Does anyone know of Antone in the Stratford Upon Avon area that can fit a Victron system to a narrow boat

[Billy123]

😀

[matty40s]

Antone has moved.

[zenataomm]

He now works in a Gents' Outfitters.

[MtB]

19 hours ago, Billy123 said:

😀

 

"Does anyone know of Antone in the Stratford Upon Avon area that can fit a Victron system to a narrow boat"

 

As the originator of the thread, I think you can edit the thread title to correct your spilling mistake. 

 

Assuming you meant "anyone", that is. 

 

 

 

[LadyG]

7 hours ago, MtB said:

 

"Does anyone know of Antone in the Stratford Upon Avon area that can fit a Victron system to a narrow boat"

 

As the originator of the thread, I think you can edit the thread title to correct your spilling mistake. 

 

Assuming you meant "anyone", that is. 

 

 

 

I must be dim, I didn't pick up on that. The essence of the request I found strange, as I am not aware of ' a Victron system',  but I could be wrong.

[MtB]

10 hours ago, LadyG said:

I must be dim, I didn't pick up on that. The essence of the request I found strange, as I am not aware of ' a Victron system',  but I could be wrong.

 

 

<Bites tongue>

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

10 hours ago, LadyG said:

I must be dim, I didn't pick up on that. The essence of the request I found strange, as I am not aware of ' a Victron system',  but I could be wrong.

 

Then you have not been reading a number of battery and charging threads, but I agree the OP has been very opaque in his request. What he considers a system we are not privy to.

 

For a start, study this site https://www.victronenergy.com/

 

If you study the Lithium battery threads, you will quickly see that Victron market a number of items that talk to each other, and a smartphone, to provide the necessary functionality for safe Lithium battery monitoring and charging from automotive (like we tend to use) alternators. Then you can add a Victron battery charger or a Victron Combi-inverter/charger. Victron also do similar for lead acid batteries nowadays.

 

As they can now all talk to each other and your smartphone, then any number of different combinations of individual items can be described as a system. It is just a pity the OP did not specify what they wanted and clarified if they really did want a chap called Antone of if t was a mistype/autocorrect mistake.

 

 

 

 

[LadyG]

53 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Then you have not been reading a number of battery and charging threads, but I agree the OP has been very opaque in his request. What he considers a system we are not privy to.

 

For a start, study this site https://www.victronenergy.com/

 

If you study the Lithium battery threads, you will quickly see that Victron market a number of items that talk to each other, and a smartphone, to provide the necessary functionality for safe Lithium battery monitoring and charging from automotive (like we tend to use) alternators. Then you can add a Victron battery charger or a Victron Combi-inverter/charger. Victron also do similar for lead acid batteries nowadays.

 

As they can now all talk to each other and your smartphone, then any number of different combinations of individual items can be described as a system. It is just a pity the OP did not specify what they wanted and clarified if they really did want a chap called Antone of if t was a mistype/autocorrect mistake.

 

 

 

 

If someone feels rhe need to talk to tbeir bstteries they have my sympathy

[Tony Brooks]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

If someone feels rhe need to talk to tbeir bstteries they have my sympathy

 

It is not so much talking, but monitoring, especially when they are remote from the boat so they can see what is happening when they are not there. One recent thread involving someone trying to help and aged and somewhat infirm friend has found the ability of Victron kit to send data to a tablet/smartphone very useful in ensuring the friend's system is now working as it should. The fact the various bits of kit can communicate with each other makes lithium charging far easier than before they could.

[LadyG]

Yes Tony, i am aware of technology, just injecting a bit of humour, and a bump. 

I have a lithium battery in my phone, and thats where its staying.

 

 

Edited February 9, 2025 by LadyG

[MtB]

56 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Yes Tony, i am aware of technology, just injecting a bit of humour, and a bump. 

I have a lithium battery in my phone, and thats where its staying.

 

 

 

 

The complexities of lithium control have been conquered and hidden from the consumer in phones to the degree that end users don't need to do ANYTHING beyond using them. No understanding beyond whether they are flat or fully charged is needed. 

 

This degree of design sophistication will eventually arrive for boats and motorhomes too I suspect, but probably not for another 10 or 20 years. In the meantime, quite a high degree of understanding is needed to use lithium successfully in a boat or motorhome. 

