Replacing LOCKGATE diesel fired stove for a wood burner

[Luke777]

Hi all!

 

I'm new to boating and this website, I have just bought a wide beam dutch barge style boat and am looking to replace the diesel with a wood burner. 
The boat has central heating throughout, so hopefully wont get too cold...

Any thoughts?

 

Best 
Luke

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Welcome to the forum.

When you say wood burner, do you just intend burning wood? Most boaters using solid fuel have a multi fuel stove and burn smokeless "coal" mostly, with occasional wood, when available. Wood takes up a much higher volume of storage space than coal type fuel. Storage space is at a premium on board. There are differences in the grate and other design features between wood burning only and multi fuel stoves.

Back to the Lockgate. It will be based on a standard multi fuel stove, so the easiest approach would either be to convert it back, or to replace with the same type of stove in the solid fuel version. That way, size and positions of flue and any back boiler connections will be the same size and position.

The more usual question asked on the forum is about converting a stove from solid fuel to diesel, but the reverse is basically the same approach, but backwards.

You mention central heating. Is this heated from the stove via a backboiler or a separate system?

[Tony Brooks]

The plinth/hearth the stove sits on might need altering, as may the "walls" close to it. Tiles on wood and no air gap behind is NOT a very good idea. The wood behind tiles too close to a multifuel stove has been known to catch fire. Such stoves can run red hot.

 

BS 8511:2010 is at present advisory, but may become mandatory.

[Gybe Ho]

More inland boating people seem to upgrade to a diesel stove from solid fuel rather than the reverse. Longterm liveaboards appear to reach a point of capitulation where the daily chore of cleaning out a solid fuel stove motivates fitting a diesel replacement and at considerable cost.

 

If your boat's central heating copes with most routine winter heating and a wood burner is more of an occasional lifestyle interior ambiance thing then I get your thinking. Take note of @Tony Brooks comment and do a proper job with the installation including lining material and minimum stove air gaps, on a widebeam you should have the space. I suggest you read through the Marine Accident Investigation Branch report into a woodburner stove flashover fire that engulfed a narrowbeam and resulted in the death of a young woman on board. The investigators concluded that on balance the trigger for the tragedy were some domestic oversights including ornaments and paper stored too close to the stove.

Edited April 15 by Gybe Ho
Narrowbeam, not a Widebeam

[David Mack]

40 minutes ago, Gybe Ho said:

I suggest you read through the Marine Accident Investigation Branch report into a woodburner stove flashover fire that engulfed a widebeam and resulted in the death of a young woman on board.

Narrow boat Lindy Lou, not a widebeam.

https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/fire-on-narrow-boat-lindy-lou-at-lyme-view-marina-adlington-england-with-1-person-injured-and-loss-of-1-life

[IanD]

12 hours ago, Luke777 said:

Hi all!

 

I'm new to boating and this website, I have just bought a wide beam dutch barge style boat and am looking to replace the diesel with a wood burner. 
The boat has central heating throughout, so hopefully wont get too cold...

Any thoughts?

 

Best 
Luke

Where do you plan to moor while burning this wood?

 

If it's in urban areas, be warned that it's quite likely that you'll be caught out in the future by restrictions on domestic wood burning, triggered by PM2.5 pollution from all those trendy lifestyle woodburners in centrally-heated town houses and flats -- you should still be able to burn smokeless fuel, but this is more expensive and doesn't smell as nice as wood, especially "free" (scavanged) wood... 😞 

[LadyG]

I'm not convinced  smokeless is more expensive than wood, unless you are colllecting your own, and that is hard work, then it needs to be seasoned.

I use a mix of premium ovals and kiln dried birch,  the birch will act as kindling to the coal once the kindling has lit the logs. Trying to use firelighters to light to ovals as portrayed on the box is a joke most of the time. As to cost, I think bulk purchase saves about £10 on delivery charge.

I could never get a wood fire to stay in overnight, and that is when you need the warmth. My Webasto wakes me up if it comes on.

Edited April 15 by LadyG

[IanD]

13 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I'm not convinced  smokeless is more expensive than wood, unless you are colllecting your own, and that is hard work, then it needs to be seasoned.

