Best Stern for Single Handed

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

No I’m not, I’m basing it on what I see out on the canals with single boaters and the boats they have. Not couples and weekend boaters. Most single handed people have trad stern, the OP can have whatever he wants. It would be interesting to know all those recommending cruiser sterns are they single handed or couples?

 

 

This is true. I refered up thread to my similar observations from when we boated.

 

However Ive also seen single handers working cruisers and semis. So obviously some find it suits them for whatever reason?

 

The curve ball for me is the OP's dog. A semi trad in that case, may just may be a better choice, just may.

 

Which is why hiring a trad with his dog to see how it works out is still the next best step. It has to work for him (and his dog of course) not anybody else.

[enigmatic]

On 20/05/2023 at 17:50, M_JG said:

 

Trads with very wide sliding hatches and more space up top can be had but they are not very common.

 

(Not sure about hiring one though).

I think this is the answer to "best type of stern" period, but especially for single handers. Even once saw a boat for sale that had a full width sliding hatch with a normal size trad hatch built into it, so you could have a semi trad or trad to suit the guests/weather you had to deal with, but I think if you wanted one of them you'd be better off speaking to boatbuilders than browsing for sale listings!

 

As a singlehander I'm quite glad of the extra space my semi trad offers on the few days a year I take friends or family out, but the inside storage space and extra insulation of a trad would be better the rest of the time.

A tonneau cover left partly covering a semi trad stern can provide some of the trad's weather protection (and unlike pram hoods, it's safe to take under bridges)

[Tony Brooks]

2 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

I think this is the answer to "best type of stern" period, but especially for single handers. Even once saw a boat for sale that had a full width sliding hatch with a normal size trad hatch built into it, so you could have a semi trad or trad to suit the guests/weather you had to deal with, but I think if you wanted one of them you'd be better off speaking to boatbuilders than browsing for sale listings!

 

As a singlehander I'm quite glad of the extra space my semi trad offers on the few days a year I take friends or family out, but the inside storage space and extra insulation of a trad would be better the rest of the time.

A tonneau cover left partly covering a semi trad stern can provide some of the trad's weather protection (and unlike pram hoods, it's safe to take under bridges)

 

Once again, I am going to put a contrary point.  JennyB at 54ft has no forepeak as such, just a very small chain locker right at the front, and the well deck side seats could only fit two side by side, as long as they were not portly. The cruise stern deck was shorter than many comparable boats. The upshot is that we had as much internal space as a 58ft cruiser stern, plus the engine the other side of the rear bulkhead. Once you allow space for the engine inside the cabin, I think that you would find the same on a trad. It is all about the design, not the stern type.

[Captain Pegg]

12 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

 

I would dispute that, I manage to do it perfectly well on my trad stern. It probably depends on the combination of tiller length and belly size.

 

My boat also came with suicide seats but I never sit on them whilst underway. I have often been known to sit on them whilst moored up and chatting to someone on the boat behind me. 

I’m amazed you are the only person that seems to have picked that up. Most folk probably rolled their eyes at the little spat and scrolled past the detail of the posts.

 

I’ve never seen a trad stern where you can’t stand in front of the arc of the tiller. The place that’s specifically provided for standing to steer is in front of the arc of the tiller. Obviously you can’t legislate for those folk that stand outside the hatch - and unfortunately they do exist - but I’m guessing @IanD may never have steered a trad.

[Lily Rose]

Actually I do manage to stand (just) outside the hatch and still get the tiller behind my back. If I couldn't then I would move forward slightly or look to replace the tiller with one slightly shorter. I can put my tiller on in two positions as there are two holes for the tiller pin. Less than two inches apart but the shorter position is usually fine, the other is better if I want to stand just inside with the hatch pulled forward for protection from cold, rain etc

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, Lily Rose said:

 

I would dispute that, I manage to do it perfectly well on my trad stern. It probably depends on the combination of tiller length and belly size.

 

My boat also came with suicide seats but I never sit on them whilst underway. I have often been known to sit on them whilst moored up and chatting to someone on the boat behind me. 

 

Completely unsure where that notion came from, I havent ever steered a trad personally but from the boats we looked at which were trads I'm pretty sure I could have steered one without being in the tiller arc.

 

 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

With a name like Rocket Ron, I expect the OP will be wizzing around the system when he can. 
Therefore another vote for a traditional stern.
You don’t wanna be boating through the winter unless you can at least keep half yourself dry and warm tucked up in the hatch. 
 

[Roper]

2 minutes ago, Goliath said:

With a name like Rocket Ron, I expect the OP will be wizzing around the system when he can. 
Therefore another vote for a traditional stern.
You don’t wanna be boating through the winter unless you can at least keep half yourself dry and warm tucked up in the hatch. 
 