 

[matty40s]

5 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

 

This degree of design sophistication will eventually arrive for boats and motorhomes too I suspect, but probably not for another 10 or 20 years. In the meantime, quite a high degree of understanding is needed to use lithium successfully in a boat or motorhome. 

 

Its here already Mike,  the high degree of understanding is in the installation, once complete with the correct kit, it's pretty much leave alone just occasionally monitoring with mobile.

[MtB]

2 minutes ago, matty40s said:

Its here already Mike,  the high degree of understanding is in the installation, once complete with the correct kit, it's pretty much leave alone just occasionally monitoring with mobile.

 

 

True.

 

But it isn't a 'black box' system yet. 

 

Once yer average bod with a degree in sociology not engineering can buy a kit, bolt it into a boat, turn it on and it "just works", we'll be there. 

 

 

 

[IanD]

2 hours ago, MtB said:

 

True.

 

But it isn't a 'black box' system yet. 

 

Once yer average bod with a degree in sociology not engineering can buy a kit, bolt it into a boat, turn it on and it "just works", we'll be there. 

 

 

Your average bod already can do exactly that if he's willing to spend enough money on the proper gear (e.g. from Victron) -- everything (including solar, battery monitoring, inverter, shunts, control, alternator, router...) just connects up and works. Examples and schematics of what is needed to do this are freely available on the Victron website, along with loads of free help and advice on the community forum.

 

The problem is that people don't want to do this, they want to cobble together the cheapest possible kit from different/no-name manufacturers and leave out anything that costs money but is really needed to make the whole system reliable and idiot-proof... 😞

Edited February 9, 2025 by IanD

[cuthound]

2 hours ago, MtB said:

 

 

True.

 

But it isn't a 'black box' system yet. 

 

Once yer average bod with a degree in sociology not engineering can buy a kit, bolt it into a boat, turn it on and it "just works", we'll be there. 

 

 

 

 

Judging by the number of new posters with battery problems, I don't think we are there for lead acids yet, and they have been around since Noah had his Ark (almost).

[LadyG]

My agm LA s are struggling to charge up, I think its mostly lack of sun over last two months, things can only get better ......

No sign of @Billy123 

 

[matty40s]

4 hours ago, cuthound said:

 

Judging by the number of new posters with battery problems, I don't think we are there for lead acids yet, and they have been around since Noah had his Ark (almost).

He only put them in two by two, nowadays people want 600aH and zigglyquantum flux drives so its come on a bit...

[Alan de Enfield]

24 minutes ago, LadyG said:

My agm LA s are struggling to charge up, I think its mostly lack of sun over last two months,

 

Have you tried running the engine for 3 or 4 hours each day ?

 

If you leave then partly discharged then you never will get them to hold a full charge and you'll be buying new ones PDQ

[MtB]

54 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Have you tried running the engine for 3 or 4 hours each day ?

 

If you leave then partly discharged then you never will get them to hold a full charge and you'll be buying new ones PDQ

 

LadyG seems to think all you need to do is talk to them....

 

Did you not see her post yesterday saying so! 

 

 

 

[LadyG]

3 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

LadyG seems to think all you need to do is talk to them....

 

Did you not see her post yesterday saying so! 

 

 

 

I have been here long enough to know the engine needs to be run for hours, and I have been doing so, ty.

 

Edited February 9, 2025 by LadyG

[Alan de Enfield]

41 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I have been here long enough to know the engine needs to be run for hours, and I have been doing so, ty.

 

 

Then, if your batteries are not charging -  you have a problem, either the alternator is not working or the batteries are about ready to die (and leave you with no leccy)

[Tony Brooks]

54 minutes ago, LadyG said:

I have been here long enough to know the engine needs to be run for hours, and I have been doing so, ty.

 

 

Are you able to tell us charging current and voltage at 1200 rpm+ very soon after the firs start of the day and then again just before you shut it down? That should give an idea about the alternator

[LadyG]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

Are you able to tell us charging current and voltage at 1200 rpm+ very soon after the firs start of the day and then again just before you shut it down? That should give an idea about the alternator

Well, it only a 70amp alternator and i can't really answer the questions, I think I can get the bow batteries charging at 13.65 , is that the charging current or the voltage? Its an LED panel.    There is no way I can access any of the batteries direct on the posts. 

