Canal boaters like me face an existential crisis

[Alan de Enfield]

 

‘Canal boaters like me face an existential crisis’

 

Extract as requested :

 

(discussing the commission recomendations)

 

At present, many boaters will choose to moor close to their workplace in the winter when temperatures plunge and the days shorten, but will then travel further away during warmer months.

“Minimum distances will mean you will have to rely on public transport all the time,” Gough-Olaya says. “There are all sorts of extra prices that start coming into all of that. It would impose a very rigid set of rules over what is actually quite a fluid lifestyle.”

The combined impact of being forced to travel longer distances while paying increased fees could be tough for some to sustain, he adds. “It seems that the navigation authority doesn’t want me to exist and they’re using two different ways to say we just don’t want you here.”

Edited January 11 by Alan de Enfield

[GUMPY]

 

 

[Mike Coombes]

3 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

‘Canal boaters like me face an existential crisis’

 

Extract as requested :

 

(discussing the commission recomendations)

 

At present, many boaters will choose to moor close to their workplace in the winter when temperatures plunge and the days shorten, but will then travel further away during warmer months.

“Minimum distances will mean you will have to rely on public transport all the time,” Gough-Olaya says. “There are all sorts of extra prices that start coming into all of that. It would impose a very rigid set of rules over what is actually quite a fluid lifestyle.”

The combined impact of being forced to travel longer distances while paying increased fees could be tough for some to sustain, he adds. “It seems that the navigation authority doesn’t want me to exist and they’re using two different ways to say we just don’t want you here.”

 

Not really a canal boater per se, more a canal dweller not prepared to pay for the benefit of living on a boat on the CRT's waterways.

 

IMHO, living on a waterway is NOT suited to those who need to travel for work, unless they have a proper livaboard mooring.

 

CC'ing is most certainly not suitable for those who need to travel to work. It can, of course, be done, but will produce costs and issues.

 

As Gough- Olaya is finding.................................

[David Mack]

"So she quit her job, and sold her house and car, and used two thirds of the money to buy an electric narrowboat for £170,000."

 

And does this boat have enough solar power and battery storage to provide enough electricity to move the boat the necessary distance to comply with the CRT Ts and Cs she has signed up to?

[ditchcrawler]

7 minutes ago, David Mack said:

"So she quit her job, and sold her house and car, and used two thirds of the money to buy an electric narrowboat for £170,000."

 

And does this boat have enough solar power and battery storage to provide enough electricity to move the boat the necessary distance to comply with the CRT Ts and Cs she has signed up to?

"Weedy uses the remaining money saved from her house sale to cover unexpected costs, such as when her generator breaks or her boat is damaged." so it don't matter if the sun dont shine

 

[magnetman]

Sadly these things probably happen due to talking to the wrong people. Some people either through attitude or ignorance might think the CRT can never do anything. The problem is that they can and they do. T

 

To live on a Boat without a mooring is in fact an incredibly risky thing to do because as is being noted things can change. You basically don't have a right to be anywhere. It's a life which is entirely ruled by the statute governing the use of waterways. If people had this explained to them they might understand. 

 

 

 

I think there may be some people who genuinely believe that the navigation authority can't move the goal posts. The problem is that they can and they probably will. When that happens the voice looks very bad. There is a good reason when things are cheap and it is very often because there is a risk or quality problem.

 

 

 

 

I moved onto my first Boat in 1994 aged 19. I like it and can tolerate changes but for people who have come to the water at an older age from owning property thinking that living in a metal box on a ditch is some sort of enormous freedom there is reality lurking just around the corner.

[Alan de Enfield]

45 minutes ago, magnetman said:

It's a life which is entirely ruled by the statute governing the use of waterways

 

Unless you are the guy who posted yesterday, that as BW no longer exists the various "British Waterways" Acts of Parliament are now irellevant and the C&RT T&Cs are what has to be followed.

[Arthur Marshall]

Why would anyone spend 170 grand on a boat without doing any research, unless they're an idiot? 

If you spent that in a house you'd expect to have searches done so you were aware of any oddities.

At least when i bought mine I knew enough to sort a mooring out first, if not much else. But surely you'd work out whether the t&cs were going to make life difficult for you.

I hate to hark on, but this is the third thread where it appears someone is complaining that the rules they signed on to shouldn't apply to them because they don't like them - one as mentioned by Alan above. I think people are getting atupider, possibly because of a diet of YouTube fantasies and prettied up TV shows.

[Lady M]

Unfortunately people seem to have got used to ticking the T&C  box on a website without reading the rules.

[magnetman]

Another basic point is that having a narrowboat to live on is only sensible if you are going to do a lot of cruising about in narrow canals. I lived in narrows 24/365 for 15 years. A lot of this was cruising around on canals including narrow parts.

