water filtration - anyone tried offgrid water on the River Lea?

[BecsF]

Hi there,

I'm considering installing a water filtration system from Offgrid Water. It's filters and a Reverse Osmosis system under the sink, and also remineralises it (and is much cheaper, and with cheaper components than Water Freedom's). I've spoken to Damian (who's company it is) and he's assured me it would make even the River Lea water drinkable, and has sent me his test results. However, I don't really know what to be looking for here and would love to hear from anyone who has this system - in particular about the testing you do on the water, and what to be checking for. I know the Lea is heavily polluted, including with sewage at times. But if it works then it would make life so much easier given the water tank on my new boat is smaller to my last.

 

Thanks in advance

 

 

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Presumably there is some electrical consumption by this system. Do the manufacturers say how many Ahr a day it will consume for your likely use rate? How do you plan to replace those amp hours from the batteries in winter?

How hard is it to use the taps provided as part of your CaRT boat license on the Lea?

[Tony Brooks]

1 minute ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Presumably there is some electrical consumption by this system. Do the manufacturers say how many Ahr a day it will consume for your likely use rate? How do you plan to replace those amp hours from the batteries in winter?

How hard is it to use the taps provided as part of your CaRT boat license on the Lea?

 

THIS ^^^^^^^^

 

Replacing the electricity used seemed to be the stumbling block each time this was raised in the past. PERHAPS Li batteries and loads of solar may have made it more practical, but that needs exceptionally careful consideration because I doubt the system is cheap.

 

If the OP has LA batteries, then I am sceptical about the ability to recharge unless they are on a shoreline.

[BecsF]

It seems to be you run the pump forcing the water through the filters and then into your water tank so only uses power at this point (and would need the inverter). But maybe I'm wrong?

 

In terms of using the tap, obviously that's what I've done and what most people do - I'm just a bit concerned that it will involve moving more than I would like/need to do and as I will be living on my own it may just make life a lot easier. There is also a washing machine on this boat which it would be great to be able to use!

[Tonka]

7 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Presumably there is some electrical consumption by this system. Do the manufacturers say how many Ahr a day it will consume for your likely use rate? How do you plan to replace those amp hours from the batteries in winter?

How hard is it to use the taps provided as part of your CaRT boat license on the Lea?

You have to move the boat for the hose to reach. 

[Tony Brooks]

3 minutes ago, BecsF said:

It seems to be you run the pump forcing the water through the filters and then into your water tank so only uses power at this point (and would need the inverter). But maybe I'm wrong?

 

In terms of using the tap, obviously that's what I've done and what most people do - I'm just a bit concerned that it will involve moving more than I would like/need to do and as I will be living on my own it may just make life a lot easier. There is also a washing machine on this boat which it would be great to be able to use!

 

Yes, but how much electricity dos that pump use? To get a decent flow through the filters probably needs a more powerful pump than a typical boat water pump, and that means using more electricity. A less powerful and thus a pump that uses less electricity will take longer to fill the tank, so it works out pretty much the same.

 

How much electrcity does that system demand

How long will the system need to run to fill your tank

Do you have lithium batteries or lead acids

Do you have a shoreline

How much solar do you have

How do you recharge your batters at present, and how long does it take you.

 

Don't answer, they are rhetorical questions that you need to answer before you can work out if it is even practical.

 

Another question that your reply poses and that is if you have no home mooring do you understand CaRT's requirements for boat minimum movement of boats licensed as having no home mooring.

[BecsF]

Those are all v important questions - I'm working out my power usage at the moment and what batteries/solar I will need so I will contact Offgrid water to get more detailed answers on the power usage.

 

I've been a continuous cruiser for last 4 years so do understand the movement requirements, and also where the water points are (and the queues/slow taps etc.) and this has prompted my looking into filtration - as I know with a smaller tank I will have to fill up more often, and travel more than the CRT requires to do this. I haven't settled on using this system yet as I wanted to gauge people's opinions here on the water quality first.

 

Thanks

 

 

[Mac of Cygnet]

33 minutes ago, BecsF said:

Those are all v important questions - I'm working out my power usage at the moment and what batteries/solar I will need so I will contact Offgrid water to get more detailed answers on the power usage.

 

I've been a continuous cruiser for last 4 years so do understand the movement requirements, and also where the water points are (and the queues/slow taps etc.) and this has prompted my looking into filtration - as I know with a smaller tank I will have to fill up more often, and travel more than the CRT requires to do this. I haven't settled on using this system yet as I wanted to gauge people's opinions here on the water quality first.

 

Thanks

 

 

This is the bit which jumped out at me.

[GUMPY]

There was a boater in Berko years ago who thanked his neighbour for filling his water tank every week when they did theirs.

Said neighbor was perplexed as he had never done it. 

Turned out there was a crack in the steel and the water tank had been self filling from the canal for the best part of 18 months.