Named after a racehorse that my friends and I would put a few shillings on a while ago when i registered with the site, unfortunately can't seem to change user name now. My mid-late life crisis has me getting the urge to go slower rathrr than faster.

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Just now, Rocket Rob said:

Named after a racehorse that my friends and I would put a few shillings on a while ago when i registered with the site, unfortunately can't seem to change user name now. My mid-late life crisis has me getting the urge to go slower rathrr than faster.

I’ve met a few ‘Rocket Rons’.  
 

Rocket Rob’s a good name 👍

 

No such thing as a mid life crisis. 🤷‍♀️ 

What you mean is you’ve realised you’ve been working your ass off for years when you should be enjoying life. And now you wanna change the balance. 
It’s a short life matey, go for it (with a trad stern of course)

 

I think a trad stern with one suicide seat would be ideal. 
If you have that unwanted guest you can always bump ‘em off. 

[ditchcrawler]

16 minutes ago, Goliath said:

With a name like Rocket Ron, I expect the OP will be wizzing around the system when he can. 
Therefore another vote for a traditional stern.
You don’t wanna be boating through the winter unless you can at least keep half yourself dry and warm tucked up in the hatch. 
 

Rocket Ron use to, moored at Braunston, a true boatman. the op is rocket Rob

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

Just now, ditchcrawler said:

Rocket Ron use to, moored at Braunston, a true boatman. the op is rocket Rob

Ha yes, I see my mistake. 
Getting me Robs and Rins all a mix

[cheesegas]

8 hours ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

How many who are saying cruiser stern is best actually live full time on a cruiser stern Narrowboat and that’s Narrow not widebeam, as the OP is talking Narrowboat, totally different from a 12ft widebeam cruiser stern?

  

I have a 45’ cruiser, boat sat a trad before buying, much prefer cruiser. 
 

Easy access from both ends of the boat is handy for awkward solo moorings, no having to open a slide and then climb over the engine housing. Trad engine room on a 45’ takes up too much space. If I can’t run down the gunnels, it’s faster to nip through the boat. 
 

You do lose inside storage space but you gain outside space - I use it for locking bikes to the rails, eating in summer, fixing dirty stuff I don’t want to have inside on a table in all weathers. And of course storage of outdoor stuff, buckets etc. 
 

I think it’s about the same level of ease to get on and off when mooring, the only drawback is that it’s a bit of a pain to reach over the rail to get to the stern mooring studs. Can be cold in winter but I’ve never had a problem if appropriately dressed, and being a cc’er I cruise year round. 
 

I never have any water in the engine bay after heavy rain, Liverpool boats tend to have big gutters and no drain pipes that get clogged. 
 

I also have a rear mounted gas locker against the bulkhead which is easy to lift bottles out of, and it forms a handy step to get up on to the roof, I’ve put anti slip on it. 

Edited May 21, 2023 by cheesegas

[enigmatic]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

Once again, I am going to put a contrary point.  JennyB at 54ft has no forepeak as such, just a very small chain locker right at the front, and the well deck side seats could only fit two side by side, as long as they were not portly. The cruise stern deck was shorter than many comparable boats. The upshot is that we had as much internal space as a 58ft cruiser stern, plus the engine the other side of the rear bulkhead. Once you allow space for the engine inside the cabin, I think that you would find the same on a trad. It is all about the design, not the stern type.

 

Well yeah the bow space matters too (tugs always look like a waste to me, but I guess others love a flat deck to sit on!) and internal layout matters as much as the  length of cabin, and some of that's subjective: some people think an engine room and back cabin is the best use of internal space on the entire boat and some people would rather have a Pullman diner, a massive kitchen or a big empty space to fill with sofa!

 

Was JennyB your last boat? Actually shared a few locks with the chap who bought it a year or two back (we had a conversation about boat electrics and he mentioned "the previous owner is apparently quite well known in narrowboating circles for advising people on that sort of thing but I'm still none the wiser!) Still looked very tidy.

[Tony Brooks]

12 minutes ago, enigmatic said:

 

Well yeah the bow space matters too (tugs always look like a waste to me, but I guess others love a flat deck to sit on!) and internal layout matters as much as the  length of cabin, and some of that's subjective: some people think an engine room and back cabin is the best use of internal space on the entire boat and some people would rather have a Pullman diner, a massive kitchen or a big empty space to fill with sofa!

 

Was JennyB your last boat? Actually shared a few locks with the chap who bought it a year or two back (we had a conversation about boat electrics and he mentioned "the previous owner is apparently quite well known in narrowboating circles for advising people on that sort of thing but I'm still none the wiser!) Still looked very tidy.

 

Yes. good to know it looked OK, I hand painted it out if the open durin 2018. Sold late 2019.