 

However if one is NOT moving about and enjoying the system the restriction of a narrow beam can actually be quite hard to deal with. It's basically not wide enough. For a lot of people this will present quite a serious psychological burden. Some will be fine, some will be in denial.

 

Spending £170k on a narrowboat in mid life and dumping the house is completely crazy. 

 

I know a lot about this as it's what my mum did (nowhere near that much money) and it really messed her up. I am convinced it was part of the reason she eventually took her own life.

 

It sounds severe and but jumping in at the deep end like that is a very unwise thing to be doing. It's too risky. Boats have a habit of presenting as if they are some sort of joyous life full of milk and honey with wonderful happiness forever but at the end of the day living in a  long thinmetal box floating in a ditch with dog shit outside and a muddy frozen public footpath to walk along is not in fact all that amazingly wonderful. 

 

Cruising about all year round and exploring the country was amazing. That is for sure but the static part less so, 

 

By forcing people to move more the CRT will be doing everyone a favour.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 11 by magnetman

[David Mack]

14 minutes ago, magnetman said:

However if one is NOT moving about and enjoying the system the restriction of a narrow beam can actually be quite hard to deal with. It's basically not wide enough.

 

Spending £170k on a narrowboat in mid life and dumping the house is completely crazy. 

But an electric widebeam would cost a lot more than her £170k narrow boat.

Edited January 11 by David Mack

[MtB]

3 minutes ago, David Mack said:

But an electric widebeam would cost a lot more than her £170k narrow boat.

 

 

Why does it have to be electric? Am I missing something? 

 

 

[magnetman]

I don't really see the point of buying a new one. All that happens is a massive depreciation. Loads of second hand wide vessels about for much less. There is actually nothing wrong with Diesel engines. 

Of course if their local area is a narrow canal that choice does not exist. 

People make their own choices but I wonder if they are going into it with open eyes or if the idea of a wonderful life of freedom clouds the judgment.

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

I think the interesting bit is this:

 

"At present, there are 5,725 open enforcement cases. Although not all of these relate to itinerant boaters, it means that roughly one in six boaters are currently facing investigation. The majority of these cases have been opened because boats have been spotted on the water by the charity without a licence.

However, 826 relate to itinerant boaters who have been refused a new licence because the CRT was unconvinced that they were compliant with the bona fide navigation requirement. A further 429 boaters with a valid licence face action for allegedly failing to comply with this rule."

 

Considering the number of boats that hardly ever leave their marinas or moorings (which would be 60% of those on my mooring), that's a huge proportion of those that do, and probably a majority. There appear to be a hell of lot of people who think that they only have to obey rules that suit them while ignoring others, and no doubt cursing at others who just pick different rules to break. Doesn't surprise me at all. There are plenty of apologists for rule bending on here.

[magnetman]

 

Far from ultimate freedom It's actually remarkably restricting to live in a metal tube which can go one way or the other on a ditch managed by a statutory body. Lovely for cruising and holidays but for full time living it is going to catch some people out.

 

 

 

It does make a lot of sense for the CRT to move in the direction of having a really good clean out. As a wise old friend who has been living on water since the late 60s idly said over a cup of tea "There are too many of us now".

 

At the end of the day if the CRT want more money from gov they probably need to turn canals into a public park. Very few people live in public parks.

 

Interesting times I think, 

[David Mack]

14 minutes ago, MtB said:

Why does it have to be electric? Am I missing something? 

 

Only that she chose to spend £170k on what appears to be a brand new electric narrow boat. So if she was following @magnetman's advice to go wide, she would presumably have specified something similar.

[Gybe Ho]

17 minutes ago, magnetman said:

 

Spending £170k on a narrowboat in mid life and dumping the house is completely crazy. 

 

 

Her ex. has got a mention in some of the YouTube episodes when he turns up in his car to help out as a free taxi service. Putting two & two together the electric narrowboat was purchased from the split proceeds of their house. Charlie the blue haired electric narrowboater has clocked up some serious cruising ranging from the River Nene, Northampton and the Lancaster Canal via one of the Pennine canals, she is not a CMer.

 

The other characters in the article are just regurgitating the predictable party line of the Bargee crowd and the longer the CRT dithers between receipt of the Commission Report and a plan of action, then the more ammunition the CRT feeds to Bargee crazies. As to the nurse! A mid ranking registered nurse is on £35k to £45k these days, that's enough to buy 4 months a winter towpath mooring from the CRT in order to stop the 14-day movement clock. The nurse is not a hardship case.

[Arthur Marshall]

7 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Only that she chose to spend £170k on what appears to be a brand new electric narrow boat. So if she was following @magnetman's advice to go wide, she would presumably have specified something similar.

She's not the one moaning about having to stay local for work though. She seems happy bumbling along every couple of weeks quite legally, just worried that it might become unaffordable. But hen she could have bought a perfectly good boat for half thevmoney and had a bigger emergency pot.

