Reversing

[dogless]

I think you misunderstand the term 'practice' in that context.

 

If you always do what you've always done , you will indeed always get what you've always got.

 

Experimentation to discover what works best for you, on your boat is the practice being suggested.

 

Rog

[Rob-M]

50 minutes ago, Stroudwater1 said:

I’ve learn much from this thread, we luckily do have a large rudder and definitely we can steer in reverse. I hadn’t fully understood the 45 degree bit though and was going to 90 degree which has been hopeless. 

Definitely slower revs is better and you do need to straighten and set the boat straight before reversing otherwise you continue to drift the way you were going in forewards…. 
 

Practicing in the evening is the way to go in a quiet place. 
 

Another technique is using a long shaft/ pole especially from the bow. That can be really effective.
 

Ideally you need two crew. I’ve found getting a shallow angle better and prodding rather than pushing too hard for too long, the pole can get stuck in mud. Pushing away from the direction the boat is going in is much better (ie facing toward the stern and pushing backwards) otherwise it could be dangerous with the pole being pushed into the mud and getting suddenly stuck. Stand to the side of the pole too. 
 

I’ve seen experts handle buttys really well using long poles, getting out of Hawne basin isn’t easy in a 70 foot butty with Gongoozlers getting up after a long weekend cruise but these guys knew what they were doing (I like to think)  😀. 
 

 

It's fun reversing the pair breasted up along the main line between Sandy Turn and Rotton Park junctions.

[Tonka]

Just now, dogless said:

I think you misunderstand the term 'practice' in that context.

 

If you always do what you've always done , you will indeed always get what you've always got.

 

Experimentation to discover what works best for you, on your boat is the practice being suggested.

 

Rog

If you practice swinging a golf club but are not using your hips. Doing it 100 times will not make it perfect. But if you do it correctly 100 times your game of gold will improve.

 

With reversing narrowboats you need to experiment to find out what works for your narrowboat because it may not work for another narrowboat. Size of prop, rpm, size of rudder, length of swim and depth of boat all make a difference. As does depth of canal where you are doing it

 

https://www.deuchars.org.uk/publication/

Lots of info here plus he has a book which is very good

[dogless]

I've never heard of the swinging golf club method of reversing 🤣

 

Rog

[Russ T]

3 minutes ago, dogless said:

I've never heard of the swinging golf club method of reversing 🤣

 

Rog

That's because if you hit a plastic boat using this method, you might get a hole in one.

[dmr]

1 hour ago, Stroudwater1 said:

I’ve learn much from this thread, we luckily do have a large rudder and definitely we can steer in reverse. I hadn’t fully understood the 45 degree bit though and was going to 90 degree which has been hopeless. 

Definitely slower revs is better and you do need to straighten and set the boat straight before reversing otherwise you continue to drift the way you were going in forewards…. 
 

Practicing in the evening is the way to go in a quiet place. 
 

Another technique is using a long shaft/ pole especially from the bow. That can be really effective.
 

Ideally you need two crew. I’ve found getting a shallow angle better and prodding rather than pushing too hard for too long, the pole can get stuck in mud. Pushing away from the direction the boat is going in is much better (ie facing toward the stern and pushing backwards) otherwise it could be dangerous with the pole being pushed into the mud and getting suddenly stuck. Stand to the side of the pole too. 
 

I’ve seen experts handle buttys really well using long poles, getting out of Hawne basin isn’t easy in a 70 foot butty with Gongoozlers getting up after a long weekend cruise but these guys knew what they were doing (I like to think)  😀. 
 

 

A pole (long shaft?) can work really well, especially against a washwall. It can be tricky with a soft silty bottom, by the time you have got the pole through the silt to a firm bottom the boat has moved too far backwards to get a good push. If the pole feels stuck in the silt a quick twist and then a pull should get it out quickly.

 

I did see a single hander set his boat in reverse then walk to the front a steer with the pole, that was brave.

[Tonka]

And don't be embarrassed if your wife is better at it then you

[nb Innisfree]

With Innisfree prop walk wasn't very noticeable when in reverse unless near piling when it seemed to go in the opposite direction most of the time, I eventually came to the conclusion that the prop helix when in reverse would bounce back off the piling and hit the swim and push it away...but sometimes it could go either way or neither, it seemed to depend on water depth and shape of canal bed near the pilings.

I could never reliably guess which way it would go, so just adjusted to behaviour at each occasion. Very complex. 

 

ETA: It also depended on which side the piling was on, if on the stb side prop walk would often be conventional, but then again depth of water and canal  bed blurred the results. 

 

Witchcraft

Edited March 17 by nb Innisfree

[Stroudwater1]

3 hours ago, Tonka said:

And don't be embarrassed if your wife is better at it then you

She must practice more than you then I guess? 

[ditchcrawler]

6 hours ago, Tonka said:

If you practice swinging a golf club but are not using your hips. Doing it 100 times will not make it perfect. But if you do it correctly 100 times your game of gold will improve.

 

With reversing narrowboats you need to experiment to find out what works for your narrowboat because it may not work for another narrowboat. Size of prop, rpm, size of rudder, length of swim and depth of boat all make a difference. As does depth of canal where you are doing it

 

https://www.deuchars.org.uk/publication/

Lots of info here plus he has a book which is very good

I find the waters you are on make a massive difference to what happens. I use to moor at park farm marina on the T&M , enter the marina, wind and then revers along and down between the finger pontoons. Had people ask if I was using a bow thruster. Nice open water and constant depth. now get on a canal, maybe one side is a hard edge and the other mud from the centre line to the offside bank with just inches of water on it in places tapering down to full depth in others. All of this will effect how the boat behaves as you try to reverse and the displaced water tries to go up each side of the boat and some underneath it

[Bee]

And some boats -often shallow draughted cruiser types - just will not steer backwards, Bee is a fairly hefty steel boat but has little sideways resistance and whatever you do with the rudder it cannot overcome the tendency to go round in ever tighter circles.

[Martin Nicholas]

When steering forwards or backwards the force on your arms via the rudder & tiller is the same force pushing the back end round. In reverse the maximum turning force will be around 45 degrees, but it is dependant on the water speed over the rudder. Lots of other factors at play too I imagine. The rudder is acting as a hydrofoil; see also foil.

Edited March 18 by Martin Nicholas
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