 

I agree that it is all down to personal preference, so that is what I have been trying to point out to the OP. Other people's opinions are just that, opinion, not hard facts. I know that I would have had to give the boat up sooner if the gas bottles were in the forepeak.

[nb Innisfree]

Possibly the greatest time danger is in reverse, hand on morse control lever, moment of lack of concentration and you hit something like end of lock or canal bank, topple over the stern and two things are likely to happen, firstly you will try to hang on to, the tiller and morse control handle, already in reverse so full throttle will be applied as steerer hangs on, if they do go in a grisly end is inevitable, unless a crew member is quick enough to select neutral or forward. 

 

It's happened before and will, sadly, happen again. Folk should be aware that canal boating is a safe pastime but with moments of great danger. 

Edited May 21, 2023 by nb Innisfree

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, nb Innisfree said:

Possibly the greatest time danger is in reverse, hand on morse control lever, moment of lack of concentration and you hit something like end of lock or canal bank, topple over the stern and two things you will try to hang on to, the tiller and morse control handle, already in reverse so full throttle will be applied as steerer hangs on, if they do go in a grisly end is inevitable, unless a crew member is quick enough to select neutral or forward. 

 

It's happened before and will, sadly, happen again. 

 

I once witnessed a girl drop off the back of a boat at Fradley junction. The boat was moving forward at the time. But on seeing the girl had fallen in the idiot on the tiller actually engaged reverse and started to move back towards her.

 

I actually could not get a warning shout out of my mouth but thankfully he realised I think and stopped before the boat hit her or she had body parts removed by the prop.

 

Ok the rudder may have provided some protection but honestly...

Edited May 21, 2023 by M_JG

[haggis]

Just a thought on dog on board. With a semi trad, if there is a door across the gap the dog would be safe on deck with you.  Our boat is a trad and although our dog would like to lie on the stern, she has fallen in a couple of times and we now discourage that. She will often lie inside just in front of whoever is steerings feet but if the engine speed changes ( lock coming up) she will often get up. We solved the problem by buying a cheap thing for hanging washing from a caravan window and removing bits which just left a lightweight metal grill which just happened to be the width of the door into the cabin.. We hook it onto a couple of small hooks and the dog is quite happy to lie on the cabin floor in front of it. She is safe there and can see us if she wishes. 

[Snakey]

As a full time single-hander, can I suggest that your centreline needs to be well longer than half the length of your boat - I run 17 metres of centreline on a 57ft boat and its just about right for the L&L swing bridges.   For the same reason, make sure you have easy access to the bow stud from either gunwhale or front doorway.  The stern type wouldn't seem to be particularly important beyond possibly for easier access.  

[MtB]

1 hour ago, enigmatic said:

Well yeah the bow space matters too (tugs always look like a waste to me, but I guess others love a flat deck to sit on!)

 

 

Tug decks are AMAZING in narrow locks. It never ceases to delight me to be able to just walk straight across the boat. 

 

 

[Col_T]

Do you have a trampoline for when the lock is empty??

[enigmatic]

9 minutes ago, MtB said:

Tug decks are AMAZING in narrow locks. It never ceases to delight me to be able to just walk straight across the boat. 

Only time I've ever had difficulty stepping across my regular bow was when I forgot that I'd left the anchor out on it 

1 minute ago, Col_T said:

Do you have a trampoline for when the lock is empty??

This is actually a brilliant idea I now want to see someone on YouTube try. Would need to be a tug to have enough space, I think

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

1 minute ago, Col_T said:

Do you have a trampoline for when the lock is empty??

 

1 minute ago, Col_T said:

Do you have a trampoline for when the lock is empty??

Thought similar 

 

Meanwhile when you're not doing locks what’s that space used for ?

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

11 minutes ago, Snakey said:

As a full time single-hander, can I suggest that your centreline needs to be well longer than half the length of your boat - I run 17 metres of centreline on a 57ft boat and its just about right for the L&L swing bridges.   For the same reason, make sure you have easy access to the bow stud from either gunwhale or front doorway.  The stern type wouldn't seem to be particularly important beyond possibly for easier access.  

Not the best advise for centre line length, most boaters don’t have their centre line that long. I have it a little longer than my rear hatch, but not long enough if it went into the water while moving it would foul the prop.

 I always use my front/centre and rear lines to hand ball my boat through the LL swing bridges while single handed.

 

[MtB]

5 minutes ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

but not long enough if it went into if you dropped it into the water while moving it would foul the prop.

 

FTFY! 

 

 

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Goliath said:

 

Thought similar 

 

Meanwhile when you're not doing locks what’s that space used for ?

 

They make good skating rinks when its frosty....

 

DAMHIKN.