I just compare readings with what they arecwhen they are getting a bit of solar to top up the engine. 

 

 

I usually charge am, but its been so dark recently  ive been using my LED reading lamp in the afternoon,  so ive ve boosted them in the afternoon too.

Then by 18,00 they are about 12.60, , and now it's 21.30 they are at 12.51 I expect they will be 12,4 by morning.

The bow batteries have the water pump, and they charge my reading lamp, and my phone, and my tablet via a USB

I try to charge phone and tablet when engine is running.

I'll run the engine tomorrow am, taking note of reading at 09.00, then when I've charged up my tablet and phone a and lamp, 

The stern batteries don't have  led. I don't see that they do much work. The starter battery seems OK.

Anyway, I can't do much about it, I shouldn't have mentioned it!

I'm thinking about buying a battery operated camping lamp, and just buy a few more batteries, not rechargeable batteries, lol.

 

 

I think another problem this week is that it is very dark here both day and night.

Ive often moored up where it is well lit, but at the moment there no street lighting, no houses.

The valley is very steep so the sun rises late and disappears about 3.00pm.

Ive got my fairy lights on pretty much 12 hours per day, they use AA bstteries, not rechsrgeable....

 

Edited February 9, 2025 by LadyG

[Tony Brooks]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Well, it only a 70amp alternator and i can't really answer the questions, I think I can get the bow batteries charging at 13.65 , is that the charging current or the voltage? Its an LED panel.    There is no way I can access any of the batteries direct on the posts. 

I just compare readings with what they arecwhen they are getting a bit of solar to top up the engine. 

 

1. it is not typical for solar to be used to top up the engine start battery, if that is what you mean, unless a VSR is involved.

 

2. Just saying 13.65 without a unit (it is actually volts) and without any reference to how long the engine had been running is no use in diagnosis - and that assumes the LED panel is fairly accurate. If it is soon after starting, it is likely (but not definitely) to mean the batteries are tolerably well charged and the alternator is probably OK. If it is after several/many hours running, it suggests that the alternator probably has a blown diode or a phase failing

 

10 minutes ago, LadyG said:

There is no way I can access any of the batteries direct on the posts. 

 

That is why you really need battery monitoring, but with your very idiosyncratic system you probably need more than one, and they usually show accurate amps as well as volts. Or you could have a pair of leads with fuses fitted that terminate in a convenient place so you can take the voltage readings of each bank.

 

12 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Then by 18,00 they are about 12.60, , and now it's 21.30 they are at 12.51 I expect they will be 12,4 by morning.

 

12 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Then by 18,00 they are about 12.60, , and now it's 21.30 they are at 12.51 I expect they will be 12,4 by morning.

 

Assuming those are rested voltage or voltages taken with very minor current flowing then they are not too bad EXCEPT 12.6 volts is not that much over half charged. Probably more charging time is required. 12.5V is about a true 75% charged, but taking the 50% rule to maximise battery cyclic life, consider it half charged. 12.4 volts is still over a true 50% charged, so practically consider it to show still a bit over the maximum discharge, which would be 12.2 to 12.3 volts.

 

 

I think it is a lack of engine running time @1200 rpm+ at this time of year. After a very few hours, the charge will only be a few amps.

 

To maximise the effect of solar I would suggest doing the engine charging later in the day, especially in winter, in winter you may need more tome than that allows.

[LadyG]

OK, I thought I should be mainly charging a.m., but I think that applies when solar can trickle for eight hours, so I'll start again with a " short hour" a.m. to charge up tablet etc, then top up in the afternoon and make this my mainstay. 

I tend to start the engine charging on what I assume is about 1200 rpm, then after 35 minutes then i have it on minimum revs for 35 minutes.

I have three battery isolators, all charge together. i turn the starter one off after 30 mins to make sure I dont forget, so I am not running it down during the day. Engine starts OK with it, I had a decent capacity fitted.

I can see that sometimes one set of domestics are lower than the other, but I leave both on to change together, they seem to top up together OK.

No way am I going to change the set up, its just too quirky, apart from the intermittent fail on the car radio, it all works.

I found twin thin cable yesterday, in a locker,  it's live, so ive just put it back where it was, but with the bare ends well apart,  I'll need to find my insulating tape!

 

 

Edited February 9, 2025 by LadyG