maintain a cruising log

[nairb123]

Sorry if this has already been covered, but I read with interest about the information now collected about our cruising habits.  And that we can upload information about where we stop.  Including pic of where we stop with gps info.

Its from this page

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/boating/license-your-boat/boat-licensing-compliance-and-enforcement-team/how-we-monitor-boat-movement

 

Does anybody actually do this.  Like nip out and turn on your gps on your mobile phone and take pic of where you have stopped and the upload them.

Maybe we and the family/friends should also be wearing ankle tags

ta

nairb

[frahkn]

2 hours ago, nairb123 said:

Sorry if this has already been covered, but I read with interest about the information now collected about our cruising habits.  And that we can upload information about where we stop.  Including pic of where we stop with gps info.

Its from this page

https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/boating/license-your-boat/boat-licensing-compliance-and-enforcement-team/how-we-monitor-boat-movement

 

Does anybody actually do this.  Like nip out and turn on your gps on your mobile phone and take pic of where you have stopped and the upload them.

Maybe we and the family/friends should also be wearing ankle tags

ta

nairb

I don't have gps on my mobile phone (or, I think, anywhere else) but I do keep a log of my moorings, distance and locks between them and a couple of other things. This is for my own interest but CART are welcome to have a look if they wish.

I do about 500 miles per year without difficulty despite spending only 6 months or so on the boat. 

 

[blackrose]

4 minutes ago, frahkn said:

I don't have gps on my mobile phone (or, I think, anywhere else) 

 

You must have quite an old mobile phone then. Most smart phones had GPS by about 15 years ago. 

[Naughty Cal]

We always kept a log for our own purposes and I take photos of places we stop.

 

I still do with the van. 

 

Makes for interesting reading looking back over the years.

 

I also stick a virtual pin in every place we stay on Google Earth which is a great reminder of places we have visited.

Edited March 16, 2025 by Naughty Cal

[Alway Swilby]

I don't see anything in the article about having to upload the photos to their web site every day, or at all, only that you should take a photo. We tend to do that anyway. Location data on the phone is just permanently on once you have turned it on. You will only need these photos if you get into a dispute with CRT about your movements.

[Naartjie AKA Duck Hatch]

Yes it is definitely a good idea. Keep a detailed log & take pictures. I use GPS Map Camera app on my android phone. It superimposes the GPS position on the photo. Had a dispute with CaRT. The GPS tagged photos & receipts I kept sorted it out.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 16, 2025 by Naartjie AKA Duck Hatch

[Russ T]

5 hours ago, blackrose said:

 

You must have quite an old mobile phone then. Most smart phones had GPS by about 15 years ago. 

I didn't read anything in that post to suggest it was a smartphone. Where are you getting that from? In fact, many modern 'dumb phones' are available that don't have GPS.

[David Schweizer]

We kept both a diary and log book when we had Helvetia, Nothing fancy or electronic, just traditional pen and paper. We still have them despite havig sold the boat nine years ago. It serves of a usefull reminder of the various places we visited.

 

 

Edited March 16, 2025 by David Schweizer

[Tony Brooks]

5 hours ago, blackrose said:

 

You must have quite an old mobile phone then. Most smart phones had GPS by about 15 years ago. 

 

Neither my nor my wife's mobile phones have GPS or a camera, and they are far newer than 15 years old, but they are phones, not hand held computers that can make phone calls and take photos/videos.

[NEBUCHADNEZZAR]

I keep a record in Google maps. It's free and easy to do. Also a good option as last year CRT incorrectly said I was moored at the same place (waterpoint) for 3 months, when actually I visited once, filled up, cruised for 3 months then returned and filled up again. Always helps to have your own log.

[Russ T]

Quote

If you have a digital camera or do not want to turn on location settings on your smartphone, please take photos showing the boat at an identifiable location, for example, a local landmark or Canal & River Trust signage. Date stamps can be included on digital camera photographs in the camera’s settings.

I suspect many digital cameras are also capable of geotagging images as well as date stamping them. I am surprised this wasn't mentioned (maybe I missed it).

[Big Bob W]

Out of interest, I just checked my sightings on the CRT licensing webpage.
Since January 2024, I only have 2 sightings recorded - and one of those was on my home mooring in the marina.
In that time, we have cruised around 300 hours. Not a huge amount, but I would have expected to have been spotted a few more times.

[Tony Brooks]

1 minute ago, Big Bob W said:

Out of interest, I just checked my sightings on the CRT licensing webpage.
Since January 2024, I only have 2 sightings recorded - and one of those was on my home mooring in the marina.
In that time, we have cruised around 300 hours. Not a huge amount, but I would have expected to have been spotted a few more times.

 

That is the problem with CaRT spottings, there are not enough and, from experience, the location entered is not accurate, and I can see not much evidence of cross-checking against sightings in other locations. It seems the UK justice system operates on an accused being innocent until proven guilty, but it is clear CaRT thinks boaters are guilty until the boater proves themselves innocent. This sort of thing was one factor that encouraged me to give up boating, be it a minor one.

[frahkn]

3 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Neither my nor my wife's mobile phones have GPS or a camera, and they are far newer than 15 years old, but they are phones, not hand held computers that can make phone calls and take photos/videos.

Exactly! Mine shows no indication of being smart but its fine for calls and these new-fangled texts. Has good battery life as I don't switch it on unless I'm about to use it.

