Help! Need someone to diagnose and fix interior bilge flooding - Calcutt area

[Canal Cuttings]

Hi, 

After several years successfully operating our 1990s ex-Hire Boat in a consortium, we recently bought it outright.

 

Our first visit of the season to fill the water tank resulted in the whole tank, overnight, emptying into the rear cabin.  Having dried out the area and replaced some of the plumbing joints, it appears the water is coming UP from the cabin bilge, from source unknown.  We ripped out the sodden carpets and found an access trapdoor that had probably not been opened for decades.  The shallow cabin bilge had filled to the top, touched the floor panels and soaked through them.  The water is clean.

 

The bilge does not fill with an empty water tank.  When the tank is filled, the water pump runs constantly, suggesting water is exiting even though every tap and outlet has been checked.  The bilge noticeably fills over a period of 10-20 minutes. With the pump off, we still think the bilge is filling slowly, but cannot be sure. We were under the impression that all our pipes ran above floor level, and the limited central heating consists of pipes running around the skirting, covered by kick panels.

 

We need someone in the area to diagnose and fix the problem.  Calcutt Marina themselves are overworked/understaffed at present.  The boat is at the junction of the Grand Union and Oxford canals. (Daventry/Rugby/Leamington Spa area).  Any advice?  

 

(We will later need someone to replace our rear fibreboard floor panels and lay flooring!)

 

Stephen and Alice

 

[ditchcrawler]

1 minute ago, Canal Cuttings said:

Hi, 

After several years successfully operating our 1990s ex-Hire Boat in a consortium, we recently bought it outright.

 

Our first visit of the season to fill the water tank resulted in the whole tank, overnight, emptying into the rear cabin.  Having dried out the area and replaced some of the plumbing joints, it appears the water is coming UP from the cabin bilge, from source unknown.  We ripped out the sodden carpets and found an access trapdoor that had probably not been opened for decades.  The shallow cabin bilge had filled to the top, touched the floor panels and soaked through them.  The water is clean.

 

The bilge does not fill with an empty water tank.  When the tank is filled, the water pump runs constantly, suggesting water is exiting even though every tap and outlet has been checked.  The bilge noticeably fills over a period of 10-20 minutes. With the pump off, we still think the bilge is filling slowly, but cannot be sure. We were under the impression that all our pipes ran above floor level, and the limited central heating consists of pipes running around the skirting, covered by kick panels.

 

We need someone in the area to diagnose and fix the problem.  Calcutt Marina themselves are overworked/understaffed at present.  The boat is at the junction of the Grand Union and Oxford canals. (Daventry/Rugby/Leamington Spa area).  Any advice?  

 

(We will later need someone to replace our rear fibreboard floor panels and lay flooring!)

 

Stephen and Alice

 

Have you checked the pump its self for leaks and the calorifier and its pressure relief valve, main culprits. If it had no heat over winter the calorifier could have failed if not drained down.

[Canal Cuttings]

The water pump is in a plastic tray and is definitely not leaking.  Not sure of the location of our calorifier - in the engine bilge or cabin?

Thanks for the advice.

[Tracy D'arth]

9 minutes ago, Canal Cuttings said:

Not sure of the location of our calorifier - in the engine bilge or cabin?

 

Only you can know!  Its a big cylinder, surely you have seen it?

[Jerra]

3 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

Only you can know!  Its a big cylinder, surely you have seen it?

This   ^^^^^^

 

I was basically going to say look for something you mistake for a domestic hot water tank!

[rusty69]

33 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Have you checked the pump its self for leaks and the calorifier and its pressure relief valve, main culprits. If it had no heat over winter the calorifier could have failed if not drained down.

^^^^^ What he said. Or a speed fit plastic pipe fitting has pushed apart somewhere if the pipes froze over winter.

Edited May 19, 2023 by rusty69

[Hudds Lad]

 

Other colours/rotations are available

[magnetman]

I reckon a plastic hose fitting has come adrift somewhere between domestic pump and tap outlets. 

"Having dried out the area and replaced some of the plumbing joints..."

 

This is interesting. Why did you do that?

[David Mack]

41 minutes ago, Canal Cuttings said:

We need someone in the area to diagnose and fix the problem. 

Anyone diagnosing the problem will have to follow all your pipework until they find a leak. That might involve removing panelling or flooring or dismantling furniture if the pipework has been boxed in. You should be able to do this for yourself, and it will be a lot cheaper. A leak this size will not be hard to find.

[Canal Cuttings]

10 minutes ago, magnetman said:

I reckon a plastic hose fitting has come adrift somewhere between domestic pump and tap outlets. 

"Having dried out the area and replaced some of the plumbing joints..."

 

This is interesting. Why did you do that?

The under-bunk area at the back had obviously been damp for a long time.  It was mouldy and about 2cm deep in water.  As there were numerous plastic joints in several pipes running under the bunk, above floor level, it suggested that they had been leaking.  Now the area is dry (drier...) we can see that the leak does not come from there.