[Gybe Ho]

1 hour ago, magnetman said:

 

Far from ultimate freedom It's actually remarkably restricting to live in a metal tube which can go one way or the other on a ditch managed by a statutory body. Lovely for cruising and holidays but for full time living it is going to catch some people out.

 

 

It is a restricting lifestyle that 10,000+ liveaboards choose to embrace and presumably 1000's disagree with your opinion. Anyhow the article being discussed does not mention dissatisfaction over living in a 7ft wide tube.

 

There is a whole tiny-living and minimal simple living culture becoming established and a narrowboat is a natural fit. We should not be surprised that after 80 years of post-war consumer culture people are rejecting it and adopting an alternative.

 

Edited January 11 by Gybe Ho

[Ronaldo47]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Unless you are the guy who posted yesterday, that as BW no longer exists the various "British Waterways" Acts of Parliament are now irellevant and the C&RT T&Cs are what has to be followed.

The legislation that abolished BW will almost certainly include a schedule that transfers the rights and obligations of BW under the old Acts, to the legislation that establishes  its successor.  Such "transitional provisions" are normally provided when existing legislation is at least partially replaced by later legislation. 

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, Ronaldo47 said:

The legislation that abolished BW will almost certainly include a schedule that transfers the rights and obligations of BW under the old Acts, to the legislation that establishes  its successor.  Such "transitional provisions" are normally provided when existing legislation is at least partially replaced by later legislation. 

 

 

Any normal person would know that, but, even after being informed of that fact he said it was irellevant & the only thing that matters is compliance with the licence T&Cs.

 

 

 

Edited January 11 by Alan de Enfield

[magnetman]

12 hours ago, Gybe Ho said:

 

It is a restricting lifestyle that 10,000+ liveaboards choose to embrace and presumably 1000's disagree with your opinion. Anyhow the article being discussed does not mention dissatisfaction over living in a 7ft wide tube.

 

There is a whole tiny-living and minimal simple living culture becoming established and a narrowboat is a natural fit. We should not be surprised that after 80 years of post-war consumer culture people are rejecting it and adopting an alternative.

 

 

Yes. I live in a space the same size as a 50ft narrow. It's 9ft wide. No mains electric and no rotating generators. Just solar power year round.

I like small spaces. I also spent 15 years living in narrowboats including a 30 footer. 

 

She may not mention dissatisfaction with the narrow beam but she is dissatisfied about something otherwise would not be complaining. It could be the width of the vessel. It's not necessarily something people would be conscious of.

 

It's easy to discharge the responsibility for personal dissatisfaction onto the navigation authority. People do it all the time but they must have decided to live in a metal tube with their eyes open and an understanding that their life will be ruled by a statutory body who from time to time may apply for changes in their powers.

 

That's obvious. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you actually look at what is happening for example with the NBTA people have made the dubious decision to live in a metal box floating in a ditch. When they find it is not as great as they thought it would be (distinct lack of honey, roses and endless joy) they decide that the reason for the problems is the navigation authority. It's like someone held a gun to their head and told them to buy a Boat and tick a box saying they would be cruising about.

 

What a horrible thing to happen it is those demons at the CRT making life terrible.

 

What sort of warped psychology is this? If you can't deal with living on a boat and following the simple rules don't do it. If not complicated and yes the rules are subject to change from time to time.b

 

 

Edited January 12 by magnetman

[Tonka]

12 hours ago, magnetman said:

 

Far from ultimate freedom It's actually remarkably restricting to live in a metal tube which can go one way or the other on a ditch managed by a statutory body. Lovely for cruising and holidays but for full time living it is going to catch some people out.

 

 

 

It does make a lot of sense for the CRT to move in the direction of having a really good clean out. As a wise old friend who has been living on water since the late 60s idly said over a cup of tea "There are too many of us now".

 

At the end of the day if the CRT want more money from gov they probably need to turn canals into a public park. Very few people live in public parks.

 

Interesting times I think, 

Loads of people live in National Parks though.

[magnetman]

 

 

I was in London when the squatters all turned up on the Boats.

It's like that has discovered something nobody knew about. All very exciting. Obvious after a few winters it looks less joyous so they moan and make out it is salmon else's fault. 

 

It isn't ! 

3 minutes ago, Tonka said:

Loads of people live in National Parks though.

 

Without planning permission? 

 

 

Edited January 12 by magnetman

[Tonka]

1 minute ago, magnetman said:

 

 

I was in London when the squatters all turned up on the Boats.

It's like that has discovered something nobody knew about. All very exciting. Obvious after a few winters it looks less joyous so they moan and make it it is strike wise's fault. 

 

It isn't ! 

 

Without planning permission? 

 

 

Mostly with planning permission and no doubt some without