So the chap had been drinking canal water all that time😱

[Wafi]

Power usage stats are on their website - 1.6 litres per minute at 75W. So, assuming their numbers can be trusted, 15 litres per Ah (at 12V). My suspicion would be that these figures all assume you're using brand new filters and also that the yield will drop if there's anything in the water that actually needs filtering.

 

Ocean-going yachts have used watermakers for years, and can be considered a mature technology. They tend to use rather more power than this device, for a lower flow rate. This begs a few questions:

• Are the power consumption stats quoted for this product accurate?
• If this equipment can't cope with salt water, what other dissolved chemicals is it also letting through?
• How often will the consumables need to be renewed for your use case, and what will be the cost?

Remember, if the water isn't coming from a mountain stream you don't just need to remove pathogens (viruses, bacteria, amoebae etc), you also need to remove chemical pollutants.

 

The company appears to be a small startup. I see little information on how many units they've actually sold (if any), or how durable the kit is in real usage; the pumps appear to have a 1-year warranty, and even that relies on the company still being in business. Are you happy to gamble £1600 plus whatever you need to spend on enhancing your power generation capacity, on something that (worst case scenario) you may have to chuck in the skip 6 months from now?

 

They also offer no water quality guarantee, suggesting you conduct your own testing (I'm not sure how you're supposed to do this before purchase). So, aswell as being prepared to gamble your money, you either need to gamble your health, or perform tests on every batch of water you produce (which is what the water companies do). Do you know what contaminants you'd need to test for, how to perform those tests, and how much the testing equipment would cost?

 

Given the issues I've had over the years with boat equipment from reliable UK-based manufacturers, I'd be very wary of a company that doesn't publish a UK address or even a landline phone number on its website; how can we be sure it's not one guy with an optimistic outlook on health and safety, getting stuff drop-shipped from China?

[jim mitchell]

1 hour ago, Wafi said:

Power usage stats are on their website - 1.6 litres per minute at 75W

Isn't that just the LED ultraviolet lamp , there is a figure 1.4W  on standby ,  i couldn't see any pump consumption given 

[Wafi]

16 minutes ago, jim mitchell said:

Isn't that just the LED ultraviolet lamp , there is a figure 1.4W  on standby ,  i couldn't see any pump consumption given 

Ah yes, you're right. I managed to find that somewhere else - 200W for 10-12 litres per minute.

 

Separately it says you need to change the filters every 1500-2000 litres, though I can't find any information on where to buy replacement filters or how much they cost. They're not listed in the online shop, are they even available? 1500 litres is about 4 tanks worth on my boat; the only scenario in which replacing 6 filters (cost unknown) makes more sense than filling your tank 4 times (for free) at passing water points, is if your boat never goes anywhere.

 

Almost every product is listed as "Pre order sale", whatever that means, or with a 2 week lead time. I can't make up my mind whether this is a drop-shipping operation or just plain fantasy. Assuming it is real, I wouldn't count on continued availability of spares (or even consumables).

 

I do get it, the idea of being totally self-sufficient is very alluring, but spending large amounts of money on expensive kit to produce something that's given away for free all over the network is just nuts; more so when the free stuff is almost certainly a far higher quality.

[LadyG]

I dont drink the water from my tank other than for tea, though i realse that's a bit half hearted, I would certainly never want to consume Thames water, having tasted it once .

Bottled plain water is available at reasonable prices, and one knows that the premium source brands are pure rather than processed river water which may contain things you should not put in your body.

If I had kiddywinks I'd be buying bottled water for all their consumer needs.

I dont think using filters would necessarily remove every noxious component, it depends on the process, but just using filters which effectively strain the water is not likely to remove chemicals, and probably not the smallest molecules.

The use of in U/V in industrial processes is fine, but the lamp needs to be replaced as per manufacturers spec. How you monitor this on a boat could be tricky, I've seen some being used in industry and never replaced.

It depends on cost, but if all water is to be filtered it's going to be complex. I'm not fanatic, but I do buy organic when possible, saving the environment is important.

Edited March 7, 2025 by LadyG

[David Mack]

8 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Bottled plain water is available at reasonable prices, and one knows that the premium source brands are pure rather than processed river water which may contain things you should not put in your body.

Peckham Spring?

[IanD]

10 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I dont drink the water from my tank other than for tea, though i realse that's a bit half hearted, I would certainly never want to consume Thames water, having tasted it once .

Bottled plain water is available at reasonable prices, and one knows that the premium source brands are pure rather than processed river water which may contain things you should not put in your body.

If I had kiddywinks I'd be buying bottled water for all their consumer needs.

I dont think using filters would necessarily remove every noxious component, it depends on the process, but just using filters which effectively strain the water is not likely to remove chemicals, and probably not the smallest molecules.

The use of in U/V in industrial processes is fine, but the lamp needs to be replaced as per manufacturers spec. How you monitor this on a boat could be tricky, I've seen some being used in industry and never replaced.

It depends on cost, but if all water is to be filtered it's going to be complex. I'm not fanatic, but I do buy organic when possible, saving the environment is important.