 

I think it has a camera (it has what might be a lens on the front); I've never used it because I have a camera.

 

 

[nairb123]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

 but it is clear CaRT thinks boaters are guilty until the boater proves themselves innocent. This sort of thing was one factor that encouraged me to give up boating, be it a minor one.

This is exactly what I thought.  So I have to take evidence of where I have been.  That evidence has to be up to the standard excepted by the c&rt.  This evidence has to be stored safely - off the phone/camera in case of loss or damage to the item.  And presumably in a way that the evidence cannot be altered later.  eg adding/changing gps or time/date stamps.

I am surprised they have not made it part of the bss to have a GPS system fitted to all boats such that data about movements can be downloaded like smart meters.  

Paid for by the boater.  How long before facial recognition cameras will be fitted at certain points on the canals to capture who is at the tiller.

 

I don't have many years left on the canal (old age) but with the potential ending of diesel engined boats and the removal of wood burning stoves the nature of boating is changing beyond what I have enjoyed over the last 30+ years.  I am sure there will be a resounding "changed for the better"

[Alan de Enfield]

19 minutes ago, nairb123 said:

I am surprised they have not made it part of the bss to have a GPS system fitted to all boats

 

They could possibly add it to the licence requirements but as I'm sure you know, the function of the BSS is to minimise the risk of fire and explosion resulting in injuries to passers-by (not the boater)

 

From the BSS :

 

The Boat Safety Scheme, or BSS, is a public safety initiative run as a not-for-profit company limited by guarantee. Our role in supporting navigation and harbour authorities, is to help reduce the risk of boat fires, explosions, carbon monoxide or pollution from boats harming visitors to the inland waterways, the waterways' workforce, other waterways users and property on or alongside the waterways.

 

[Russ T]

25 minutes ago, nairb123 said:

This is exactly what I thought.  So I have to take evidence of where I have been.  That evidence has to be up to the standard excepted by the c&rt.  This evidence has to be stored safely - off the phone/camera in case of loss or damage to the item.  And presumably in a way that the evidence cannot be altered later.  eg adding/changing gps or time/date stamps.

I am surprised they have not made it part of the bss to have a GPS system fitted to all boats such that data about movements can be downloaded like smart meters.  

Paid for by the boater.  How long before facial recognition cameras will be fitted at certain points on the canals to capture who is at the tiller.

 

I don't have many years left on the canal (old age) but with the potential ending of diesel engined boats and the removal of wood burning stoves the nature of boating is changing beyond what I have enjoyed over the last 30+ years.  I am sure there will be a resounding "changed for the better"

 

Except you don't have to do that. The clue is in the word recommend. It is not mandatory.

 

Quote

How should I log my cruising?

We recommend that all boaters, particularly continuous cruisers, maintain a cruising log. This helps if there is ever any concern about our sightings.

 

[Alway Swilby]

5 hours ago, NEBUCHADNEZZAR said:

I keep a record in Google maps. It's free and easy to do. Also a good option as last year CRT incorrectly said I was moored at the same place (waterpoint) for 3 months, when actually I visited once, filled up, cruised for 3 months then returned and filled up again. Always helps to have your own log.

I bet when you contacted CRT about your alleged overstay they were fine about it and didn't require you to send any evidence?

[Torblimey]

If you have a Cerbo GX with a usb GPS plugged in then the victron app will constantly record the GPS details for you.

Not sure just how many months/years worth it will record although I can go back to installation date in April last year for now.

Google maps is also pretty good with the timeline locations although be aware it now stores the details on your device and not in the cloud unless you ask it too.

[NEBUCHADNEZZAR]

At first they said i was wrong, until I said I keep a record and can prove where I was. They suddenly said it was fine and not to worry.

[alias]

12 minutes ago, NEBUCHADNEZZAR said:

At first they said i was wrong, until I said I keep a record and can prove where I was. They suddenly said it was fine and not to worry.

 

Perhaps they realised that their evidence was weak. As they claim they check boat locations every two weeks they would need to explain why they had no sightings in between those two that were three months apart unless you had moved during the period.

[NEBUCHADNEZZAR]

Travelled 30 miles (winter time) during that 3 months. Suspiciously never clocked the boat elsewhere in that time.

[nairb123]

I have found my "boat sightings on their web licensing customer account" and I can confirm their surveillance records are correct.  They seem to be recorded about once a month. 

22 minutes ago, NEBUCHADNEZZAR said:

At first they said i was wrong, until I said I keep a record and can prove where I was. They suddenly said it was fine and not to worry.

Can you ask for proof of their evidence?

[NEBUCHADNEZZAR]

3 minutes ago, nairb123 said:

I have found my "boat sightings on their web licensing customer account" and I can confirm their surveillance records are correct.  They seem to be recorded about once a month. 

Can you ask for proof of their evidence?

Don't know. The issue I had was, I was sighted in the same place 3 months apart, which is correct. But they had no sightings in between and just assumed I was there the whole time.

[Naughty Cal]

13 minutes ago, NEBUCHADNEZZAR said:

Don't know. The issue I had was, I was sighted in the same place 3 months apart, which is correct. But they had no sightings in between and just assumed I was there the whole time.

You provided an explanation which was acceptable to CRT. So not really an issue at all!