, Memories said:

As I say I am in the engine room we hen I turn the pump off and back on, there is no actual button to manually test the pump I can only switch it on or off at the fuse box

If there's water in the bilge, switch it on manual then nip out and have a look. Mine takes a good ten minutes to finish pumping water out after a few weeks of rain, even if the last bit is only a dribble. 

6 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

They normally have a ball in a cage so that as the water rises in the "tub" the ball rises also and eventually blocks the outlet leading to the motor. I can well see that a real cheapy may omit the plastic cage and just use the filter to retain the ball, but I have yet to see one like that.

It's got that, but theres also a foam sleeve that fits over the motor housing to "prevent liquid mist entering the motor" per the manual. I lost mine while using it in dry mode and had to buy a replacement, but I'm pretty sure it came with the thing originally. How essential it us I have no idea.That's for the Titan TTB774.

Edited March 21 by Arthur Marshall

[pete.i]

My Evolution vacuum cleaner has two filters as well. A standard dust filter and a foam thing that is put over the cage with the ball in it to prevent spray into the motor.

[Memories]

3 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

They normally have a ball in a cage so that as the water rises in the "tub" the ball rises also and eventually blocks the outlet leading to the motor. I can well see that a real cheapy may omit the plastic cage and just use the filter to retain the ball, but I have yet to see one like that.

No ball in a cage just an empty tank, I will use the filter, it came with it so may as well use it.

 

I have a dreadful feeling that my pumps are not working, never heard it/them, there is no manual operating switch for the pump just an on and off switch at the circuit board, it v took her through locks like that though and no issue. Worried now.

[Memories]

4 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

If there's water in the bilge, switch it on manual then nip out and have a look. Mine takes a good ten minutes to finish pumping water out after a few weeks of rain, even if the last bit is only a dribble. 

It's got that, but theres also a foam sleeve that fits over the motor housing to "prevent liquid mist entering the motor" per the manual. I lost mine while using it in dry mode and had to buy a replacement, but I'm pretty sure it came with the thing originally. How essential it us I have no idea.That's for the Titan TTB774.

The picture below is my fuse panel there is no other switch for bilge pumps except on this panel, it is lit but that doesn't give me confidence 

[Memories]

7 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

You can't. 

As has been said, auto pumps leave a couple of inches at least in the bilge. If there's gaps in your deck planks over the engine you're going to get rain water in, plus drips from the prop shaft. You will probably get some water out by switching to manual, but the only way to be certain that your pumps are NOT working, without lifting the boards and looking (ie, doing something yourself), is by sinking, whuch does seem a little drastic.

I will investigate, really worried as show in the picture, the fuse panel is the ONLY way to switch the pump on and off, there is no actual manual switch. I have water in the engine bay but that is normal I am told. The fact that there is no manual switch bothers me too 

[Memories]

10 hours ago, Tonka said:

Personally I'd be more worried as to why there is water in the bilge?

A thimble full of water is too much in my opinion.

 

Rain water, I think, but I don't honestly know.

[Tonka]

7 minutes ago, Memories said:

Rain water, I think, but I don't honestly know.

What style of boat is it?

[Memories]

It's a standard Narrowboat, without a cruiser stern, engine room leads to bedroom, which leads to living area then the kitchen at the bow.

[Arthur Marshall]

1 hour ago, Memories said:

No ball in a cage just an empty tank, I will use the filter, it came with it so may as well use it.

 

I have a dreadful feeling that my pumps are not working, never heard it/them, there is no manual operating switch for the pump just an on and off switch at the circuit board, it v took her through locks like that though and no issue. Worried now.

If its the Titan vacuum, the safety "ball in a cage" is in the bit you put the filter over, all part of  the lid where the  motor is.

You wouldn't hear a bilge pump, they're very quiet.

[Memories]

19 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

If its the Titan vacuum, the safety "ball in a cage" is in the bit you put the filter over, all part of  the lid where the  motor is.

You wouldn't hear a bilge pump, they're very quiet.

Mate I tell you I am as worried as hell about the pump. Did, obviously, note the part where the foam filter has to replace the paper one, both filters were supplied along with a bag, didn't notice the caged ball though, but didn't check what was inside the filter housing to be truthful I just swapped the filters over 

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, Memories said:

The picture below is my fuse panel there is no other switch for bilge pumps except on this panel, it is lit but that doesn't give me confidence 

 

The fact it lights up when you turn the switch on only says that you have 12V+ to the switch, it does not mean that the switch is connecting the 12V to the output terminal, although to a degree it might be depending upon the way the switch is wired. I don't see how you can now avoid looking behind the panel to ensure output wire is on the switch and then try to follow the wire to see where it goes and what it connects to - if anything.

 

Bilge pump bodies tend to be white with blue or red "trims". I think that you need to bite the bullet and go looking for it, you might just find a loose wire hanging in the bilge and no bilge pump.