9 minutes ago, David Mack said:

Anyone diagnosing the problem will have to follow all your pipework until they find a leak. That might involve removing panelling or flooring or dismantling furniture if the pipework has been boxed in. You should be able to do this for yourself, and it will be a lot cheaper. A leak this size will not be hard to find.

I started to work on the plumbing, but the following day found I had seriously damaged my back, and am now reliant on hired hands!

I now need a pro to help!

[Pie Eater]

You could put some food dye in your water tank and trace the leak that way.

[Canal Cuttings]

Suggested this to my wife, but we could not agree on the colour! 🙄

Glad to hear it is a sensible suggestion.  I would need to co-ordinate the search though - I'm pretty sure it starts in the water tank and ends up in the back of the cabin bilge, but harder to spot why.

[Lady M]

On most boats a water leak will naturally run towards the back.

[philjw]

If you really need to pay someone to look for the leak then ask at Calcutt Boats. They have a range of people who do various boat related tasks. However it would be worthwhile following the pipework from the tank via the pump and on into the cabin. The pipes may well be hidden behind the fit out. Look for a disconnected fitting as suggested above as it sounds like a major leak.

[Slim]

1 hour ago, Canal Cuttings said:

Hi, 

After several years successfully operating our 1990s ex-Hire Boat in a consortium, we recently bought it outright.

 

Our first visit of the season to fill the water tank resulted in the whole tank, overnight, emptying into the rear cabin.  Having dried out the area and replaced some of the plumbing joints, it appears the water is coming UP from the cabin bilge, from source unknown.  We ripped out the sodden carpets and found an access trapdoor that had probably not been opened for decades.  The shallow cabin bilge had filled to the top, touched the floor panels and soaked through them.  The water is clean.

 

The bilge does not fill with an empty water tank.  When the tank is filled, the water pump runs constantly, suggesting water is exiting even though every tap and outlet has been checked.  The bilge noticeably fills over a period of 10-20 minutes. With the pump off, we still think the bilge is filling slowly, but cannot be sure. We were under the impression that all our pipes ran above floor level, and the limited central heating consists of pipes running around the skirting, covered by kick panels.

 

We need someone in the area to diagnose and fix the problem.  Calcutt Marina themselves are overworked/understaffed at present.  The boat is at the junction of the Grand Union and Oxford canals. (Daventry/Rugby/Leamington Spa area).  Any advice?  

 

(We will later need someone to replace our rear fibreboard floor panels and lay flooring!)

 

Stephen and Alice

 

If you're looking for professional help pop into Wigrams Turn. Ask for Georgina. She may very well be able to point you in the right direction. 

[Tonka]

Try Russel Fincham Marine services. He is based in Southam and used to work for Calcutt

[Lily Rose]

3 hours ago, Canal Cuttings said:

Not sure of the location of our calorifier - in the engine bilge or cabin?

 

Have you looked under the bed? It's often located there in a horizontal position.

 

Mine isn't though, it's vertical and located to one side of the engine but mostly hidden behind boards. I always feel this is the most vulnerable part of the system in winter on my boat as it is located above the water line (so not protected by the relatively warm unfrozen water outside) and all my attempts to empty it before winter have met with failure. For this reason I always leave a thermostat-controlled tube heater under it in winter. 

 

If yours is located like mine then it would empty into the engine bilge, not the cabin bilge. I suppose that could overflow back into the cabin bilge if there was enough water but much of the engine would be under water before that could happen.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Lily Rose

[Arthur Marshall]

4 hours ago, Canal Cuttings said:

The water pump is in a plastic tray and is definitely not leaking.  Not sure of the location of our calorifier - in the engine bilge or cabin?

Thanks for the advice.

Not all boats have a calorifier. Were they common features on the '90s hire boats?

Edited May 19, 2023 by Arthur Marshall

[Lady M]

I certainly remember hire boats with airing cupboards.  However, I think the water was probably heated by an Alde not by the engine.  

[Canal Cuttings]

We do have a Paloma water heater as well.

 

I'm pretty sure we have searched most places above the floor to find the leak.

Following up your tip-offs, we may now have someone to professionally fix it, who already knows our boat from the past!

[GUMPY]

3 minutes ago, Canal Cuttings said:

We do have a Paloma water heater as well.

Check round this very carefully they are easily damaged by frost. As you have one it's unlikely you will have a calorifier

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, Loddon said:

Check round this very carefully they are easily damaged by frost. As you have one it's unlikely you will have a calorifier

For the record, we have both, but agree, they are easily damaged if not drained, as they sit quite high up.

 

Easy to drain though, as a lot of them have an external drain plug.

 

A leak from the paloma would also be pretty obvious.

Edited May 19, 2023 by rusty69

[GUMPY]

1 minute ago, rusty69 said:

For the record, we have both,

But you are an exception,  contrary, odd, awkward, bonkers.

Delete the ones that don't fit 

[MtB]

17 minutes ago, Canal Cuttings said:

We do have a Paloma water heater as well.

 

It is very unlikely for there to be both a Paloma AND a cauliflower. 

 

 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, MtB said:

 

It is very unlikely for there to be both a Paloma AND a cauliflower. 

 

 

Well.........