I use a mix of premium ovals and kiln dried birch,  the birch will act as kindling to the coal once the kindling has lit the logs. Trying to use firelighters to light to ovals as portrayed on the box is a joke most of the time. As to cost, I think bulk purchase saves about £10 on delivery charge.

I could never get a wood fire to stay in overnight, and that is when you need the warmth. My Webasto wakes me up if it comes on.

If you're burning birch I'm not surprised you couldn't get a wood fire to stay in overnight -- burns too fast, oak and apple are better, ash is the best... 😉 

 

https://acmearb.com/some-cracking-firewood-poetry/

Edited April 15 by IanD

[LadyG]

3 hours ago, IanD said:

If you're burning birch I'm not surprised you couldn't get a wood fire to stay in overnight -- burns too fast, oak and apple are better, ash is the best... 😉 

 

https://acmearb.com/some-cracking-firewood-poetry/

I have tried them all, oak, alder ash, but i always use the ovals which are cheaper, and take less storage space. The form a good bed and generally stay in all night 

i use the birch as kindling for my coals as previously stated. 

Edited April 15 by LadyG

[IanD]

3 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I have tried them all, oak, alder ash, but i always use the ovals which are cheaper, and take less storage space.

Indeed, not surprising since they've got more energy density than wood -- which is only cheaper if you scavenge it, like I said. Still, birch is a poor choice for a long-lasting fire, which is the point I was making... 😉 

[GUMPY]

When I replaced my Kabola oil burner it was a complete new install as the flue was a different size. This meant new flue, roof collar and chimney.

If your heating or calorifier runs off a stove back boiler that's another nightmare you will have to deal with.

It won't be a simple swap.

 

[David Mack]

17 hours ago, Luke777 said:

am looking to replace the diesel with a wood burner. 

I suppose the question must be 'Why'?

Other contributors have covered some of the pitfalls, but what is it you so much dislike about the diesel stove? A preference for solid fuel if you had no stove and were installing from scratch is one thing, but changing one for the other looks to make little sense if the diesel stove is doing its job OK.

[GUMPY]

4 minutes ago, David Mack said:

but changing one for the other looks to make little sense if the diesel stove is doing its job OK.

I changed from solid fuel to diesel back in 2002 as I didn't want the mess. Changed back when diesel prices skyrocketed a few years later. Paid for the cost of the new stove and install from savings in the first winter and selling the Kabola.

Never burned wood in 25+ years of living on board as it doesn't stay in for 12 hours  like solid fuel can.

[Luke777]

Hi all, thank you for the great advice so far. As I’m a total novice to this it’s really helpful. 
 

I’m not sure how hot the boat will be over winter, The vessels was also heated with a fresh water radiator system heated via the diesel fired Wabascoboiler - has anyone had experience with them and are they any good?

 

so maybe keep the diesel burner?

 

The previous owner has installed in it a very strange place that makes no send for the room of the layout of the open plan area. 
 

So my thinking is either to move it or replace it completely. I’ve always been really drawn to a log burner or solid fuel for aesthetics of a real flame. 
 

Perhaps even I could look at moving the diesel burner for practicality and having a small wood or solid fuel burner as more of a focal point where I can burn solid when I want?

 

[Jen-in-Wellies]

You are overthinking things at this stage. A common thing with new boat owners. I did it myself too. See how the heating performs next winter and make any changes after that.

The Webasto needs electricity to run it's pump and electronics. Ate you likely to be hooked up to a landline for the winter? If not, how are you generating the power required?

Both the existing systems will likely be fine. Unless the boat was for sale because the previous owner died of hypothermia on board, then don't worry about it

 

[Luke777]

Hahah no dying of hypothermia, the previous owner decided it was too much for her living on a boat. Okay, you’re right, I’ll see how the winter goes and make a decision from there 

[Gybe Ho]

3 minutes ago, Luke777 said:

Hahah no dying of hypothermia, the previous owner decided it was too much for her living on a boat. Okay, you’re right, I’ll see how the winter goes and make a decision from there 

 

Spend a year getting to know your boat first before initiating a big project that starts with breaking things. The illogical poorly positioned diesel stove could make more sense once you appreciate how well it radiates heat when your batteries are too low to run the Webasto. If you are keen to engage with your new boat and do something, find some rust in the bilges to treat.