 

Unfortunately that's not really true, in spite of what some people believe and repeat on t'internet... 😉 

[jim mitchell]

2 minutes ago, IanD said:

Unfortunately that's not really true, in spite of what some people believe and repeat on t'internet... 😉

As in pure as a mountain stream - which just flowed over half a dozen decomposing carcasses, through two wild camper sites occupied by uncaring 'nomads' ??😖

[Tony Brooks]

3 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Unfortunately that's not really true, in spite of what some people believe and repeat on t'internet... 😉 

 

Did not Coke a Cola get caught out filtering, to an unknown extent, mains water for their "pure" bottled water brand.  I am also fairly sure that if mineral water was filtered to remove microbes, a lot of minerals would go as well.

[LadyG]

8 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Unfortunately that's not really true, in spite of what some people believe and repeat on t'internet... 😉 

I believe that Evian water is from the source, do you have other  evidence?

 

[Hudds Lad]

1 minute ago, LadyG said:

I believe that Evian water is from the source, do you have other  evidence?

 

I've always found it interesting that if you spell Evian backwards you get.....

 

Mad to spend good money on basically Council Pop in fancy bottles that you've no idea how long it's been sat in a warehouse.

Simple solution, avoid all water, drink only alcoholic beverages  

[LadyG]

21 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Did not Coke a Cola get caught out filtering, to an unknown extent, mains water for their "pure" bottled water brand.  I am also fairly sure that if mineral water was filtered to remove microbes, a lot of minerals would go as well.

Yes the Great Cocal Cola water scandal, I think it was branded as Tab. It did not take long for the 'source' to be revealed. I would assume some of cheaper water brands are nothing more than mains water that has been filtered, sterilised, maybe by UV, bottled, so handy for boaters and caravaners who are not taking water direct from mains. There are some UK springs which are bottled, and some are tastier than others.

12 minutes ago, Hudds Lad said:

I've always found it interesting that if you spell Evian backwards you get.....

 

Mad to spend good money on basically Council Pop in fancy bottles that you've no idea how long it's been sat in a warehouse.

Simple solution, avoid all water, drink only alcoholic beverages  

I think the date of manufacture will be stamped on each container,, but as they only have this one process, its very unlikely that any nasty bacteria find their way inside the bottle.  Testing samples will be done frequently, not to mention monitoring.

The bottles don't make money being stored in warehouse  

Having worked for Local Councils, I can assure you they know very little about industrial processes.

The people who actually source your water are not likely to be the Council, you are thinking about your Council Tax, where you probably pay for supply and disposal.

 

 

 

 

Edited March 7, 2025 by LadyG

[Hudds Lad]

9 minutes ago, LadyG said:

The people who actually supply your water are not likely to be the Council, you are thinking about your Council Tax.

I know, it's an old local term for tap water. Council Pop, Duck Wine, etc.  

 

Yorkshire Water supply ours, when it's not leaking into the road somewhere. I even got an £835.50 bill yesterday to prove it  

[David Mack]

15 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I would assume some of cheaper water brands are nothing more than mains water that has been filtered, sterilised, maybe by UV, bottled,

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/tesco-and-asda-deny-claims-that-ownbrand-bottled-water-is-in-fact-tap-water-8059703.html

 

16 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Yes the Great Cocal Cola water scandal, I think it was branded as Tab.

Dasani water.

 

 

[Wafi]

One of the key benefits of bottled water and tap water (which is generally processed river water) is that they're subject to robust quality control; whether or not the "mineral" aspect appeals, you can be pretty confident that there's nothing in the water that will harm you. Even the fake mineral water (Dasani was the best known) is guaranteed by the manufacturer to be safe to drink. If you drink from a mountain stream you're taking a calculated risk, which you manage by checking upstream for dead sheep and possibly using a portable filter. Most people I know are comfortable with this level of risk.

Attempting to purify water yourself, from a river that's known to be heavily polluted, using a kit you bought from some random guy on the Internet - who explicitly tells you to perform your own testing to determine whether the output is safe for human consumption - is another level of risk entirely.

[LadyG]

23 hours ago, BecsF said:

 There is also a washing machine on this boat which it would be great to be able to use!

Depends how it's plumbed, mine is connected to the calorifier and when working , I believe it runs fairly hot, assuming the engine is running. I've never used it...

If you want to ensure your clothes are both free of dirt,  and bacteria, to an acceptable standard, Dettol make a laundry product.  I sometimes use it for hand washing.

 

 

54 minutes ago, jim mitchell said:

As in pure as a mountain stream - which just flowed over half a dozen decomposing carcasses, through two wild camper sites occupied by uncaring 'nomads' ??😖

The idea is you climb the mountain to the source of the spring, higher than the snow line, which is a thousand foot higher than the sheep line

 

 

Edited March 7, 2025 by LadyG

[Tonka]

Our old boat Tilly No. 2 was up for sale last year and moors in the London area. It is a Mike Heywood 50 footer. When it was up for sale I looked at the advert and that has a water filtration system on it as there was a photo of it. If you see it perhaps ask them how they get on with it